HomeMy WebLinkAbout01/29/2014 Council minutes COUNCIL MEETING
JANUARY 29, 2014
The Council Meeting of the Council of the County of Kaua`i was called to
order by Council Chair Jay Furfaro at the Council Chambers, 4396 Rice Street,
Room 201, Lihu'e, Kaua`i, on Wednesday, January 29, 2014 at 9:10 a.m.
Chair Furfaro: A couple of housekeeping items for all of you
before we get started. First of all, the Executive Sessions that are posted for today,
I am requesting through consultation with the County Attorney, some of his legal
representatives are actually ill and unable to attend today. So, these are going to be
deferred for two (2) weeks. That will be the meeting of February 12, 2014. Am I
correct, Clerk?
RICKY WATANABE, County Clerk: Correct.
Chair Furfaro: That is one (1) announcement. Second
announcement, we are going to move forward on the Hanalei Courthouse and then
at 11:00 a.m., I have agreed with some of the residents in the Kalaheo — Lawa`i area
to put Wawae Road on at 11:00 a.m. So, that is just for some general notes. Also,
Councilmember Hooser is absent and excused and Councilmember Rapozo is going
to be here shortly. So we are all current on that. On that note, we will note those
two (2) Councilmembers attendance and I will call the meeting to order by a way of
a roll call.
The following members answered the call of the roll:
Honorable Tim Bynum
Honorable Mason K. Chock, Sr.
Honorable Ross Kagawa
Honorable Mel Rapozo (present at 9:11 a.m.)
Honorable JoAnn A. Yukimura
Honorable Jay Furfaro
Excused: Honorable Gary L. Hooser
APPROVAL OF AGENDA.
Chair Furfaro: Now, I am asking for an approval of the
agenda based on the items that I had suggested on deferring the Executive
Sessions. You go right ahead, have the floor.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. I think we had the
discussion with the Civil Defense at Committee. I think everybody is satisfied. If
we would maybe move that since they are here, up at some point also. Thank you,
Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Well, I will tell you what. It might be
beneficial for us then to take them first and then the Hanalei Courthouse. That
would work. Is everybody fine with Mr. Kagawa's suggestion? Okay, very good. I
would like then to have a vote to actually approve the agenda in the order that is so
stated.
COUNCIL MEETING 2 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa moved for approval of the agenda as circulated, seconded by
Mr. Rapozo, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Clerk, I would actually like you to read
Public Comment, Section (D) for me please.
PUBLIC COMMENT.
Pursuant to Council Rule 13(e), members of the public shall be allowed a total of
eighteen (18) minutes on a first come, first served basis to speak on any agenda
item. Each speaker shall be limited to three (3) minutes at the discretion of the
Chair to discuss the agenda item and shall not be allowed additional time to speak
during the meeting. This rule is designed to accommodate those who cannot be
present throughout the meeting to speak when the agenda items are heard. After
the conclusion of the eighteen (18) minutes, other members of the public shall be
allowed to speak pursuant to Council Rule 12(e).
Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much. So, if there is anyone
in the audience that would like to speak on any item on the agenda, you can take
this time for reconciling your time of speaking now, but again, pointing out when
the item then comes up later, you will not be allowed to speak again. Is there
anyone that wants to speak on any agenda item this morning?
There being no one present to provide testimony at this time, the meeting
proceeded as follows:
MINUTES of the following meetings of the Council:
June 28, 2011 Council Site Visit
December 18, 2013 Council Meeting
Mr. Chock moved to approve the Minutes as circulated, seconded by
Mr. Rapozo, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: So note that is not a typo, that is the
June 28, 2011 minutes, for the record.
CONSENT CALENDAR:
C 2014-24 Communication (12/31/2013) from the County Engineer,
transmitting for Council consideration, a Resolution Establishing No Parking At
Any Time Along A Portion Of KOloa Road, Koloa District, County Of Kaua`i:
Mr. Kagawa moved to receive C 2014-24 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura,
and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
C 2014-25 Communication (01/06/2014) from the Chief of Police,
transmitting for Council consideration, proposed amendments to Ordinance
No. B-2013-753, as amended, relating to the Fiscal Year 2013-2014 Operating
Budget, by Revising the Amounts Estimated in the General Fund.
(Police Department Workers Compensation Medical — $110,000): Mr. Kagawa
moved to receive C 2014-25 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried
by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
COUNCIL MEETING 3 JANUARY 29, 2014
C 2014-26 Communication (01/21/2014) from Council Chair Furfaro,
providing written disclosure of a possible conflict of interest, relating to Ernesto G.
Pasion vs. County of Kaua`i, et al., Civil No. 13-1-0340 (Fifth Circuit Court), as he is
named in his individual capacity: Mr. Kagawa moved to receive C 2014-26 for the
record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was
excused).
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Clerk, from the earlier narrative you
might have heard that we would like to go to Civil Defense first.
COMMUNICATIONS:
C 2014-14 Communication (12/06/2013) from the Civil Defense Manager,
requesting Council approval to receive and expend grant funds in the amount of
$475,000 from the United States Department of Homeland Security via the State of
Hawai`i, Department of Defense, for the Fiscal Year 2013 State Homeland Security
Grant Program for the following:
1) Continue to enhance the capability of State and local units of government
to prevent, deter, respond to, and recover from threats and incidents of
terrorism involving the use of chemical, biological, radiological, nuclear
and explosive weapons, and cyber attacks, in addition to day-to-day
all-hazards scenarios;
2) Continue to provide support to Citizen Corps Councils with planning,
outreach, and management of Citizen Corps programs and activities, such
as Community Emergency Response Teams and Neighborhood Watch.
Mr. Rapozo moved to approve C 2014-14, seconded by Ms. Yukimura.
Chair Furfaro: Are there members from our Civil Defense
Agency? Ladies, maybe you should both come up. Aloha, good morning. If I could
have you both introduce yourselves. We will be open to some dialogue with you on
this grant.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
GLENDA NOGAMI-STREUFERT, Civil Defense Manager: Glenda
Nogami-Streufert, Civil Defense Manager.
CHELSIE SAKAI, Emergency Management Grant Coordinator: Chelsie
Sakai, Emergency Management Grant Coordinator.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. There is some narrative for us to
read here, but we did ask you for some specific responses coming back from the last
time if I remember appropriately. Mr. Kagawa, you want to have the floor?
Mr. Kagawa: Well, I think we did it in Committee and I
think everybody was satisfied with the answers. I want to thank Civil Defense.
They had all of the Agencies represented at the last meeting and I think we all
agreed that this is a great thing, for our County to get updated. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: I was absent, under the weather the last
time. So, I want to thank Vice Chair Chock for having you entertain those
COUNCIL MEETING 4 JANUARY 29, 2014
questions last week. Any further questions of Civil Defense? Well, it is a short
morning for you folks. I will see if there is public comment. You are excused.
Ms. Nogami-Streufert: Thank you very much. I appreciate it.
Chair Furfaro: Is there anyone in the public that wishes to
speak on C 2014-14?
There being no one to testify on this matter, the meeting was called back to
order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve C 2014-14 was then put, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1
(Mr. Hooser was excused).
C 2014-27 Communication (11/22/2013) from Council Chair Furfaro,
requesting the presence of the Director of Parks and Recreation and the County
Engineer, to provide the Council with an update on the Administration's progress
and current plans as it relates to the restoration of the former Hanalei Courthouse
Facility. This briefing should include, but not be limited to, the following:
• The plan/design/construction of sidewalks;
• Whether all plans and designs were presented to and accepted by the
community;
• The requirement for floodwalls, including an assessment of potential
impacts such as water run-off; and
• A report on the outcome of the planned community meeting to discuss
restoration and use of the Hanalei Courthouse Facility.
Mr. Rapozo moved to receive C 2014-27 for the record, seconded by
Mr. Chock.
Chair Furfaro: I have a motion to receive and a second. At
this point, what I would like to do is suspend the rules so that I can give some
commentary to Lenny and then take some public comment.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Chair Furfaro: First and foremost, since this is my agenda
item and it was an agenda item that I had asked that you do another outreach to
the community, I want to say thank you for scheduling that meeting. It was much
appreciated. I think some of my previous questions are still in the communication
here which deals with the water proofing of any proposed wall that goes around the
Courthouse, that it is aesthetically pleasing and it is not just taken from a
standpoint of a construction element. We need to recognize that the location of the
Courthouse it directly across the street of a historic park and it is historic because it
is also the site of the third Russian Fort on Kaua`i. Fort Barkley was located right
there. So, it is extremely important. Secondly, my concerns dealt with the addition
of a bus stop, and is the community going to have an opportunity to give some input
on that? Its design I think, is extremely important to the historical value of Hanalei
and there just should not be a generic bus stop installed. I guess having an
ultimate understanding of how the walking sidewalks will be incorporated with the
Community Association understanding the historic road that goes through Hanalei.
So, Lenny, those were my points communicated to you and I would like to turn it
COUNCIL MEETING 5 JANUARY 29, 2014
over to you if you want to make a presentation and if your comments could address
those three (3) points, I would certainly appreciate it.
LEONARD A. RAPOZO, Jr., Director of Parks and Recreation: Thank you,
Council Chair. For the record, Director of Parks and Recreation, Lenny Rapozo.
Yes, we had the meeting and if I could briefly just go through the presentation. It
gives a lot of background as to how we got to where we are today with the facility
itself and some of those questions that you have raised were also raised at our
Community Meeting that we had last night, which I thought we had really good
dialogue.
Chair Furfaro: Well, let me give you the floor. I am going to
relocate myself to Mr. Hooser's chair and I will run the meeting from over there.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Okay. Well, first of all, I would like to say
that this project is a joint project between the Department of Public Works and the
Department of Parks and Recreation. Department of Public Works is taking the
lead on the renovation of the facility itself and the Department of Parks and
Recreation will manage the facility or has been managing the facility and will
manage whatever programs and the intent of what the community wants the
facility to be used for.
With that being said, we will move forward with our presentation. The
facility, that area or that property was established by Executive Order (E.O.)
No. 896 back in October 8, 1940 by Governor's Executive Order. It is approximately
two and a half (21/2) acres in size. It is affectionately known as the Hanalei
Courthouse lot in Waioli, Halelea, on the island of Kaua`i. That would be page 2 of
your handout. The Hanalei Courthouse as we know of it today, in 2006, the
Judiciary built their new courthouse in Lihu`e and made the decision that all five
(5) district courts which were held prior to 2006 in the outlining districts were all
moved to Lihu`e at the current Judiciary complex. The Hanalei Courthouse, after
that move was completed, was no longer in use by the Judiciary. On
September 20, 2006 Mayor Bryan J. Baptiste requested via letter to the Governor,
that the County would like to continually use the property and the courthouse
building itself. At the April 27, 2007 meeting, the Board of Land and Natural
Resources approved his request. On May 1, 2007, Mayor Baptiste received a
memorandum approving the use of that particular property for the purposes of the
maintenance base yard, for public affairs and recreation purposes. In 1940 when
the facility was already established, the Hanalei Base Yard was already located
there and was allowed to exist there. By this action, it gives the approval by the
County to continue use as a base yard, to use the area or the courthouse for public
affairs meaning predominantly meetings and recreational purposes whatever that
may be as viewed by the County. On October 19, 2007, Mayor Baptiste receives the
Right of Entry Notification authorizing the County's management of the Hanalei
Courthouse. At the time, major rehabilitation work when they made the
assessment of the building would be required to reopen the building which would
include asbestos removal, Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA) improvements,
septic system improvement, and a design to hopefully better suit the needs of the
community. The design at that current time was suited to run an active courtroom.
