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HomeMy WebLinkAbout04-15-2009-Doc15855 (2) D ~ ~ • • MINUTE S BUDGET & FINANCE CONIIVIITTEE April 15, 2009 A meeting of the Budget & Finance Committee of the Council of the County of Kaua`i, State of Hawai`i, was called to order by Councilmember Daryl W. Kaneshiro, Chair, at the Historic County Building, Room 201, Lihu`e, Kaua`i, on Wednesday, April 15, 2009, at 9:40 a.m., after which the following members answered the call of the roll: Honorable Bill "Kaipo" Asing Honorable Tim Bynum Honorable Jay Furfaro Honorable Daryl W. Kaneshiro Honorable Lani T. Kawahara Honorable Derek S. K. Kawakami EXCUSED: Honorable Dickie Chang Minutes of the April 1, 2009 Budget & Finance Committee Meeting. Upon motion duly made by Councilmember Kawakami, seconded by Councilmember Asing, and unanimously carried, the Minutes of the April 1, 2009 Budget & Finance Committee Meeting was approved. The Committee proceeded on its agenda item as follows: Bill No. 2305 AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE NO. B-2008-673 AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE CAPITAL BUDGET OF THE COUNTY OF KAUA`I, STATE OF HAWAI`I, FOR THE FISCAL YEAR, JULY l, 2008 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2009, BY REVISING THE SURPLUS AND APPROPRIATIONS ESTIMATED IN THE PUBLIC ACCESS FUND (Appropriation of $1.85 million from the Public Access Fund to Black Pot Beach Park Expansion-Land Acquisition) [This item was deferred.] DARYL W. KANESHIRO, Budget & Finance Committee Chair: Thank you. Do we have anyone in the chambers that wanted to speak on this item this morning? Anyone here? Mr. Mickens. There being no objections, the rules were suspended. GLENN MICKENS: Thank you, Daryl. For the record Glenn Mickens. I...I just want to...once again, I said it before, but I just want to compliment these people, the Open Space people, for the hard work they do to be able to go out and find land that can be held in perpetuity for this island. I know it's a lot of work. I also made this statement and I'll reiterate what I said. I do hope that we have in place to be able to maintain these properties and don't let them go down the drain. I didn't hear yesterday at the public works budget hearing, I didn't hear that they were asking for any more labor to be able to look after these facilities. But again, I 1 • • ~ A f~ do hope we...we can do that because I think these people are doing a tremendous service for us, not just the oceans, the lands down there, but the mauka side too. So I want to...appreciate that. Thank you. Mr. Kaneshiro: Thank you, Glenn. Any questions for Glenn Mickens. If not, do we have anyone else who wanted to speak on this item? Please come up. JENNIFER LUCK, Kaua`i Public Land Trust: Good morning, Councilmember. Jennifer Luck, Kaua`i Public Land Trust. Mr. Kaneshiro: Good morning. Ms. Luck: Good morning. I just did want to clarify one thing before you begin. I know at the public hearing we heard testimony from Mr. Michael Sheehan, and so if I could I wanted to take a few minutes to just run through the history of the Land Trust dealings with him and...and why our priority for expanding the Black Pot Park changed from acquiring his land first to the Hodge parcel. Mr. Kaneshiro: Okay. . Mr. Furfaro: May I say something, Mr. Chairman, before we get into that dialogue? Mr. Kaneshiro: All right, Mr. Furfaro. Mr. Furfaro: It's very important as I think Mr. Mickens came up and gave the appropriate lauding to the Land Trust, but also this is an effort on the county's part as well especially dealing with people that are on the Public Land Trust. I would also like to say that I hoped that the county would be in a position, after testimony from Mr. Sheehan, that we would be pursuing a friendly I condemnation if we do pursue purchasing his property. So I'want to just caution us ~ all that we don't give a history that might inflame any possibilities of all of us , coming out with a satisfactory negotiation. So if I can just share that and caution ' you as well, Jennifer, so. Ms. Luck: Okay. We...we did originally try to secure funding to purchase Mr. Sheehan's lot. At the time the Land Trust and Mr. Sheehan were unable to agree on a purchase price for the property. So when Mr. Hodge enerously came forward and was willing to do a bargain sale on his property ~700,000 less than the appraised value, we did make a str'ategic decision at that point to try to acquire his property instead and in addition the urgency surrounding his property because there...he had already obtained building permits on the property and was willing to give us a couple of months to raise funds, but obviously he would commence building on the property if we didn't raise the moneys within, you know, about six months or so. So that was somewhat Awhat went behind our decision to go towards