By Executive Order No. 4214 by Governor Lingle on December 10, 2007, the
land was officially set aside for the three (3) aforementioned activities — the base
yard, public affairs, and recreational purposes. It will be under the control and the
management of the County of Kaua`i. So, you would think that by having all this is
COUNCIL MEETING 6 JANUARY 29, 2014
it at this time, it would be ours. This is a picture on page 8, depicting the Tax Map
Key (TMK) area of the courthouse lot as we know of it today that was done over by
E.O. No. 4214. On July 20, 2011 the official transfer of the property from the
Judiciary, I am talking about the courthouse itself because in the Executive Order
we found that the land was transferred to the County, but the building itself, was
not. In 2011, we worked with the Judiciary to get the necessary documentation in
place so that not only the land, but also the building itself was physically under the
management of the County of Kaua`i.
Moving forward again, the purpose of E.O. No. 4214 would be the renovation
of the courthouse, community meetings, and the design consultation. The
community meetings, one was done on December 18, 2007 and that community
meeting was done by Mayor Baptiste and at the time, Parks and Recreation
Director Bernard Carvalho, Jr. Last night we had further community input and we
have already scheduled possible meetings that we already from last night, we are
going to go back on February 25, 2014 to respond to some of the questions the
community had regarding the bus service, the bus stop, looking into some of the
other concerns as the Chair had mentioned, and what we discussed at the meeting.
I will get into that a little bit later. If we need to, we will go back on March 18, 2014
to do the final report and the final commitments to the community as to its uses. Of
course we will speak too about the design consultation or what the design of the
courthouse is.
Renovation of the courthouse is to allow again, the maintenance of the base
yard, public affairs, community meetings, and recreational purposes. At the
community meetings, we talked about the improvement to the facilities physically.
The previous community input as to what they saw the facility would be used for, as
well as from that how the scope-of-work was developed to come up with the redesign
of the facility to meet the needs of the community. So, that would be the overall
needs of the center. From this, the facility improvements again includes ADA
improvements to the walkways, the doorways et cetera, asbestos removal, and to
improve the septic system that is already in place or lack of currently. At the
community meeting on December 18, 2007 what came out from that meeting via the
minutes that we have available to us is that the community said they wanted a
neighborhood center or a senior center; possibly a Kaua`i Community College (KCC)
North Campus; multimedia training center for youth; an emergency facility for
Police and Fire, hardening the facility as a place where during natural disasters
and emergency situations the community had a place to go. Other considerations
were a kitchen, small meeting rooms, and sounds taking into account the
surrounding community. From that meeting based upon those community needs,
the scope was developed in terms of what the construction of the inside was done.
The needs were given to the consultant, but we had to make some decisions mainly
really the facility was not big enough to have classes like a KCC North. So, as you
can see, that was not part of the scope. We took that and this is what we came up
with as far as design the design inside that would have activities and classes for
seniors and youth, training classes for County personnel including Fire and Police
out there, meetings for various community organizations or for the community in
general, special events whatever that may be, the bus stop and bus shelter, a
holding center for the community when the river floods or other natural disasters
occur, and a holding center for the Police and Fire during these natural disasters
should they need a place to call home temporarily while these things occur.
To date, the community center for the Hanalei District was to provide
activities for exactly what we just had mentioned, for seniors and youth; classes for
COUNCIL MEETING 7 JANUARY 29, 2014
all ages; we would hold meetings; community events; we would allow for an area for
Police and Fire; and resources in times of disasters. Now, the term recreation as
was part of the E.O., recreation can take the form in different ways. Recreation
does not necessarily have to do with playgrounds, organized basketball, or running
around. Recreation programs for youth and seniors as we have it today could
include different classes, Zumba, hula, jiu-jitsu, wrestling, or whatever the case
may be. Those are considered recreation. So, that is what it is when we consider
recreation and programs. On our deliverables, during this process and this process
occurred prior to my tenure, the Notice to Proceed for the design work for the
current contract and we are using the same consultant, was given on April 23, 2010.
The previous contract was suspended on the 21st and we had to go out and get a new
contract. Luckily, we were able to get the same consultant. On April 20, 2011 as
we moved through the permitting process through Special Management Area (SMA)
Review — and this one here is erroneously put in as a Planning Department. This
actually came from Engineering, that we were notified that flood proofing would be
required of this facility. The flood proofing as Chair had alluded to as one of his
questions, would entail providing a three (3) foot high wall directly outside around
the building to make the building flood-proof. This project site as noted here in this
bullet point, and this is taken from the SMA application, is located within the Flood
Zone AE which would be Figure 3 on your next page, on page 17. For your benefit of
your eyes we have a bigger copy of it on the next page to help you see. The area is
subject to inundation by a one percent (1%) annual chance of flooding and base
flooding elevations are determined by the Federal Emergency Management of 2005.
The base flood elevation is estimated at between twelve (12) to thirteen (13) feet
above the main sea level. Because we are within this area here as I am showing
here, Flood Zone AE would be this area here as depicted by the blue, it wraps
around here, and this is where our project is currently situated. Page 17 would be
this slide, but to help you view you can look at the following one, there is an insert
that is not shown to help you where AE is.
This is the example of what would have to be done to the door in order for
flood proofing to occur at the facility. We would install, and this was taken from the
Waimea Wastewater Treatment Facility, where on one of my visits I noticed this
and I asked them about it. They are in a flood zone, so this is what was done for
them when they did the renovations to that facility. These metal plates would be
installed and these are about three (3) feet high. This would be the gate that would
sit here and this bolt looking thing for the sake of a better term, would get inserted
there and screwed in to make it water-tight. Now, when I picked up this metal gate
there I estimated it to weight between maybe fifty (50) to sixty (60) pounds. So, it
would need someone to carry that to install it for us should a one percent (1%)
chance of flooding occur at this facility as it was given to us because it was done to
us. So, we are moving through the permit process, this gets thrown at us and we
had to make these adjustments in our design. Since we are on this subject, we did
speak with the community and we did talk about the aesthetics of having a three (3)
foot high cinder block which if you look here, it would probably be if you think a
block is about ten (10) to twelve (12) inches, would be about this high. Something
like this that would be place outside of the building up against the wall. A lot of
discussions were made if this was the only type of material that will comply to this
requirement and so I gave the community my commitment that we will be looking, I
will contact the consultants and work with the Department of Public Works to see if
this is the only type of material that can be used to satisfy this requirement and if it
is, then we need to come up with some kind of possible aesthetic to somehow blend
into the building or make it more attractive to the natural surroundings similar to
what we did with the path in Wailua. If you look at that wall fronting the highway,
COUNCIL MEETING 8 JANUARY 29, 2014
we have some earth tones with some designs of fish and whatever. I think we can
possibly do that. I did not make that commitment, but I am doing the research and
I will get together with the Department of Public Works to see if we can work with
the consultant to somehow satisfy, and whatever different type of material would be
okay.
The Planning Department requires us to put a possible sidewalk fronting the
facility and I have a meeting scheduled for tomorrow. We tried to get this meeting
with Hawai`i Department of Transportation (HDOT). It was pretty hard with
different schedules and what have you, but we finally have one tomorrow and we
will have this discussion. This is exactly how it was written in our permit to comply
with this portion for Planning. "An Americans with Disabilities Act compliant
pedestrian walkway shall be constructed along the entirety of that portion of the
property fronting Kuhio Highway, and it shall be designed to connect to any future
walkways located on adjacent parcels..." This part here is why we need to meet
with HDOT and to me, the meeting is important, "...subject to the approval of
and/or no objection by the State of Hawai`i Department of Transportation." Chair
has mentioned that the road fronting there has been designated as a historical road
and also the surrounding areas. We have a historical church across the street, but
really, we need to get with State Department of Transportation (DOT) to also see
what their plans are for the road. If they have objections to us putting a sidewalk
there for whatever reason, then in my reading of this, it would not apply for us to
comply with this requirement by Planning. However, if there is something that
State DOT would be okay with for community benefits, then in our meeting last
night it was very clear that the one type of sidewalk we will not have is a curbing
cement sidewalk as we are used to here. They want something to blend in more
with the grass and more like a path, not a sidewalk. We will work after our
meeting with HDOT tomorrow, one way or the other if it is a go. Also we need to
talk to Lee Steinmetz who is working on Complete Streets and sidewalks. We do
not just want to put a sidewalk there and not take into account what might be
coming with the other properties. So, we will be working with Lee, Department of
Public Works, and whoever we need to work with to cover this.
Again, the design consultant, the project scope would be again removal of
asbestos. Asbestos assessment was done. We did the survey. The next thing we
need to do is the asbestos removal, ADA requirements need to be completed, and
septic improvements also need to be done. The renovations would include replacing
the roof, the windows, interior modification will be done to enhance or to meet what
the community would like to see in terms of activities there, the doors, the
bathroom fixtures, flooring, and the painting of the facility. To-date, the cost
projection so far as I mentioned earlier, asbestos survey completed. The plans and
the design cost originally was seventy thousand dollars ($70,000). We needed to
add another thirty thousand dollars ($30,000) for additional costs for the redesign to
include the floor proofing of the facility. So, the total cost for the plan and design is
about one hundred thousand dollars ($100,000). The facility renovations originally
was estimated to be six hundred fifty thousand dollars ($650,000). With the
additional costs for the permitting and the flood proofing of the facility of seventy
thousand dollars ($70,000), we see a possible cost of going up to seven hundred
twenty thousand dollars ($720,000). So, if we add the plans, design, and
construction we are looking at a price tag of about eight hundred twenty thousand
dollars ($820,000). I am sorry. Oh, sorry. I will just do this then for now. You are
right. It looks like eight hundred twenty dollars ($820) right?
COUNCIL MEETING 9 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: It means you are going to do the whole thing
for eighty-two thousand dollars ($82,000), not eight hundred twenty thousand
dollars ($820,000).
Mr. L. Rapozo: Oh, not eight hundred twenty dollars ($820)?
It looks like a point over there. What a bargain we are getting.
Chair Furfaro: Lenny, is that the summary at eight hundred
twenty thousand dollars ($820,000)? I did not see a line you put in there for a
contingency.
Mr. L. Rapozo: That would be automatically part of the
eight hundred twenty thousand dollars ($820,000).
Chair Furfaro: It is in the eight hundred twenty thousand
dollars ($820,000)?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes, it would be about a fifteen percent (15%)
in the contract.
Chair Furfaro: Fifteen percent (15%)?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes. I am hoping that our bids of course
would not be as high, but that is what we are planning for based upon the
consultant. This is the existing floor plan as we know of it today at the old Hanalei
Courthouse. This is the proposed floor plan as we have made some design changes.
This would be the old courtroom which would be open for larger meetings, a kitchen
area, and I want to be very clear that the kitchen area would be a serving kitchen.
We did not feel the facility was big enough to have cooking, but serving kitchen
where food is prepared outside. There will be a sink, counter space to serve, a
meeting room, a breakout meeting room, ADA restrooms, another meeting room
here, and because it was brought out to us last night that when you look at the
exterior design, the exterior design changes the historical look with windows, but
those windows were placed smaller because now the bathrooms are located here.
You cannot have big windows in bathrooms, but through some discussion after the
meeting we will check with the consultants if there is some way that we can
somehow blend in these smaller functioning windows and still keep the possible
look of having the original window space there to help try to keep its historical
character.
To address the flooding, in our SMA application of what the consultant did, it
was noted that we are not changing the topography of the current facility other
than putting in improved septic systems. The community did say that when it rains
there a lot there is flooding involved in that area on the street by Mahimahi and in
front. So, I need to connect with not only our consultants, but Department of Public
Works as a result of last night's meeting to look at that issue and see if anything
can be done. Someone also did say at the meeting last night that hopefully that is
just the way it is there and I do not know. We need to reexamine that. I want to
add to our deliverables and I wanted to get an update this morning. This comes
from the Project Manger of the Department of Public Works that we do have our
Planning Class IV and SMA permits in hand. The building permits are in the
works. That will happen after we have the decision on the sidewalks which will
take place tomorrow so that the finalized construction plans can be finalized and
then we can get our building permits. So, we can submit for the permits by late
COUNCIL MEETING 10 JANUARY 29, 2014
February and at the same time, go out to bid in February and hopefully opening an
award in March. Thanks to the Mayor and this body, the Council, the funding is in
place in our Capital Improvement Project (CIP) budget. So, we do have the moneys
to move forward with the project and we are working as quickly as we can to try
and move this project. I think I covered everything that we talked about last night.
Chair, any other questions that you might have?
Chair Furfaro: Is Celia involved with — I just do not want to
have a generic bus stop put in the most historic place on the North Shore.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Thank you. Yes, that was brought up and I
talked to Celia prior to the meeting. She could not make it to last night's meeting
so she is going to be there in February. That also was brought up by the
community, that they did not just want to have the standard bus shelter and Celia
is going through the process of putting bus shelters all over the island. For
maintenance reasons, it might have been standardized, but she is going to come to
the February meeting to have that dialogue with the community. How much can
we do? Can we have some leeway? Last night there was a community organization
there willing to say, "Hey, what can we do to help build something there?" I told
them, "Well, this project will go out to bid for a general contractor." They can
probably help maintain the place and improve the maintenance of the place, which
they seemed to be very open to and maybe this bus shelter if we want to deviate
from what Celia had in mind. Of course, I am not going to answer for Celia, but she
will come out in February to have that discussion with the community. Thank you
for reminding me about that.
Chair Furfaro: Questions for Mr. Rapozo members? Go
right ahead Vice Chair.
Mr. Chock: I was tracking a few calls about the sidewalk
and I am glad that we are kind of leaning towards making it less inconspicuous and
providing some sort of pathway instead, but I wanted to see if Lee was also involved
in the overview of the whole town because there is a lot of foot traffic moving
through to the beach from all of the different locations. So, I just wanted to make
sure that that was part of it, maybe some consistency between what is happening at
the courthouse along with any future plans in Hanalei Town. Thank you.
Mr. L. Rapozo: That is why I mentioned that we are not just
going to put it. If the meeting with HDOT tomorrow says, "No objections," you folks
should really consider that based upon whatever they say, then we should look at
the whole thing rather than just say we are going to put it here. Yes, you are right.
We need to get together with Lee. Whatever happens at tomorrow's meeting will
predicate what our next steps will be with the path. We are not using the term
sidewalk because they do not want a sidewalk. They want a little path to traverse
through there.
Chair Furfaro: Councilmember Yukimura.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, Lenny. On the septic
improvements, what exactly is that going to be?
Mr. L. Rapozo: My understanding is that we do not have any
kind of septic system. We need to close the current system and put in a septic
system. So, that would be the improvement.
COUNCIL MEETING 11 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Right. Do you know what cost that would
be?
Mr. L. Rapozo: No, I do not have that exact cost right now.
Ms. Yukimura: When you looked at the flood maps, does that
take into account global warming and sea level rise?
Mr. L. Rapozo: That would probably be a question for the
Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) group that has done the map.
Ms. Yukimura: I saw preliminary maps showing if there is
one (1) foot or two (2) feet in sea level rise what that looks like laterally on the land,
not for this particular location, but for another part of Kaua`i. There is this issue of
— it will affect Black Pot too, but of seepage into the bay when the water table gets
higher and if you have sea level rise that means a higher water table more inland, I
am thinking.
Mr. L. Rapozo: I would tend to agree, but to move this
project forward we got this mandated because of what I presented where the
location is in this flood zone. So, we are complying with the requirements of the
flood plain area.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay.
Mr. L. Rapozo: But I agree with what you are saying. We
are doing something that according to this, has a one percent (1%) chance.
Ms. Yukimura: What are the staff requirements?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Staff requirements for the facility? We are
probably going to have one (1) manager there like we do at all other facilities. We
tend to run it like we do with other neighborhood centers.
Ms. Yukimura: One (1) manager at Kilauea has a much
bigger scope-of-work than one (1) manager at that place. Have you looked at any
other alternatives, part-time? What kind of costs are you looking at?
Mr. L. Rapozo: But then again, if we want to run programs
like senior programs and in most of our centers, senior programs happen from
8:00 a.m. to 12:00 p.m. daily in some areas. If you want to get a camping permit,
this would also provide you another place to get a camping permit. We need to
make reservations for other facilities. This would provide that. The distance
between Kilauea and Hanalei may not seem far, but I think if you make the drive, I
think it becomes a challenge to manage both facilities and based...
Ms. Yukimura: Oh, I am not suggesting that the Kilauea
person manage both.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes, I understand that, but when we looked
at the operation of the facility, that was a consideration because that is kind of like
what is happening at Anahola Clubhouse where the Kapa'a Manager and that call
was made before me. So, we looked at possibly that type of situation there, maybe
part-time. I agree with you that maybe it is a small facility, but the facility might
COUNCIL MEETING 12 JANUARY 29, 2014
be small in building, but I think the needs of the community in terms of what might
be going on at the facility may require a full-time person there.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, have you assessed the needs of the
community?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Assessed the needs by what their wants are?
Yes, we looked at what they want.
Ms. Yukimura: No, not just by asking people what they
want, but by looking at how many seniors live in that area, and what type of
seniors. It may not be the daily senior center-type. I do not know. There are
different kinds of programs such as classes or dance, what kind of floor area. How
are you coordinating it with Hale Halawai `Ghana 0 Hanalei in terms of what their
facility is offering? Have you done that?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Exactly. We have talked to Hale Halawai
`Ghana 0 Hanalei and...
Ms. Yukimura: Could they not offer camping permits there
and what about the technology of camping permits and those kinds of things?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Well, if we want to talk about camping
permits at Hale Halawai `Ghana 0 Hanalei, I would not want to put that upon them
because then we are going to have to require them to be — certain protocols that
Finance Department requires us to get moneys and whatever. I felt that a full-time
center manager to help with community needs and to have someone there is
warranted. If you want to know numbers with the amount of seniors, we have not
done that exercise, but I think we do still have time if that is something you believe
that we should look at, we can.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, it is not just seniors. It is the whole
age range in terms of what kind of program planning you are doing. Then the use
of technology, if people can get camping permits through the Internet, do you really
need the manager there to do the camping permits?
Chair Furfaro: Why do I not suggest this, excuse me,
Councilmember Yukimura. Why not on the next update we expand the scope of the
discussion of the actual operation and put it on the agenda, giving Lenny some time
to get back to us on some of those recommendations because today's agenda item is
really design, construction, and so forth? I think that Councilmember Yukimura
raises some very good points that knowing what the end use would be, we probably
want to incorporate some things in what would be the final design.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, I appreciate the Chair's suggestion.
The thing is that usually, and I am concerned about the Adolescent Drug Treatment
Center too. You figure out the uses and you consult with the users in the design of
the improvements in the building. That is why sometimes you kind of waste money
if you design first and then you have to retrofit or you have to change the design.
Chair Furfaro: Good points.
Ms. Yukimura: So, to move ahead design without a clear
picture of what the use is going to be can sometimes be costly.
COUNCIL MEETING 13 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. L. Rapozo: Well, the uses was done in 2007, what the
community thought they may want. We took that and worked with the consultant
to best facilitate those types of activities. We are considering that it is not a new
facility where we could not build out, but keeping with the current footprint of the
exterior.
Ms. Yukimura: Right. So, I think you are right. If you were
to design a whole new building, that is one thing and this is an already existing
structure so you are right about that. Now, the thing is one of the uses and I am
somewhat jumping around, but one of the uses is a holding place for Police and
emergency? Where do you have that stated? Oh, emergency facility for Police
and/or Fire for natural disasters and emergency situations. If it is a tsunami, it is
not going to be —that is in the tsunami zone right?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: So, to make it a Police or Fire place does not
seem to make sense. It would probably be up at Princeville for that purpose.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura, in that situation
you are correct, but last night there was also people that said they went there
during the last hurricane and that was the place. During the last river flooding
that occurred down there during heavy rains, the Police and Fire had no place.
They told me that the ambulance was located out in Ha'ena and then they have to
respond back. They have asked us if they could use that in its current condition and
I want to give them a key, but conscientiously how can I give these people a place
knowing that it has asbestos in there? They are going to be exposed to these things
and yet they still want it and the community said that they think it would be
appropriate. I agree with them.
Ms. Yukimura: I see. Okay.
Mr. L. Rapozo: But during a hurricane or a tsunami you are
right. Nobody is going to be hopefully in that town trying to bang on that door.
They are going to head for the hills or get up to Princeville. They are going to go up
by the Japanese graveyard or they are going to go up that valley.
Ms. Yukimura: So, on page 15 the last item, "holding center,
substation for Police and Fire during natural disaster like hurricanes, tsunamis,
and floods," that is out, but holding center for community when the river floods is
still a useful function of that building?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, thank you for clarifying that. It is still
an active base yard for North Shore operations, right?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Is that still the best site or is there any
consideration of another location?
Mr. L. Rapozo: I think I would pass that to my friend, Larry
Dill since that is his base yard.
COUNCIL MEETING 14 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. I am just saying that, I mean because
there is also the Kaua`i Bus needs for a base yard for the bus.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, I want to say right now.
Councilmember Yukimura is correct in that our consultants advised us that to
improve operational efficiencies and performance of the bus. We should be looking
for a West Side base yard and we should be looking for a North Shore base yard.
That is a scope that needs to be put in the agenda very soon and would include the
base yard. I think it is very good points because this is what our consultant is
telling us. It will save us operating costs, park and rides are available where it is
going to be located, and so forth. The agenda item today is the repair and upgrade
of the design cost and construction cost for the courthouse with its preliminary uses
being identified. We also know that it is used as kind of a collective place when we
have operations that require some centralizing of response teams and so forth. I
mean, that is why we bought that type of fire trucks that we have so that one could
be on that side of Kuna Ditch and going over the river, but that is not today's
agenda item and I would like to suggest that after we have your final March
meeting, is it March?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: If we come back one (1) more time and we
expand some of this discussion and we have Transportation people here as well as
Mr. Dill with some feedback on those. So, I am going to request Councilmember
Yukimura, to help me expand the scope on this discussion and have it posted again
in March.
Ms. Yukimura: Even as I think about it, if it is in a tsunami
zone any base yard function whether it is Public Works or bus base yard could be a
problem. I mean it seems like it would be moved logically in high ground so that
you can respond in times of emergency. Your base of operations is not in a flood
plain that would really help. That may very likely may not be the best place for a
bus base yard, but maybe not likely the best place for a Public Works base yard
either if you think about recovering period if you are having to — anyway. I was just
thinking that if you have 2.99 acres, that is like a three (3) acre parcel right there.
Sure, I think we should make that place temporarily available, but what is the long
range vision for that too and now would be the time to look at it? Eight hundred
thousand dollars ($800,000), maybe that it is not too much for a temporary repair.
Chair Furfaro: On the eight hundred twenty thousand
dollars ($820,000), I am going to ask Mr. Dill to come up with you for a second
because that is not the number we have in our CIP budget and I want to get some
clarification. That is coming up in a few more minutes, and I will ask Mr. Dill to
come up, but in the meantime Mr. Kagawa has the floor and then Vice Chair Chock
has the floor. Mr. Kagawa, you have the floor.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. First of all, I want to
start on a positive note and Lenny, I want to thank you. I have been here one year
(1) and one (1) month and I have seen a lot of progress with Parks.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 15 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: I want to thank you on that. I just want to
name a few; Po`ipu Beach comfort station, the Wailua Golf Course renovation and I
am pleased that at least in this year I have seen a lot of these plans come up before
us on these presentations and they have come to fruition. So, I look forward to this
project being the same way that we move hopefully in a year and see that same type
of progress. In planning of the renovation, have we looked at other successful
neighborhood centers in planning out the rooms and the use because it looks like it
is similar to a neighborhood center where it is multi-use and we have one (1) big
area in the middle that can be used for Zumba or whatever? Is that how we kind of
planned it out?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes. We always need meeting rooms, not
necessarily just one (1) big meeting room. So, based upon we do and other
neighborhood centers, that is how the scope was crafted.
Mr. Kagawa: So, to try and use the existing shell, but yet,
the Judge's Chambers you folks split it into a storage and an office.