the Hodge parcel first. Mr. Kaneshiro: Mr. Furfaro, you have a question? Mr. Furfaro: And again, Jennifer, I just needed to say that because it is not necessarily the Land Trust that is negotiating with Mr. Sheehan only. The possibility does exist that it might be our county attorney's office that eventually looks at a direct acquisition there. We, you know, we are all subject to 2 ' s' • • the county coming up with a presentation of a master plan. The other difference here...does the Land Trust have in its possession a document that references the acknow acknowledged values of those lands and actually signed by Mr. Sheehan? Does the Land Trust have that in your possession? Ms. Luck: No, we have a...no, that purchase agreement was not signed with Mr. Sheehan. Correct, sir. ` Mr. Furfaro: That answers my question. Thank you. Mr. Kaneshiro: Any other questions? Lani, you have a question? Ms. Kawahara: I just wanted to verify. Mr. Kaneshiro: Go ahead. Ms. Kawahara: Thank you. Thanks for coming up and helping us clarify or expand our information on the recent statements by Mr. Sheehan. So I just wanted confirm is the market value is usually what you look at and Mr. Hodge's or Hodge was able to go $700,000 below market value? Ms. Luck: Correct. Ms. Kawahara: Okay, so...so a lot of what you do is hopefully ' market value or less... Ms. Luck: Correct. Ms. Kawahara: ...is how you determine it, right? Ms. Luck: Right. When the Land Trust is helping to facilitate a transaction and of course the county is the end owner in this case, but we do try and at least begin the negotiations with bhe landowner and help secure funding, working closely with the county who's been a tremendous partner throughout this whole process. So we did meet with Mr. Hodge, we had the property appraised. It was appraised at $4,000,000 and then he did sign a letter of intent stating his intent to sell for $3.3 which is $700,000 less. ` Ms. Kawahara: I see. Another question. I do have the Legacy Land Conservation Commission Project rankings here for fiscal year 2009. I've got rankings for...let's see...there's O`ahu, O`ahu, Kohala, one, two and , three and number four for the Legacy Land Conservation Commission would be Kaua`i Public Land Trust, Black Pot Beach Area, Hanalei, Kaua`i TMK: (4) 5-5-001:011 and that's 0.74 acres and that is the $750,000 that you guys have requested. Ms. Luck: Correct. Ms. Kawahara: And that is at a ranking of number four... Ms. Luck: Correct. Ms. Kawahara: ...on...on Legacy Land Conservation Commission project rankings for 2009 and I just wanted that to be in the record. And I think that's about all I have right now. Thanks. 3 • • ~ Mr. Furfaro: I...actually, I think that was in the record, but I might follow up and...and since our presentation on that and we do appreciate all the negotiation you do on our part, is that money now, as it was number four on the ranking at the time, it...it's now confirmed and committed to you? Ms. Luck: It is, correct. The... Mr. Furfaro: Is there a subsequent letter we should be having that implies that? Ms. Luck: I...I can certainly obtain one. The Board of Land and Natural Resources did vote on the rankings and approved the rankings as they were recommended by the Commission. Mr. Furfaro: Right. We understand the approval and at the time we looked at the presentation, but I guess I'm seeking something that actually says you are in control of that money, so. Ms. Luck: Right. We can certainly obtain a letter... Mr. Furfaro: I would appreciate that. Ms. Luck: ...confirming that. I' Mr. Furfaro: Thank you so much. Ms. Luck: No problem. Mr. Kaneshiro: Mr. Bynum, you had a question, go ahead. Mr. Bynum: Good morning. Ms. Luck: Good morning. , Mr. Bynum: I just...you know, I know that there...these...I...I want to get a sense of the timing and I mean our process may take a few more weeks and that's not going to be a problem or... Ms. Luck: No. Mr. Hodge and I speak regularly. I've kept him very informed of where the process is at so he knows exactly what's going on and is happy with its progress and certainly is secure with the~ timeline that we've set up for him. Ms. Kawahara: I have one. ; Mr. Kaneshiro: Lani, you have a question? Go ahead. Ms. Kawahara: Oh no, it's not a question, I a statement. No question, a statement for later. ~ Mr. Kaneshiro: Statement? All right, we'll save that for when I call the meeting back to order. Anyone else has any questions? If~not, thank you very much... ; Ms. Luck: Thank you. 4 ' ' : ~ • Mr. Kaneshiro: ...for the testimony. Anyone else here who wanted to testify? Mr. Sheehan. MICHAEL SHEEHAN: Thank you, Councilmembers. Michael Sheehan's my name. I'm...I'm just a little confused myself over this whole process because right up until the approval by the Legacy Lands, the parcels that they were looking at and the parcels they actually approved