Mr. L. Rapozo: And also I think taking into account weight
bearing walls and how that does all play into holding up the ceilings and things like
that. I think that was all taken into account to try to maximize the space for the
best usage of what was identified at that time.
Mr. Kagawa: And at the most effective way of not I guess,
overspending cost to kind of use the shell and maximize the best use that you could
figure out.
Mr. L. Rapozo: For the space.
Mr. Kagawa: Well, I appreciate that kind of planning. I
have no questions about asbestos removal and all of that other septic things. That
all needs to be done. I have no question and it is going to come at a cost. So, I
appreciate you folks looking at those things first with the demolition. I guess my
final comment is I agree with Councilmember Yukimura that it is nice to have
where we want to be and then go forward with all of the renovations instead of a
year after completion, then we have to change orders to try and meet some of the
new needs that come up. I know it is not as simple as it seems and sometimes you
get different ideas that come up at later dates. Hopefully, we can just get it done
and I think the community will appreciate that we got it done in a timely manner
and I think they will utilize the space the way it is made as long as it is safe and
has the adequate restrooms and what have you. I just want to thank you for your
presentation and I want to offer you my support in anything that we can get it done
faster.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Thank you, Councilmember Kagawa. I
appreciate that.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Vice Chair, you have the floor.
Mr. Chock: I just wanted to ask about parking. Do you
have a plan for how many stalls you want to add in?
COUNCIL MEETING 16 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. L. Rapozo: The parking is there already. It should not
change.
Mr. Chock: So, it is going to remain the same amount?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Mr. Chock: Okay, because I know that a lot of people use
that area as well, the parking. Especially if we are wanting to create a space for
disasters and so forth, I was just wondering what we might have in place in terms
of addressing where people are going to park. Sometimes that is an issue. Now
that the area is being used more and more, I see people parking in there already.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes, they do.
Mr. Chock: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Lenny, if we expand this piece and we can
talk again after your two (2) follow-up community meetings, I am going to work
with Councilmember Yukimura to kind of expand some of the general plans in the
next posting, but in the meantime and Larry, maybe you can come up and take
some notes here. I want you find out what is going on there with CIP especially
when I go to specifically Parks Trust Funds for Hanalei. We have a number here
that is eight hundred twenty thousand dollars ($820,000) and yet we have available
to us, and this is a balance after a previous carryover allocation of three hundred
twenty-three thousand dollars ($323,000) and then in the proposed budget we added
four hundred thousand dollars ($400,000) to give us a total of seven hundred
twenty-three thousand seven hundred dollars ($723,700) and that indicates to me in
comparing these two (2) pieces that we are about one hundred thousand dollars
($100,000). I would like to ask that question of you with Lenny present so that
maybe the two (2) of you can go back and visit with Keith Suga. I will send this
over in a written form, but I do not want to be putting my stamp of approval to find
out that we have to go take one hundred thousand dollars ($100,000) from another
project without knowing it in advance. Now, granted Lenny did share with me his
eight hundred twenty thousand dollars ($820,000) had about a fifteen percent (15%)
contingency and we know that is close to eighty-five thousand dollars ($85,000). So,
maybe the money is not detailed here because the contingency is not available.
These are very identified North Shore Trust Fund Park account money and it looks
like we are short a few dollars, well, not a few; one hundred thousand dollars
($100,000). If you could watch for my communication and please ask Keith to
respond to that because it will come up again. We will do this sometime in March.
Could the septic system — could that one hundred thousand dollars ($100,000) be
budgeted somewhere else and that is what the difference is? Would one hundred
thousand dollars ($100,000) be in Wastewater, Capital Budget versus being in the
Bond Trust Fund account?
LARRY DILL, P.E., County Engineer: Chair, for the record Larry Dill,
County Engineer. I will have to get back to you on those questions. If you send
over a communication over...
Chair Furfaro: That is possible that new septic system is
somewhere else?
Mr. Dill: I would say it is possible, but it is not likely.
COUNCIL MEETING 17 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Well, those are the kind of stones I want you
to turn for us.
Mr. Dill: Sure.
Chair Furfaro: More questions? JoAnn, go right ahead.
Ms. Yukimura: Lenny, the three (3) foot high wall around
the building, is that still in the plan?
Mr. L. Rapozo: Is that still in the?
Ms. Yukimura: In the plans.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. Who is the consultant?
Mr. L. Rapozo: I need to come back with that one. I believe
it was Akinaka & Associates, but I thought it was Akinaka & Associates, but I need
to come back. I will send over an E-mail for you.
Ms. Yukimura: Alright. Thank you.
Mr. L. Rapozo: I should know that, but right now I just drew
a blank.
Ms. Yukimura: No, I am sure you are dealing with a lot of
projects. So, do not worry about it. You can just come back with that. Then, I
guess I want to ask some consideration about the staff requirements and see if there
are other ways to handle it. It really kind of depends on the use. If it is like you say
Lenny, the daily Senior Centers, that is one thing, but I am not sure the North
Shore is going to have that. Also, I am hoping in the future we can get whether
through a North Shore shuttle or the regular bus system if you have the bus coming
every fifteen (15) minutes, it is not that hard for people to get from Hanalei or
Princeville to Kilauea Senior Center. I mean we have to think of some things that
will be connected by transportation because even like the high school kids with
their Kaua`i Performing Arts Center, they cannot have a center in every high
school. So, they are doing it at one (1) center, but then transportation becomes the
key for getting people there. There is some kind of planning that can go along that
way and if it is just using keys for meeting, conceivably they could pick it up at Hale
Halawai `Ghana 0 Hanalei. I am just asking this because we were told that we
have budget that cannot afford more positions. So, I am just asking for you to look
for some creative ways, but that depends on you. So, that is why my question about
surveys and exactly what kind of use is going to be there. Thank you.
Mr. L. Rapozo: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: If we do not have any more questions, we do
have two (2) people signed up to speak on this item. Larry, you will watch for my
question on the financial part? Thank you. Do we have speakers signed up?
Mr. Watanabe: Yes, we have two (2) speakers. First speaker
is Carl Imparato followed by Maka'ala Ka'amuoana.
COUNCIL MEETING 18 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Good morning Carl.
CARL IMPARATO: Aloha Councilmembers. My name is Carl
Imparato and I live in Hanalei. I want to begin by thanking Chair Furfaro and the
Council for the interest in ensuring that the public is involved in the critical design
issues related to the restoration of the courthouse so that it can be a public facility
that the community can be proud of. As Lenny indicated, the Department of Parks
and Recreation had a very productive meeting with the community yesterday
evening and so what I want to just do here is point out those important issues that
are still of concern and warrant your attention. First, regarding the use of the
facility, the uses referred to by Lenny, the list that came up in 2007 and it was a
similar list that the Community Association came up with was really a laundry list
of ideas. Just because something was on that list did not indicate that it was a high
priority idea. So, there was that list. I think that there was a general consensus
that the primary use for the building should be as a neighborhood meeting facility
and as a neighborhood activity center. It should first and foremost be used to
provide space for local group meetings and then if the community sees a need for
them, for senior activities, after school activities, education training activities,
et cetera. That need needs to be I think, more flushed out, the need for the scope of
that. Of course care will have to be taken to ensure that the activities that occur
after dark do not disturb what is currently a quiet residential area. The other thing
that came out that is very important is that the facility should also be designed for
use as an emergency facility for the Police and the Fire Department use or for
sheltering stranded people during road closures and certain other types of
emergencies, certainly not tsunamis and maybe not even hurricanes depending
where the storm surge it projected to come from. But primarily people were
thinking about the road closures when people get stranded. So, that is the uses.
The second major area is the design of the facility, the exterior design of the
facility. There are four (4) significant issues that really need to be resolved with the
input of the community hopefully before the County makes final design approvals.
The first is the issue of sidewalks versus paths. As Lenny pointed out, the Planning
Department requires that there is an ADA pedestrian walkway be constructed
along Kuhio Highway and probably there will be something similar on the
Mahimahi Street side where the bus shelter is projected to be. I think that in the
community there is a general consensus that a path not a sidewalk, not curbs and
gutter, but a path is acceptable provided that the design is truly context sensitive to
Hanalei's rural character and the historic area. The Council of course, has also
indicated several times during when complete streets came up for discussion, that
implementation should take into account local context and sensitivity to community
character. So, here, the important question is whether the community is going to be
able to provide input so that they outcome is not a six (6) foot wide straight concrete
path.
Mr. Watanabe: Three (3) minutes.
Mr. Imparato: But something that is more maybe winding
and textured. Something that is more rural and consistent with the General Plan
still meeting the ADA requirements and all.
Chair Furfaro: Carl, just continue, but that was your first
three (3) minutes. Just continue.
COUNCIL MEETING 19 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Imparato: Thank you. On that same point, we need a
concept that is consistent with the General Plan for all of Hanalei's roadways and I
know Lee Steinmetz and some of the County folks do intend to meet with some
community members. We have a meeting scheduled in March to sort of go over
some sort of General Plan. Again, hopefully the timing of these things will not clash
with moving forward on the project. Second external issue is that three (3) foot high
flood barrier that Engineering requires to be built around the building.
Unfortunately, the current thought was that it was going to be a three (3) foot
cinder block attached to the building, that could be a real mistake as it would mare
one of the most beautiful places in Hanalei. So, a real effort needs to be made to
achieve that the flood protection goals with materials and the design that is a visual
asset. I know Lenny's talk should be open about that as well. But again, hopefully
this will be done with community input rather than something that just comes from
Lihu`e.
Third, is the design of the County bus shelter and bus stop. That is very
critical because I have been aware that the Transportation Agency would rightfully
try to look for standardized designs for bus shelters throughout the County, but
there needs to be exceptions. Putting a modern looking urban facility next to this
historic building I think would be a terrible mistake. So, here again, we would like
to work with the County and the community to come up with something that is
more appropriate to the site. I hope that the Administration will be flexible and the
Transportation Agency to come up with something with community input as well.
Finally, there is the landscaping plans for the overall property including the
base yard. I do not think they have been very well defined as this point. Currently,
the lot is pretty much an eye sore and it does not have to be that way if people do
not want it to be that way. Again, Lenny has pointed out that yesterday that the
Rotary Club did indicate an interest in helping out on things and that might be an
area. Again, provided that this gets done with community input and all. The
bottom line is that one of the key objectives of the rehabilitation should be to create
a facility that is useful, but also one that is a visual asset to Hanalei and Kaua`i
rather than ugly and utilitarian. I hope that you indicate support for that goal.
Unless there a tsunami washed through the area, we are really only going to have
one (1) chance in our lifetimes I think to make sure that the courthouse restoration
project is something that is aesthetically pleasing and enhances Hanalei and the
North Shore. I think that both the Administration and the Council recognize that
and they hopefully will work with the community in coming up with a solution. It
was back in August of 2006 actually, seven and a half (71/2) years ago, that the
Hanalei to Ha`ena Community Association kicked this off by writing a letter to
Mayor Baptiste asking that the County develop a plan to bring the courthouse back
into use as a community facility. Now that the project is finally underway it is
important even if it takes a little more time to do it right. So, I am a little
concerned about things going out to bid in February because once things are out to
bid maybe the design gets locked in. If we can, great, but again, overall there needs
to be I think, community consensus on the design issues. In closing, I want to give a
healthy thank you to Lenny Rapozo and the Department of Parks and Recreation
for really being willing to work with the community. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you for that comment toward Lenny
and his staff. It is much appreciated. Questions for Carl? Go right ahead
Mr. Kagawa.
COUNCIL MEETING 20 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: Carl, I want to thank you for always bringing
up some of the other options. For example, the three (3) foot wall, what do you
envision as a general option to having that? I agree, having a man-made wall in
comparison to something more natural would be a better option for me, but do you
have any suggestions on that?