were parcels 49 and 50. And then somehow at the end when it was all said and done, there was a switch around and it went to this other one. So, there's confusion, I believe, among the members of the Legacy Lands as well because throughout the entire process they thought that they were putting up money for parcels 49 and 50. So, I think I submitted for the record that documentation. So, either way is fine, but my...my thoughts are that for the same money you get twice the acreage if you go the other way, so. I mean it's over and up to you people; certainly you guys decide. Either way is good and as I said last week we will still continue to provide the extra 150 parking stalls and the public's use of our restrooms and everything else to augment the existing county facilities there at Black Pot, so. Anyway, just so...if I'm confused, probably you guys ought to be wondering too because... Mr. Furfaro: Oh that was the reason for the question, Mr. Sheehan, I would like to see the actual document that earmarks the tax key number and so forth that the funds were intended for. Mr. Sheehan: Yeah, I think I faxed it through. Mr. Kaneshiro: You have it there. Mr. Furfaro: Yes, I have it. Mr. Sheehan: Yeah, okay, that...that's all. Ms. Kawahara: I do have a question. Mr. Sheehan: Okay. Mr. Kaneshiro: You have a question? Go ahead, Councilmember Kawahara. Ms. Kawahara: Thank you for your information and it's really nice to be able to...to see another willing landowner trying to designate some land for the county. The question I have was the thing that you did send us was just a list of applicants from the Legacy Lands. So, as a list of applicants, was it actually an agTeement saying that...that they were going to be purchasing your land? Mr. Sheehan: Well that list you have there was a list of all the applicants and the members of the commission scored it in their order of priorities and the top four...top four got funded. And as you'll see, number four was parcels 49 and 50. Now then apparently sometime it switched over to the other one. So I don't know how that occurred, but... Ms. Kawahara: Oh, because, yeah, my official project rankings does say number four was Black Pot Beach, the Hodge property, which is what I have here. 5 • ~ . Mr. Sheehan: Oh, well okay, well I got another one that I sent through that said 49 and 50. Mr. Furfaro: A...again, I...I think that is one of the reasons I've asked the land trust to actually get to us from the Legacy Lands the final intent that identifies the funds that they have been granted and they so diligently worked on and what it actually earmarked those funds for. Mr. Sheehan: Yeah. Mr. Furfaro: That was the request. Mr. Sheehan: And...and I've been assured by the...Louie Abrams called me yesterday and he's on the Legacy Land Trust and he said that whatever order of priority gets funded first, they still intend to acquire my parcels 49 and 50 and perhaps 33 and then with that get the former Princeville piece of property which, you know, in whichever order, I support it, but over to you gentlemen and ladies and anyway. Mr. Furfaro: I want...I want to thank you for all of your support in this effort and also your willingness to offer facilities for parking and public use is...is very well received by me and I think... Mr. Sheehan: Happy...happy to do it because we just don't have enough facilities down there. The population has burgeoned and we're just way behind, so we're all working together collectively and thank you. Thanks very much. Mr. Furfaro: Thank you. Ms. Kawahara: I...I still had another question. Mr. Sheehan: Oh, yes, ma'am. ' Ms. Kawahara: And I did. I wanted to recognize you also for allowing all...when you presented something to us earlier, you showed us a picture of all the people that you allow to park on your easement and...and I think the , county really and truly does appreciate that, and thank you for doing it. Mr. Sheehan: Yes and on top of that my family provides about an acre and three-quarters at a dollar a year lease rent to the Hanalei Hawaiian Civic Club for their canoe club and we did donate the funds initially to build a structure, for the equipment and material, and then they used sweat labor to build that thing. So, it's...there's a lot of things that'are going on down there that, you know, the community's working collectively together and I think over time we'll...we'll finally make everybody happy, hopefully so. Ms. Kawahara: That's great and hopefully we will be able to work with you and it'd be really (inaudible) to be able to...to do the market value or less just like Mr. Hodge's, Mr. Hodge did. Mr. Sheehan: Thank you very much. Ms. Kawahara: Okay, thanks. 6 • C~ • Mr. Kaneshiro: Anyone else wanted to...in the chamber wanted to speak on this particular item before us? If not, I'm going to call this meeting back to . order and let my committee members know that I'm deferring this Bill No. 2305. There being no one else wishing to speak, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded as follows: Mr. Kaneshiro: The administration is doing an independent appraisal on the property. I know Mr. Hodge did one, but the administration wanted to also do an independent appraisal for our side. So, with that and I...I believe until we get that appraisal, we'll...which I'm certain will be shortly, that I'll be deferring this particular item on my agenda. So with that, Mr. Furfaro. Mr. Furfaro: Yes, Chairman, thank you for that briefing. I think doing the appropriate appraisal on the county's part for our share of the money... Mr. Kaneshiro: That's right. Mr. Furfaro: ...is good due diligence and I also want to on Thursday when we do the budget finance portion, I...I will be asking the administration to look at some other sources of money because the major portion of this today is coming from the Public Access area which is an island-wide tax contribution and I do understand through the efforts of our parks people that they are looking for a Hawai`i Tourism grant to help with what is earmarked for some money for Ha'ena and Hanalei and maybe that will loosen up some additional money that can be used towards this purchase and we'll find that out on Thursday. Mr. Kaneshiro: Thank you for that. Ms. Kawahara: Chair, chair? Mr. Kaneshiro: Councilmember Kawa...Kawahara, go ahead. Ms. Kawahara: My question is I...I...that's news to me that the administration is doing their own evaluation? Mr. Kaneshiro: Independent appraisal. Ms. Kawahara: Independent appraisal. Mr. Kaneshiro: Correct, not an evaluation, an appraisal. Ms. Kawahara: Independent appraisal. Mr. Kaneshiro: On the property. Ms. Kawahara: Okay and in what way would that mean that we can't decide on this today? Mr. Kaneshiro: Well, I think because... Ms. Kawahara: Because I don't think there was... 7 • ! ' r • Mr. Kaneshiro: ...I heard from one committee member right now that they do have concern of spending the full $1.8 million for one particular project. And if you had listened carefully to what Mr. Furfaro said, he's going to ask finance tomorrow, I believe we have finance here before us at our budget hearing, about some other funds rather than spending all of this on one particular project, so. Mr. Furfaro: And I... Mr. Kaneshiro: I just heard that right now. So with that, you know, there's no way I'm going to, as the chair of this committee, make a decision to vote on this right now. So... Ms. Kawahara: Okay, I just needed clari... ; Mr. Kaneshiro: The best way would be to defer. We could probably vote on it right now, but I can tell you right now with his concern, with my concern, whoever's concern, this probably won't pass. So... Ms. Kawahara: Okay, I just wanted clarification. I just wanted clarification to see if with this new development, new letter that...that we are... Mr. Furfaro: Let me, let me, let me clari... Mr. Kaneshiro: Let me, let me clarify that. I don't think it's because of a new letter. Number one, he had some concerns about spending $1.85 million on one project because we only have $2.2 million in that whole pot (inaudible) and,..and I know some other council members did express the same concern to me. So we have that as one part as this came before committee. Then we have the other part where the administration is currently moving ahead to do an independent appraisal. So, it has nothing to do with this letter that we received right now. I see it as two different, you know, two different conditions that my committee members are asking for also, if I'm not mistaken, for some deferral. Mr. Furfaro: I...I would like to clarify. Mr. Kaneshiro: Okay, go ahead. Mr. Furfaro: First of all, I have no...nothing but great pleasure in supporting the expansion of Black Pot. Mr. Kaneshiro: Absolutely, we all do. Mr. Furfaro: Second, it is... Mr. Kaneshiro: We all do. Mr. Furfaro: ...appropriately in the business world to make sure that we do our due diligence. Number one, I want to see from the Land Trust the letter that clarifies the grant for this particular piece. Secondly, after our discussion in finance yesterday with parks & recreation, there may be an opportunity to look at funds in other fund accounts and certainly, you know, number three, I think, and very important is I also heard from the Land Trust as asked by Mr. Bynum that the next two weeks isn't going to hurt us. It...this is just good business practice that we crossed all the T's, we dotted all the I's. I hope I made myself clear. 