Mr. Imparato: I do not have a lot because I do not have that
expertise, but what struck me is that instead of having cinder blocks around the
whole building, one (1) possibility is since the building going to have a major
redesign and I do not know what this would cost, is to put in an impermeable
surface sort of under the exterior. In other words, you take off the exterior cladding
the fake wood and you put an impermeable surface around it and then you just put
the wood over it again so it looks good. I do not know if that works or not, but it
seems to me that the alternative can not only be concrete.
Mr. Kagawa: Yes.
Mr. Imparato: If we are not talking about velocity, we are
not talking about a tsunami event, we are just talking about water for that one
percent (1%) chance when there is flooding. If you put sheet metal around the
whole thing and then cover it with cladding again, maybe that is a solution that is
not visible.
Mr. Kagawa: Well, I think we had agreement in the past
about what was acceptable walkway and for me, concrete is always the last
alternative. I like to see us keep our rural aspect as much as possible. I think
anytime we go with more concrete it looks more like the mainland and I want stay
away from that.
Mr. Imparato: Okay, and I am sorry. I was talking about
the wall, but as to the path.
Mr. Kagawa: Yes, I am talking about the path now. I kind
of switched channels.
Mr. Imparato: Yes. I think there is a goal that we should
try to make things that are permeable surfaces first of all if there is materials that
are permeable because we have the water issues, but also something that instead of
being straight line it has a little bit of winding, it has some color, and some texture.
It does not necessarily need to be six (6) or nine (9) feet wide. We are not talking
about having something that is a really high use environment.
Mr. Kagawa: I guess Carl, the part where we all agree too
is that at times it is the ADA requirements that sometimes override what we want
to see and we have to think of others. I guess that is the quandary I guess.
Mr. Imparato: Well, I have high hopes for the meeting with
Lee Steinmetz, Marie Williams, and others. They are willing to come out to Hanalei
in March and we will walk because some of us had put together a concept possibly
for all of Hanalei and maybe there is something that we can come out with.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Carl.
COUNCIL MEETING 21 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Other questions for Carl? Carl, thank you
very much, but it will be my intent to have another visit with this item and more of
a summarized final form touching on some of the operational issues as well, not just
the construction pieces. I do want to encourage, what we have is this ongoing piece
of emergency plans for Hanalei and I am going to be encouraging the Planning
Department to — when we talk about our General Plan update to maybe identify
that as an issue for the North Shore. My wife as a little girl, she sat on the hillside
at Lumaha`i for the 1957 tidal wave, but how do you get out of Hanalei, the bridge?
There is Masa's family old landing to cross the river to go up to Princeville, there is
the Kuna ditch that comes up behind the parcel that goes up to the Princeville
agriculture subdivision. Those things have to be discussed because today alone, it
pointed out some real needs.
Mr. Imparato: Maybe Maka'ala when she does her
presentation, can touch on the disaster resilience planning project that Hanalei
Watershed Hui is sponsoring.
Chair Furfaro: Yes, I do know you folks are working on that
because I saw the flyer and that flyer was sent over with a little note to me, can this
be a discussion item in the next General Plan? JoAnn, you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you. Carl, can you help educate me
about this three (3) foot wall? It is designed to do what? Keep that water from
hitting the building? Is that the FEMA underlying purpose?
Mr. Imparato: I do not know that much about it, but my
assumption from what I read is that just like anyone else who builds a house in a
flood zone, they either have to elevate the house or if it is retrofit that you cannot
elevate then if it cost more than fifty percent (50%) of the value of the structure, you
have to meet current FEMA requirements. So, my understanding is that it is
primarily not to deflect water from and other place, but just to keep water from
permeating into the structure and ruining the structure. That is my
understanding.
Ms. Yukimura: Part of the elevation requirement is the
requirement of breakaway walls. So, there is a purpose not to block the water and
that presumably is tsunami related.
Mr. Imparato: Right.
Ms. Yukimura: The three (3) foot wall will block. I mean,
there will be a dynamic of blocking water, but maybe it is low enough so the water
goes over. So, what is the purpose of the wall? It is still going to allow water to
touch the building, right? I mean, it would form like a moat and then the water will
still be touching the building. If the purpose of the wall is to prevent damage to the
budding, then I am not sure the three (3) foot wall is going to do it.
Mr. Imparato: Well, to be clear first, it is not to deal with
velocity events. So, it is not to deal with tsunamis.
Ms. Yukimura: Right.
Mr. Imparato: It is just water rising. It is not a question of
having energy flow and the wall is not supposed to be, as I understand it, like there
COUNCIL MEETING 22 JANUARY 29, 2014
is a castle inside the moat. The wall is actually supposed to be touching, it is
basically part of the building. It is continuous with the building and surrounding
the building.
Ms. Yukimura: I see. So, it is in fact designed to protect the
building from flooding?
Mr. Imparato: Right, and that is why Lenny showed those
slides that showed that where there are doorways and you cannot have the concrete
wall, that is where you put those other barriers in.
Ms. Yukimura: I see. So, that really clarifies it for me
because my picture was of a three (3) foot wall with space between the wall and the
building. I should have deduced it from Lenny's pictures, but I am slow. I did not
get it until just now that it is basically a water proofing of the lower part of the
building.
Mr. Imparato: That is my understanding.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. And the concern of the aesthetic then,
is there going to be a metal piece around?
Mr. Imparato: No, the concern of the aesthetic is that the
cheap and easy way to do it is you just put a cinder block wall around the whole
building. You have the building and then you put cinder block around three (3) feet
high.
Ms. Yukimura: But it sounds like it could be really thin, but
strong.
Mr. Imparato: When you talk about CMU, Concrete
Masonry Units, I do not...
Ms. Yukimura: No, that is right.
Mr. Imparato: But that is what people were talking about.
Ms. Yukimura: But what Lenny showed was metal.
Mr. Imparato: That was just for the entrances. That was
just at the doorways.
Ms. Yukimura: Surely there must be materials experts who
can help us. That is why we need to know that purpose because if we want to know
alternatives, we have to do what the purpose is. Well, thank you for the
clarification. This was helpful to me.
Mr. Imparato: Agreed, and that is why the idea is let us do
this fast, but let us not do it so fast that we do not get the good alternatives in there.
Ms. Yukimura: Right. I mean color, texture, and strength of
materials, those would all be the issues we would look at. Thank you so much.
Now, I do not see that wall as a separate wall. It is actually part of the wall of the
building. Okay, thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 23 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Any more questions for Carl? If not,
Maka'ala. Thank you, Carl. Carl, have a nice vacation. I understand you are
traveling on Friday.
MAKA`ALA KA'AUMOANA: Aloha. I am Maka'ala Ka'aumoana and I
appear today as Executive Director of the Hanalei Watershed Hui. For the past
several years we have been implementing a document that was community
authored called the Hanalei Watershed Action Plan. A component of that is being
completed now which is the Watershed Management Plan. That is an
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Department of Health funded document.
It is in two (2) parts. At some point it will be final, final, final and I will make a
presentation to the Council, but it includes the hydrology, the engineering, and the
science behind much of the water issues for Hanalei. That is the whole point of it
and it includes a set of recommendations related to wastewater, one of which is we
missed a golden opportunity when we — and I say we, because we participated in the
upgrade that was required of Tahiti Nui. I want to give credit to Christian Marston
for trying to do the right thing there. EPA was inflexible from their office in San
Francisco and he just had to jump and get a system put in. It is a better system
than it was, but it is not the system that I hoped we can do for the courthouse. The
system we have in mind and I will not call out the manufacturer is being approved
as we speak by Department of Health because it is new to the State. It is a tertiary
system. It is a three (3) tank system. The water that comes out at the end of the
process is nearly potable. It is not that much more expensive when you are talking
about large capacity septic systems which are always around seventy thousand
dollars ($70,000). It is the system that is approved by Malibu and Lake Tahoe.
Both areas are very, very stringent in their regulations are requirements for
individual wastewater systems. So, it is a tested system. We do not have to be the
first in the world to do it. Our Watershed Management Plan recommends the use of
that and we need the County to step up and be the example of what should be done.
There are very few place in Hanalei that would be required to have a large capacity
wastewater system and again, I say we missed an opportunity at Tahiti Nui and I
will forever be sorry about that and hope that someday we can still do the right
thing there.
As it relates to flooding and those kinds of aspects of life in Hanalei, again
the Watershed Management Plan describes features, pieces, and structures that can
be employed, but the main one is to reduce our use of impervious surfaces; to let the
sandy soil absorb what it can sand that relates not only to this wall which I am still
concerned about. I am very concerned about the aesthetics, but Hanalei folks are
handling that well so I can focus my attention on where will the water go. If you
divert it from a wall, are you sending it to Aloha School? As we looked at the SMA
permit, my testimony focused on wait a minute, this is an impact to others too.
Having said that, I certainly understand the County needing to protect its assets
and provide something, but that needs to be part of the discussion here. We did
have the discussion with ADA and there are many options for pervious walkways
that meet ADA standards for wheelchairs and et cetera that still allow water to flow
down through them. So, concrete is the last resort. I want to also suggest,
Councilmember Yukimura brought this point up, and that some sort of a feasibility
study be done on the uses of this building because since we started this, we have a
certified kitchen at Hale Halawai `Ghana 0 Hanalei, we have a serving kitchen at
Waipa, and we have another multi-use building at Waipa. Those were not part of
the community conversation when we first started talking about this use. One of
the reasons we did the Disaster Preparedness Plan for Hanalei and we are in the
final troughs of that now mapping with the community, and I want to plug the fact
COUNCIL MEETING 24 JANUARY 29, 2014
that we have an event on February 8th from 4:00 p.m. to 8:00 p.m. where we are
having everybody come; the Search and Rescue, the Ham Radio people, the
Lifeguards, Fire, Police, Red Cross, and Civil Defense. Everybody is going to be
there to get a little bit more public input. One of the reasons that we did that was
to look at where our resources are. So, that is in process. Let us not decided what
we are going to use this courthouse for until that plan is pau. The Police and Fire
did say they needed a place to go and they have now keys and arrangements at
Hanalei School which they did not have before. That came about because of our
planning process and getting the right people to the table. My favorite thing to do is
being the convener and then step back, right? Magic happens when you do that.
One of the things that became clear in that is that our community has changed. So,
those days of Hurricane Iniki when everybody ran to the courthouse, we do not
know what the vacationers are going to do this next time. We have done three (3)
door-to-door surveys for our community to determine the demographics. We are not
that same community by a long stretch. By our numbers, we are twenty-five
percent (25%) of that community now. So, if the County had a policy that said all
visitors out of luck when you know something is coming, that would definitely help
us and preparedness plan will be asking you to think about that.
Mr. Watanabe: Six (6) minutes.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Sorry. I just want to make sure that the
science follows this conversation. I want to mahalo Chair for asking for these
updates. I look forward to the next one. I apologize that our disaster preparedness
planning process is still in process, but it is a community process and I really want
to mahalo Lenny. I was unable to attend the meeting last night. I know that the
community really participated and they felt very, very positive about that meeting
and I want to thank him for doing that. They are not always the most fun things to
do and we appreciate that. The last thing I would say is when we know better, we
do better and between 2007 and 2014, we know a lot more about flood walls, septic
systems, feasibility, how many people there are, how people are going to run, how
many of our vacationers even know that structure is a place to run to? So, many
things have changed, not the least of which is our community and because I can, I
am just going to pitch the 2014 Hanalei moon and tide calendar. Once again, this is
a Hanalei product. You do not have to interpret the tides from Nawiliwili and we do
not have to wonder when the fish spawn in Hanalei because we tell you that. That
is a resilience project. Our Disaster Preparedness Plan is funded by National
Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA). It is the first of its kind in the
State. Hanalei is partnering with the North Shore of O`ahu. It is a novel concept
and we are again breaking grounds. It is a little scary sometimes, but we seem to
be pretty good at it. Mahalo for your time today. I appreciate it. Sorry, I am a
little disconnected.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, and the success of the calendar.
We no longer have to look at Nawiliwili tides and then subtract twenty-three (23)
minutes to figure out the Hanalei tide. Mr. Bynum, you have the floor.
Mr. Bynum: Maka'ala, thank you for an excellent
testimony this morning and all you do out there on the North Shore.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Sure.
Mr. Bynum: I wanted to particularly ask you if you can
help with providing the information you can when it is available on this septic
COUNCIL MEETING 25 JANUARY 29, 2014
system you were discussing. I agree with you one hundred and twenty-five percent
(125%). The County has to set the standard. Councilmember Hooser and I are
working slowly on trying to look at the County's response to your watershed plan
based on the meetings that we attended last year. I just want to thank you for your
testimony and say, is there more material available on this now that you could
share offline perhaps?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes. The final recommendations for the
Watershed Management Plan are posted. It is not final, final for implementation.
The scenario is you do a total maximum daily load study that Department of Health
does of all of your pollutants, you identify the sources, you do a Watershed
Management Plan, and when you are pau with that, then you get into cue for
implementation funding from EPA and Department of Health. So, Department of
Health is holding back the final, final because they know that once they let go of
that, that we will start actually doing things.
Mr. Bynum: Right.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: So, it is always a little bit of moment of
hesitation to get final, final. That is okay. I do not mind when it takes longer to do
it right.
Mr. Bynum: Thank you very much.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. JoAnn, you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes, thank you, Maka'ala for being here and
for your comments. I raised the issue of managing the place, do you have any ideas
about how we might do that creatively?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: I am going to start by saying I am a senior
and I have been participating...
Ms. Yukimura: I forgot.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: I am proud of it. I have been participating in
the senior — I am going to say this wrong, Health Enhancement Program at Kilauea
Gym and go for exercise when I get there. There are usually about twelve (12)
people. Six (6) of those people come from Hanalei. I just know that from personal
experience. That is a three (3) day a week deal and it is about one hour (1) to one
and a half (1%2) hours. So, I certainly see it as a part-time management thing. I
would not choose to speak for Hale Halawai `Ohana 0 Hanalei, but I will tell you
they have somebody at the center in the middle of the day every day. Their staff is
there. I defer to Lenny when it comes to the fiscal issues related to a private entity
managing County funds, but I think we can get creative about if we are going to do
bookings if somebody was going to pay fees or that kind of thing. I do not see it as
any more than a part-time. I remind you that the way it used to be was the key
hung on the outside wall at Menehune School and when we wanted to use it, we
went and got the key and Diane kind of kept track of who was doing what. The
maintenance came from Kilauea so the lady that cleaned the bathrooms came from
Kilauea. I have no way to know the increased intensity of use at Kilauea and
whether or not that is possible, but I certainly do not think it is a full-time thing
unless they have another responsibility and I do not know what that would be. We
have another County park at Ha`ena Beach Park, maybe there is a share. I do not
COUNCIL MEETING 26 JANUARY 29, 2014
know. Lenny is on it and I know he is trying hard to make sure that it is managed
as well as it can be, but I am reluctant to. I know the budget does not have that
kind of wiggle room in it.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you for your comments. They are
helpful.
Chair Furfaro: We will have more dialogue on that when we
do the next update in March probably. I am going to allow Lenny to have some time
after the second Community Meeting and we will expand the discussion points.
Will that work for you JoAnn?
Ms. Yukimura: Yes. The testimony about not doing the
design until some of the use issues are settled, I think is advisable if Lenny can
somehow control that.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Maka'ala.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Mahalo.
Chair Furfaro: On that note, I do not think we have any
additional testimony on this item.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: Discussion from the members? Late March,
I am going to be putting a new item on. Mr. Kagawa.
Ms. Yukimura: There might be testimony.
Chair Furfaro: We only had two (2) people signed up. Did
you want to talk on this item? Most definitely. I just want to make sure before you
say anything more, that you come to the microphone because we cannot record you
there in the audience.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
ANNETTE ODA: Hi, my name is Annette Oda. This whole
issue with the Hanalei Historical Courthouse is kind of new to me. I am glad I was
sitting in and listening, but I am excited to see that activities are going on in
Hanalei and buildings are being revisited to see how they can be in use instead of
vacant like that. Just one (1) thing, I wondered if by any chance you could consider
movable walls. In this day in age when space is really limited and finances are
really limited, that perhaps to get the best use because even churches are doing
this. They are putting in movable walls so that when you need a smaller meeting
room then you can just open it up or close it down to have them separate meeting
rooms. Then when you need a larger space for the use of the whole building, maybe
that might be something to consider. I understand about the structure and you
have to make sure that you have the support it needs, but maybe something like
that could be in the workings and just seriously consider that because in this day
and age we have to really find the best uses and stretch our money as much as we
can. Just a thought maybe. Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 27 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: I will share this with you and I will have the
staff give you something here. Thanks to Barbara Robeson, we have some historic
perspectives on the old courthouse and we also down in the Chairmans' conference
room, we have photographs of the old fire station in Hanalei that was until the
1980s. My wife's great grandfather, George Kupahei-Gomez, was the Sherriff in
Hanalei so we have a lot of information on that, but I will share this with you to see
what we are trying to accomplish for historic Hanalei. This is from Barbara
Robeson. She has done a lot of that research. Ashley, could we pass this on to the
speaker? Anymore testimony? No?
There being no further testimony, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: Members and to the Clerk, what I would like
to do after we receive this item, it does not seem we have any more testimony, I
would like to take a ten (10) minutes break. 11:00 a.m. we spotted time for Wawae
Road and on that note, if I could ask of Larry Dill to give me a few minutes along
with Aida on an upcoming agenda item. I would like to talk to you at the break, but
we are going to take a recess right now. Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Discussion?
Chair Furfaro: Yes, we are going to take a recess.
Mr. Kagawa: After the discussion?
Chair Furfaro: No, we are going to have the discussion and
then take a recess. So, we are in discussion mode right now. Any other questions?
Anybody want to speak to Lenny again or Larry? No. Okay, discussion.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. I want to thank you for
putting this on the agenda. A lot of times as we go out and talk in the community
when I talk to people in Kekaha and Waimea, they always say make sure you
remember us and the same thing when I talk to people from Hanalei, Princeville.
They say, make sure you folks are thinking about us too. This is one case where I
think it is long overdue that we have a County funded facility for the community in
Hanalei. They are a very important part of our islands' economy with our tourists
and with our residents. I went to a canoe regatta out there and I was just amazed
with how much people go down there. It is a really big money maker for our island,
but I think they lack some things that other communities have and one of those
things is a community center for meetings and for use for seniors and similar to
other neighborhood centers. I want to thank Lenny for I think our neighborhood
centers are a tremendous part of keeping Kaua`i a happy place for all. Highly used,
it is used for parties and whatnot. I think they manage it well. They tell the
people, 10:00 p.m. or whatever they set up at different sites. Eddie Sartia does it at
the War Memorial Convention Hall and the community does not have much gripes
about noise and things because at 10:00 p.m. everything goes off. I think it is up to
the people of Hanalei what they want there. I think I rely on Maka'ala and Carl to
help guide Lenny as to what fits there because every shoe fits different in different
communities. Hopefully, we can achieve all of this as soon as possible, but yet make
sure let us do it right. So, I do not know what that will take. That will take some
kind of fast timing, but not too fast. We want to make sure we again, listen to our
people like Carl, our resources and Maka'ala and make sure that we consider the
environment especially when we go with this. As a plan, just look at the building. It
COUNCIL MEETING 28 JANUARY 29, 2014
looks like when it gets done, it really fits. It looks nice. It looks like something that
fits in Hanalei. I do not know about what the people there think, but for me, very
happy to support something in Hanalei and let you know that this Council, we
think about the whole community. So, thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Very well said. Thank you. JoAnn? No?
Anybody? Members, this is an item to receive with the intent that the last week in
March we will have a revisit of the agenda item with a little larger scope and
everyone who testified, thank you very much for being her with us today. BC, after
I call for the vote, we are gang to take our ten (10) minute break because we have
scheduled the Wawae Road for 11:00 a.m.
Mr. Kagawa: Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Go right ahead.
Mr. Kagawa: At some point I think we have the Odas here
for the cat licensing if maybe after Wawae the Council feels like we want to go after
the Cat Bill, I will be more than happy to support that.
Chair Furfaro: I have no problem doing that. It is just that
Wawae Road was actually scheduled with a time at 11:00a.m. for Engineering. The
motion is to receive this report on Hanalei Courthouse.
The motion to receive C 2014-27 for the record was the put, and carried by a
vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: On that note, we have received this item. It
will be posted at the end of March. We will take a ten (10) minutes recess here
members.
There being no objections, the Council recessed at 10:50 a.m.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order at 11:12 a.m.,
and proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We are back from our recess. Mr. Clerk,
before we go onto Wawae Road, let us see what housekeeping items we can take
care of there.
Mr. Watanabe: Chair, on page 4 on that top we have
C 2014-35 and C 2014-36 which the County Attorney's Office requested that we
defer today given the illness in their office.
There being no objections, C 2014-35 and C 2014-36 were taken out of order.
C 2014-35 Communication (01/16/2014) from the County Attorney,
requesting authorization to expend funds up to $8,000 to retain Special Counsel to
represent Henry Barriga in Lynell Tokuda, et al. vs. Chris Calio, et al., Civil
No. 13-00202 DKW-BMK (U.S. District Court), and related matters: Mr. Bynum
moved to defer C 2014-35, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1
(Mr. Hooser was excused).
COUNCIL MEETING 29 JANUARY 29, 2014
C 2014-36 Communication (01/16/2014) from the County Attorney,
requesting authorization to expend funds up to $8,000 to retain Special Counsel to
represent Sherwin Perez in Lynell Tokuda, et al. vs. Chris Calio, et al., Civil
No. 13-00202 DKW-BMK (U.S. District Court), and related matters: Mr. Bynum
moved to defer C 2014-36, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1
(Mr. Hooser was excused).
Mr. Watanabe: Council Chair and members, we also have
the Executive Sessions on page 8, ES-696, ES-697, and ES-698 which is also
requested to be deferred for the same reason.
There being no objections, the Executive Sessions were taken out of order.
EXECUTIVE SESSIONS:
ES-696 Pursuant to Hawai`i Revised Statutes (HRS) Sections 92-4,
92-5(a)(4), and Kaua`i County Charter Section 3.07(E), on behalf of the Council, the
Office of the County Attorney requests an Executive Session with the Council to
provide the Council with a briefing, discussion and consultation regarding the
quarterly report on pending and denied claims. This briefing and consultation
involves the consideration of the powers, duties, privileges, immunities and/or
liabilities of the Council and the County as they relate to this agenda item.
ES-697 Pursuant to Hawai`i Revised Statutes (HRS) Sections 92-4,
92-5(a)(4), and Section 3.07(e) of the Kaua`i County Charter, the Office of the
County Attorney requests an Executive Session with the Council to provide the
Council with a briefing on the retention of Special Counsel to represent Henry
Barriga in Lynell Tokuda, et al. vs. Chris Calio, et al., Civil No. 13-00202
DKW-BMK (U.S. District Court), and related matters. The briefing and
consultation involves consideration of the powers, duties, privileges, immunities,
and/or liabilities of the Council and the County as they relate to this agenda item.
ES-698 Pursuant to Hawai`i Revised Statutes (HRS) Sections 92-4,
92-5(a)(4), and Section 3.07(e) of the Kaua`i County Charter, the Office of the
County Attorney requests an Executive Session with the Council to provide the
Council with a briefing on the retention of Special Counsel to represent Sherwin
Perez in Lynell Tokuda, et al. vs. Chris Calio, et al., Civil No. 13-00202 DKW-BMK
(U.S. District Court), and related matters. The briefing and consultation involves
consideration of the powers, duties, privileges, immunities, and/or liabilities of the
Council and the County as they relate to this agenda item.
Mr. Rapozo moved to defer ES-696, ES-697, and ES-698, seconded by
Ms. Yukimura, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much. Mr. Dill is back in
the audience. Mr. Dill, may I ask you to come up and we will go to the agenda item
posted for Wawae Road.