8 -~~ ~ Mr. Kaneshiro: You did. Ms. Kawahara: You made yourself absolutely clear and I...I agree. Actually it's appropriate in not only the business world but many other worlds to dot your I's and cross your T's. So, my question is that I just am curious if anybody can tell me...I am for...for the most part yes, I am absolutely positive that Black Pot is something that we want to do and the...the information from Mr. Sheehan does give us different property sites that would add greatly to that site and to the property. I just am just curious about when this started moving and when the...I would guess I have a question for the administration as to when...because I hadn't heard about them doing an independent appraisal until today actually. So I just am a little startled because we were to...to...to vote today on this. Mr. Kaneshiro: I...I...I think we have some procedural aspects that we need to go through. First this comes before the council, it's scheduled for public hearing, now it's in committee. Ms. Kawahara: Right. Mr. Kaneshiro: When it's in committee, this is when we do the work and this is the work that the committee members chose to do. Ms. Kawahara: I'm not...of course I would love to do that work. Mr. Kaneshiro: So this is where we're at. Ms. Kawahara: So we're discussing it now. Mr. Kaneshiro: So I'm not sure about why this didn't happen before or why did this not happen before because now we're doing it here in committee. This is the work, if it takes another committee meeting, but we need to do the work before we pass it up to the full council. This is where we're doing the work, right now. We haven't been doing the work previous to this before committee. First we take...put it on the agenda, take the public hearing, listen to the testimonies presented, and then we bring it...this is the first meeting I've had in committee, today. And I believe some of my members want to continue working in this committee to...till we do our due diligence. Ms. Kawahara: Yes. Mr. Kaneshiro: So, I mean it's simple. It's a simple procedure and we do that with all the bills. Ms. Kawahara: I...I beg your... Mr. Kaneshiro: Especially bills that will be taking out $1.850 million from the Open Space for all of Kaua`i. Ms. Kawahara: Which it is designated especially for. Mr. Kaneshiro: Yes, that's right. 9 0 Y • Ms. Kawahara: But Chair, Chair Kaneshiro, I just want to say I would really appreciate your patience with me as we do go through one of these committee hearings because there are...have been committee hearings that we've gone through that...that haven't...that have just gone straight through. So, if your patience with me is because I don't understand the regular process. Mr. Kaneshiro: In all my 10 years let me tell I haven't seen something that came to a first committee meeting for $1.850 million and passed in that committee that day. I can tell you that right now. Ms. Kawahara: ,No I'm just talking in general about the protocol. So, your patience with me and understanding how a committee... Mr. Kaneshiro: All right. Ms. Kawahara: ...works and the work that gets done in it at different times, I would appreciate. . Mr. Kaneshiro: Okay. And I know your desire. We all have the same desire, you know. Ms. Kawahara: Yes, we do. Mr. Kaneshiro: We all want to see the expansion of Black Pot. We all want to see it even going as much as we can, but at the same time this is the committee's job to do its due diligence before we even move ahead and pass it on to the full council. Mr. Furfaro: Mr. Chair, Mr. Bynum had a...Mr. Bynum wants to speak. Mr. Kaneshiro: Mr. Bynum had a comment? We're...we're in comment before...session before I defer this bill. Mr. Bynum: Right, right. Yeah, I just want to make it clear, at least from my perspective, that...you know, that I'm very much appreciative of the Public Land Trust and their work to bring us resources to do these things that are...are for the public good. You know, Black Pot is an incredibly special place we all care about, everybody in this room, and want the best for it. And...and it has challenges and it's clear that we've looked at different pieces of land there. My hope is in the long run that all of that property is acquired eventually for public use. As Mr. Sheehan's pointed out, we definitely need to kind of do a master plan for the park and create a situation where we balance that incredibly per...special natural place with the level of public usage it has right now, and currently our facilities are inadequate and we're probably not making the best use of that property. You know, I had the same question that Mr. Sheehan had about we were focused on this and now the focus has changed, and I asked those questions in advance and met with people and understood that, you know, the circumstances of how that shift was made in...in order to take advantage of those opportunities. I also am concerned and want to have the ongoing dialogue with the administration about potential other sources of resource in our county funds, not to delay or not proceed with this Hodge property but to just look at it in a bigger picture about how we move to our