Mr. Watanabe: We are on page 3 on the top.
C 2014-28 Communication (01/03/2014) from Council Chair Furfaro,
requesting the presence of the County Engineer, to provide the Council with an
update on the status of safety improvements for Lae Road and Wawae Road in
Kalaheo (Project No. W12058), in the Fiscal Year 2013-2014 Capital Improvement
COUNCIL MEETING 30 JANUARY 29, 2014
Projects (CIP) Budget; and the Administration's efforts to address safety concerns
relating to drainage and runoff on Wawae Road in Kalaheo and the need for a
guardrail across the property located at 2963 Wawae Road, Kalaheo: Ms. Yukimura
moved to receive C 2014-28 for the record, seconded by Mr. Kagawa.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Dill, I put this in the agenda item as
once we allocate moneys for CIP, it is at times the...and I say a few times, the
Administration has redirected moneys for other projects that have raised priorities
over what was initially planned at budget time. In particular on this road, I
understand there was some discovery made about a portion of the road that we
needed to acquire for safety reasons and the money originally earmarked for that
was in fact used for acquisition for some property, but I would like you to kind of
take us through that history so we understand what is happening there and what
we are going to do after the need has been made to repave and correct some of the
safety issues with guardrails. Could you walk us through this critical period here?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Mr. Dill: Good morning Council Chair and
Councilmembers. For the record, Larry Dill, County Engineer. We did do a little
bit of discovery. I actually did not bring the details of the discovery with me, but I
can speak to that without perhaps the specific dates and et cetera of what
happened. It was asked of us what moneys were appropriated, encumbered, and
expended towards improvements on Wawae Road. We looked at the history and
some years ago, I forget which fiscal year in particular. I believe fifty thousand
dollars ($50,000) was appropriated by the Council at the Administration's request
for the expressed purpose of acquiring some property in order to improve the safety
of a particular area where the County, I believe, was encroaching on a private
property. The County did the mapping effort and did an appraisal of the property.
The mapping was consummated to say it was consummated. I believe that the
amount of the actual cost at the end of the day was around twenty-three thousand
dollars ($23,000) and then the remaining funds lapsed back into the General Fund.
So, none of that effort was intended as a guardrail improvement project or anything
like that. I believe it was simply to address an encroachment issue that was
brought up at that time some years ago.
Chair Furfaro: It was my understanding that the reason the
money was made available was to correct the encroachment issue, but also to install
guardrails.
Mr. Dill: No, that is not my understanding.
Chair Furfaro: Okay.
Mr. Dill: Now, specifically with regards to guardrails
along Wawae Road, we did received as I had mentioned in my E-mailed
communications, with a resident and yourself that we received an inquiry I believe
last summer or so, maybe early summer to look into that issue. That was passed
onto our Engineering Division and I apologize. We have somewhat of an exodus of
Engineers from Engineering Division this past summer and it did not happen. So,
when it was recently brought to our attention again we have gone out and done a
quick investigation and looked at locations along Wawae Road that using standard
guardrail warranting criteria that would warrant installation of guardrails. We
have done that initial investigation and I have asked for an initial cost estimate. It
COUNCIL MEETING 31 JANUARY 29, 2014
is in the neighborhood of seven hundred eighteen thousand dollars ($718,000) if we
were going to do all of these locations at the same time. I have sent that back to ask
them to prioritize that knowing that it is a big number. I am not sure we could
accommodate all of that work at once. Right now in the current fiscal year, there
are no funds appropriated so that would be something for consideration in the
upcoming fiscal year CIP proposal that will be forthcoming as part of our budget
discussions.
Chair Furfaro: That money you just told us about Larry,
and I say in your response to me in the E-mail, there is dialogue going on with the
Administration about prioritizing? Are you familiar with some of these shots here?
Mr. Dill: No, I have not seen those.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Well, I am going to ask that we give
Mr. Dill a copy of these. These are what seems to be somewhat of the minimum
road standard of maybe a sixteen (16) foot road width, but they encroach on some
pretty shallow hills and cliffs. Am I correct? This is probably the sixteen (16) foot
roadway width?
Mr. Dill: I am not going to guess based on
photographs, but it is narrow. I agree.
Chair Furfaro: It is narrow. So, what would be the
approach of prioritizing or studying this road? Originally, questions were about the
repaving, but now it is seems that the need to address safety concerns certainly
surfaces to the top first. Of that seven hundred eighteen thousand dollars
($718,000) that is recommended for guardrails, has that even been prioritized like
we do them over an increment of years?
Mr. Dill: Well, that is the steps that we are at.
Engineering Division has come back and there are basically four (4) sections, four
(4) areas, that they are recommending guardrails being installed would sum to
approximately, our initial preliminary estimate is about seven hundred twenty
thousand dollars ($720,000) and they have prioritized those for me as areas that are
most critical. It is the most dangerous areas to start with. So, that is how we will
try to prioritize that when we submit that to the (inaudible). If there is funding
available, we would like to take of all of it, but obviously we have limited resources
and a lot of things to address.
Chair Furfaro: Seven hundred twenty thousand dollars
($720,000) as far as linear fee I guess, is the measurement of that, what does that
represent in total length of improvement.
Mr. Dill: If you are bear with me for a moment. Total
is about one (1) mile.
Ms. Yukimura: Huh?
Mr. Dill: About one (1) mile.
Chair Furfaro: That is one (1) mile?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
COUNCIL MEETING 32 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Larry, what I would like to do is I
would like to allow a little extra time, maybe twenty (20) minutes for this
presentation on the road and I am going to keep it simply to some descriptions so
that we all know what the citizen's issues are and then I will call you back a little
bit to talk about some of those planning steps.
Mr. Dill: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: Does that work for you?
Mr. Dill: Sure. I have also been asked to address Lae
Road. Do you want to defer that until later?
Chair Furfaro: We will come back with that as a second
piece.
Mr. Dill: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: Let us see a presentation. Come right up,
yes.
ANNE JANELLE: Good morning Chair Furfaro.
Chair Furfaro: Please sit right there.
Ms. Janelle: Good morning Chair Furfaro and Council.
Thank you for taking the time to listen to me about my Wawae Road issue.
Actually, it is not just me; it is the residents of the road. I am Anne Janelle. Sorry.
I reside at 2820-A Wawae Road in Kalaheo.
Chair Furfaro: Anne, this is what I am going to do. I am
going to allow you to work with my staff because I know this request came from
many of the residents, but I am going to give you about twenty (20) minutes to
make a presentation through the slides.
Ms. Janelle: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: And that is not typical procedure, but
because you are representing that community, I am going to determine to give you
up to twenty (20) minutes.
Ms. Janelle: I appreciate that.
Chair Furfaro: Jenelle is going to be working with you and I
am going to move my seat. I am going to ask the Councilmembers to hold their
questions until we see your whole presentation.
Ms. Janelle: Okay. I would like to give an overview first
before I...
Chair Furfaro: It is your twenty (20) minutes. Go right
ahead.
COUNCIL MEETING 33 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Janelle: Initially, this issue was about where the fire
was that caused the drop off on Wawae Road which is the pictures that you have
there. Wally Kudo prepared these documents for us through Mario Antonio.
Because I was doing this and I was gone a lot to the Mainland, my mother was ill, I
did not get a chance to do this sooner. Years ago, the road was approved for paving.
They never took care of the shoulders or the drainage issues. Every time it rains,
there is mud on both sides of the road and people have to drive in the mud which
can be up to this high to try to pass. So, the road has become broken and I made
many phone calls. I talked to, I know I made phone calls before I met with Mario
Antonio actually which was when this was prepared here. So, it has been way
before that when I went in and I visited with him and Ed Renaud about the
situation. The concern is number one, safety. This was the first initial issue. When
the fire happened I actually called the Fire Department, they came, and they hosed
down the tree which is very close to road probably within three (3) or four (4) feet,
but they also washed away whatever was there for the shoulder and also washed
away everything up to the road. The dirt eroded underneath the road so there is a
two hundred (200) foot drop there and that is on the curve. If somebody hits that,
they are going to go down in the valley and somebody is going to die. I do not know
how anything else could happen. So, that is my first concern. Also, we have had
really poor maintenance on our road. Nobody comes and cleans the guinea grass.
Actually, in my pictures the area that you see there, you cannot even decipher it
because it is all grass. So, people that do not live on our road, we do not have
lighting on our road. From my house which is on the Pu'uwai Road side, all the way
to the Kuli Road — Kikala Road split and the cement driveway. Anyway, it is just
kind of a mess and because there is no drainage and there is no shoulder work, a lot
of the driveways are coming apart. The road is cracking and it was kind of sad to
see our road come this way after all of the years that it took to get it paved.
Chair Furfaro: What we will do now is we will go to your
slides.
Ms. Janelle: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: This is a very unusual piece, but it is because
of the safety reason that I have allowed it to be presented to us.
Ms. Janelle: I really appreciate that.
Chair Furfaro: Unfortunately, I believe only Ed is the only
Engineer that is still with us that you have referenced.
Ms. Janelle: Right, and I did see him when I saw Mario
Antonio. I walked in the office and said, "I need to talk to somebody." This is not
working for us and of course I have the biggest mouth.
Chair Furfaro: So what we are going to do, I am going to let
you make the presentation. The timing for us is one where we certainly are going to
be in the next sixty (60) days into a budget mode.
Ms. Janelle: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: We will be looking at a new CIP budget
projected for the Roads Division. I think some of the safety items that pointed out
on the guardrails should be prioritized.
COUNCIL MEETING 34 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Janelle: Okay, good.
Chair Furfaro: But the Council can allocate the money, the
prioritization, you will need to continue to work with the Mayor's Office and
Mr. Dill. He is here and is open to listen to these concerns. So, you make your
presentation.
Ms. Janelle: Okay. Thank you. This is the corner of
Wawae Road and Pu'uwai Road. The guinea grass that you see there is covering a
drainage area. It is never cleaned and mud runs across the road over there and it
just pools across the road. Next. This is way out of order. This is another area you
can see. This is across from the fire. See on the right hand side looks like dirt.
There used to be paving there and it is all broken up and there is no more. Next.
This is actually next to where the fire is. Trees fell down, people cut their branches,
they throw them across the road, and it actually coves the area of concern. This is
at the fire from the right hand side of the road. You can see that there is a cliff
there, but there are all kinds of branches and things there. People dump their
rubbish down there. On the other side you see the hillside is dirt. There are hau
trees there, but there used to hand like a tree tunnel there and somehow or another
it has all come down to the road and people push it off the road down the hill. This
is also, can you turn that? You cannot? Okay. It is catty-wampus. This is also
across the street from the fire. These trees are dead. One of them has been cut
down and when they knocked it down, they busted up part of the road to throw it in
the valley. This other tree here needs to come down. This is part of where the road
could be extended on that hillside over there to help the guardrail. This is a picture
of that area where the hillside has come down onto the road. There is absolutely no
shoulder on the mauka side of the hill. This is another driveway in that area that
has been destroyed from the weather and the mud. Here, there is a cliffside here.
There are houses. This is actually before that. The residents puts these little...
Ms. Yukimura: Can we give her a pointer?
Ms. Janelle: Stakes. Can you not hear me?
Chair Furfaro: Could we get a laser pointer for her?
Ms. Janelle: Let me see if I can work this. These stakes
here, the resident that lives across the street put them there so that nobody would
knock down their mailboxes. Also, right on the other side of those mailboxes even
though there is foliage there, that goes straight down into the valley. This is
actually prior to that. You can sort of see both sides of the road where the hau tree
is hanging there. This is actually before that when you are leaving where I live.