common goals and make sure that we also try to preserve funds in the Open Space Commission if we can because we have many other wonderful priorities for those funds in different areas that some of us are working on. And so that was my 10 question about you know I said I think it's going to take a few more weeks because I anticipated that we'd have a deferral to get more information and more dialogue amongst ourselves and with the administration about how we proceed. But just be clear, I don't think for any of us it's whether we proceed, it's how we proceed. So I will be supportive of the deferral and us continuing to do our, you know, that dialogue about the best way to proceed. Mr. Kaneshiro: Thank you for that, committee member. Mr. Furfaro: I move to defer. Ms. Kawahara: May I have one more comment? Mr. Kaneshiro: Okay and since there's no second at this point, Mr. Asing, you wanted to make a... Mr. Asing: Yes, let me... Mr. Kaneshiro: ...comment before we call for the deferral. Mr. Asing: Thank you. You know, I don't have any problem. As a matter of fact, I support the deferral process and the main reason for the deferral process is really to get an appraisal. I think I have had the opportunity as mayor on the other side to have discussions about this issue. Also, as a councilmember here, I have had numerous meetings with the Land Trust, with members of the administration regarding the process and the...the bigger issue which is on the floor today is the appraisal process. What you have currently is you have the landowner doing an appraisal. So I'm the landowner, I make an appraisal. You mean the county, you're purchasing this and you're going to take the landowner's appraisal and say yes, that's a good appraisal? That's not due diligence. I mean, you need to do your work also and that's one of the biggest reasons behind the deferral process, the due diligence on the county's part to be sure that the appraisal hopefully it comes in and it fairly matches. Supposing it does not match. If you go ahead and approve it today and move forward, it's too late and so, there's many loose ends that you need to look at first. There is also concern about, you know, I believe we have just a little over $2 million in that fund and you go ahead and expend, you know, $1.8 million out of that fund, to leave such a small amount left may not be in the best interest at this particular time. And we have other sources of income that we want to look at to supplement that so that we don't take a big chunk out of that...that fund. So there's some loose ends that I think the administration is a little concerned about and so, that's the reason, you know, I'm going to be supporting this move. Thank you. Mr. Kaneshiro: Mr. Kawakami. Mr. Kawakami: Yeah, thank you, Mr. Chair. You know, I just want to bring up a...a different perspective of...like a rookie and I think what...what the concern was and I'm speaking for myself, but I...I think even members of the public when they're watching they may perceive a deferral as something negative or the lack of support of...of...of something. But in this case, I just want to clarify again that...that it's a time-out and that's...that's one of the challenges I had to overcome. I immediately tied in deferrals with oh, there's no support for the project, but in this case it's just to make sure that we're fiscally sound and...and...you know, that it pencils out, and...and so, I'll support the deferral, no problem. And I also support 11 the acquisition of this parcel because I think it's important for the future generations that we preserve some of that open space for them to enjoy. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Kaneshiro: Thank you for that and I just wanted to add that this morning we...we did give some certificates where we had two bankers in here, Clyde Nakaya and also from CPB and Bank of Hawai`i. Anyone that is going to buy something or if you are going to go buy a home, the owner does not make the appraisal. You as the buyer will make the appraisal, give it to the bank and the bank will look at the appraisal and say, okay based on this, this is how we'll finance you. So, it's a-basic...it's a basic way of doing business. So people out there that think that, you know, we're deferring this for any other reason, if they had...had to do a loan for a home mortgage, they would find that they were the responsible people to do an appraisal and not the seller. So, with that in mind, I'll ask for a motion to defer. Upon motion duly made by Councilmember Furfaro, seconded by Councilmember Asing, and unanimously carried, Bill No. 2305 was deferred. , There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 10:11 a.m. Respectfully submitted, `oNA., Wilma Akiona Secretary APPROVED at the Committee Meeting held on Apri129, 2009: DAR,YL . ESHI O Chair, Budget & Fin ce Committee 12