You can see how some of'the residents have mowed on both sides. If it was not for
the residents, that would be growing into the road. This is at the beginning of
Pu`uwai Road. There is a drive over there. Actually somebody has to redo their
driveway because it was all broken up and you can see that — no. Actually, this is
past my house where they have kept the sides of the roads clean and they have
planted foliage in order to protect the hillsides. Right there, let me see if I can
point. Right in that spot right there, there is actually a drainage ditch there. It is
down one foot (1) foot to eighteen (18) inches deep into the ground and the grass
kind of covers it. So, if somebody goes in there, actually is has happened a few
times. Their car is going to be damaged. This is across the street from my house.
Every time it rains that water pools out halfway into the road and it has destroyed
the end of their driveway and also all of the paving that was done in that area. Just
COUNCIL MEETING 35 JANUARY 29, 2014
go to the next one Yvette. This is actually prior to my house. This is the severe
area. You can see the roadway is from there to there. So, there is not much road
left. This hillside has come down and that is all mud on that side and this is all
mud on this side. So, when people are trying to get here, somebody has to drive in
the mud. You can see here, this area right here, although it is not muddy right
now, that dirt turns to mud and that becomes six (6) inches deep. This is the same
way here and the road is breaking because there is no drainage. This is at the
beginning. This actually is cement I think here. I am not sure who put this cement
here, but it has helped this portion of the road. This is the main corner right there
at Pu'uwai Road and Wawae Road where this is the drainage ditch and every time
somebody goes around this corner they drive in the mud. This hillside comes down
with mud. This is the same corner, the beginning. This is sideways. This is
actually the continuation of Wawae Road from the Kikala Road — Wawae Road —
Ku li Road split. This road is completely broken. There were apparently some water
problems there and somebody went and dug up the road and they never fixed the
road afterwards. This is actually where things have fallen down the hillside and has
gone across the road on the other side of my truck into that valley over there. There
are a lot of hau trees there. This is the Wawae Road — Kikala Road — Kuli Road
split right there. These road signs right here, all of a sudden they appeared one
day. They are new signs. I had requested road signs for fifteen miles an hour
(15 mph) on our portion of the road because the road is so damaged there. We have
more traffic on our road now then we have ever had before. Also, people walk their
dogs, their children, they ride their horse, and so it is very dangerous.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, I am going to interrupt you here to let
you know that we are going to have to move a little quicker through the slides. You
have three (3) more minutes, I have to follow rules, so...
Ms. Janelle: I am almost done. This is actually the
cement driveway. You can see where there are holes on both sides of the road. This
is the road and on the right hand side here there was somebody that built a house.
They threw cement in here, whatever, but if you go off that side, you are actually
going down three (3) or four (4) inches off of the side. More pictures of the drive.
Yes, this is upside down, but over on the right hand side there is kind of a ditch
there and I think that there are pipes exposed somewhere. More damage to the
road. Yes, I did not get a good picture there. I got me instead. This is more bad
side of the road. This is where the pipe is exposed on the right hand side, but you
cannot really see it, and that is another picture. There is the pipe exposure. It has
totally destroyed this whole area right here. That was all paved across and because
of the rain it has eroded all the side there. I think that is enough Yvette. Yes. Oh,
wait. See that right there? Go back. Just this last one. Go back one (1) to the next
picture. That one right there. This is the split. When you come up the cement
drive it is like this, it is a steep incline and to turn you have to gun to go around.
You have to drive into these people's property which I do not know there is an
easement for, in order to turn to the right. It needs to be graded off there so that
you can make the proper turn. This is all damage from weather. That is good
enough. Thank you. Yvette has the pictures. I will number them in order and I am
going to keep them for you so that you can see. So, you can see what the dilemma
is. It might seem like not too much, but the more the bad weather comes, we
actually have not gotten hit too hard in Kalaheo, but when we do, it is going to get
worse. Trees are going to come down, branches are going to come down. That
covered area, we have our own little tree tunnel there. There are all of these vines
hanging on the lines and I have asked a million times for somebody to do it and they
do not do it.
COUNCIL MEETING 36 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: We will ask Mr. Dill to come up now. I have
used my personal authority to let you have some time to present.
Ms. Janelle: I really appreciate that. I figured you
needed to see the whole picture.
Chair Furfaro: But do not go far, no. Just stay right there.
Ms. Janelle: Oh, stay here?
Chair Furfaro: Yes. Mr. Dill will come up in a moment, but
I want to see if there are questions from Councilmembers directed to you and then
we will bring him up.
Ms. Janelle: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: I do want to clarify one thing, that the
driveways are in fact the responsibility of the landowner.
Ms. Janelle: I understand that.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, good.
Ms. Janelle: But some of the paving though, actually was
supposed to be — they made the side of the road shorter even though their driveway,
they are responsible, but the connection between the two is very damaged.
Chair Furfaro: That was very visible there, but I needed to
say that.
Ms. Janelle: I understand what you are saying. Because
pooling and ponding is actually an issue. I have discussed these issues with Mel in
the past. We had a great set of pictures before, but they have disappeared into the
woodwork that actually showed ponding. We had a really bad problem with
mosquitoes, so we do not want to have that if we can help it.
Chair Furfaro: Well, understood. One of the reasons I
looked as I knew you had been talking with various members and their Committees,
but I made a promise to put this on the full Council agenda so that we could all see
what the issues are.
Ms. Janelle: And I appreciate it.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa, you have the floor.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Anne for your
presentation. I think the pictures, you may have missed few, but I think they
clearly show some need for road improvements and safety problems with the
ditches, almost cliffs in some cases. Of your meetings with some of the community
members, have there been a number counted as far as how much cars have actually
I guess, gone off the edge at any point?
Ms. Janelle: You mean down the hill?
COUNCIL MEETING 37 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: Yes, off any of those.
Ms. Janelle: You mean where it gets muddy?
Mr. Kagawa: Well, have any cars actually gone off the
shoulders because I guess...
Ms. Janelle: When you are driving you are passing
somewhere, every time you are going into those muddy areas, every single time.
Mr. Kagawa: No, but has anybody actually gone off the
side?
Ms. Janelle: No, they have not. We have not had an
accident yet.
Mr. Kagawa: Okay.
Ms. Janelle: I know many years ago somebody went down
in the valley right past my house, but that was not related to the road.
Mr. Kagawa: I guess the reason I ask is that my uncle has
a house on Kikala Road and we use those roads that you are talking about as a
shortcut to get to Lihu`e, to get east. That is where you have that sharp turnaround
where you have to make a three-point turn to make that turn.
Ms. Janelle: Right, and that is a very bad area right
there.
Mr. Kagawa: So, I am kind of familiar with those roads
from before and I know that it does not really accommodate two-way traffic well.
One (1) car has to actually stop. I guess the local knowledge, I guess people can
pretty much handle it as far as knowing that...
Ms. Janelle: Oh, if somebody is coming? That is true.
Chair Furfaro, the presiding officer, relinquished Chairmanship to
Mr. Chock.
Mr. Kagawa: But I guess my concern is that when you
have people without that local knowledge or you have people that are just speeding,
then you could have seem really deadly situations. To your knowledge, there is
nobody that said they know of a case where they actually...
Ms. Janelle: Somebody has gone into the ditch, the one
ditch that is covered with grass.
Mr. Kagawa: Somebody went into that?
Ms. Janelle: Several years ago.
Mr. Kagawa: Okay, because I know that the appearance of
the foliage makes it seem like you can actually go to the side, but some places...
COUNCIL MEETING 38 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Janelle: You cannot.
Mr. Kagawa: Yes, the foliage is so high that it masks...
Ms. Janelle: The pictures actually do not do it too much
justice. You actually have to see it. I know that Ed Renaud has some people out
there. I am not sure if it was Wally Kudo who went out and did this investigation
and took these pictures, because actually that is the best picture of the fire area. In
my pictures, you cannot see where it is because it is overgrown and we have a lot of
elderly people that live in our area. So, you make the wrong six (6) inch turn and
you are going to be in the valley.
Mr. Kagawa: Regarding the overgrowth problem, have you
made a request as to what kind of timetable they gave you as far as when they
would be...
Ms. Janelle: Cleaning?
Mr. Kagawa: Cleaning that area?
Ms. Janelle: No. Nobody will tell me.
Mr. Kagawa: Well, actually I did. About a month ago.
Ms. Janelle: Oh, was that you I talked to?
Mr. Kagawa: Um, no. Actually, I had another request
from a resident on Kikala Road and it was about two (2) months ago. I guess he
was going through the proper authority and I believe that was Scott Suga in charge
of the roads maintenance. I guess the E-mail that he received and forwarded to me
was that the road crew was currently in Koke`e and they were moving east.
Ms. Janelle: Down.
Mr. Kagawa: And he said that it is not their practice to
jump all over the place. That did not really sit well with the person on Kikala Road
because the person on Kikala Road said that he witnessed a near accident because
of the overgrowth, it is narrow, and there are people that speed down the road.
Anyway, that was the answer that I got that they do not jump around. I guess...
Ms. Janelle: They have not been on our road for an
extremely long time. The residents come...
Mr. Kagawa: When was the last time that the place was...
Ms. Janelle: That I saw anything?
Mr. Kagawa: ...that place was maybe cleared that you can
remember?
Ms. Janelle: A long time ago.
Mr. Kagawa: A long time?
COUNCIL MEETING 39 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Janelle: Yes. The residents are actually doing some
of the cleaning now because it is dangerous.
Mr. Kagawa: And that is my second point. I also talked to
a worker with the crew and he suggested that my uncle go and clean his area
because he said other residents are cleaning theirs and then I kind of countered and
said that well, if it is our responsibility as the County property, we should as much
as possible try and do it because sometimes we do not like when residents do it a
certain way, right? I do not know. We are kind of at a point where I guess if you
want it safe, we are telling our resident do it yourself, but I guess the residents need
to know when the County is actually going to be there so they may wait.
Ms. Janelle: When I see people come and working
actually right past my house, there was a bunch of hau trees there. I am not sure,
but I think it was the County came and cut them down and they just cut them and
dropped them.
Mr. Kagawa: Did not remove the rubbish?
Ms. Janelle: No. It never happens like that. They
assume that it belongs to the person that lives over the fence. I am trying to think
of her name.
Mr. Kagawa: It is okay.
Ms. Janelle: I will think of her name. Well, anyway there
is a lady that owns all of the valley property from my house all the way to the
cement drive. So, people that have cut giant trees on the mountain side have
dumped them in the valley. It has happened like that for a really long time.
Mr. Kagawa: I guess my last comment is having seen
those roads, having driven those roads, I do not want to make it seem like an easy
task because that area mauka of Kalawai Park, there is a lot of things that need to
be done and improved. Larry, I do not know where we start, but I think we need to
I guess address the most dangerous situations first and then we need to move on.
We cannot just ignore the problem.
Ms. Janelle: You see that cone right there in that picture?
Mr. Kagawa: Yes.
Ms. Janelle: I called the Police Department after the fire
and I said, "Somebody is going to get hurt here." I made a report and somebody
came and they put a cone. Three (3) or four (4) days later, the cone disappears.
They put a cone there I think probably while they were there. I think they took
their cone away. I have never seen a cone or nobody has come and cleaned that
area specifically because if you do not see it, you do not know it. People drive on our
road that do not live there. They are actually kind of afraid because we do not have
any street lights from where I live all the way to the Kuli Road — Kikala Road —
Wawae Road split. There are no street lights.
Mr. Kagawa: Like I said, there are a lot of pictures that
show a lot of need for some kind of work to be done by the County. I thank you for
your presentation and I will be asking more questions of Larry later. Mahalo.
COUNCIL MEETING 40 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Janelle: Thank you.
Mr. Chock: Council Chair Furfaro stepped out.
Councilmembers, any more questions for Anne? Thank you. Councilmember
Yukimura.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes. Hi, Anne. Thank you for being here.
Ms. Janelle: Thank you.
Ms. Yukimura: You make reference to the fire. Please
forgive me, but could you tell me about this fire? When was it?
Ms. Janelle: I am trying to think now. I was gone back
and forth for maybe about three (3) years, probably five (5) or more years ago.
Somebody threw a cigarette and it was a smoldering fire. From my house which is
at the edge of the valley, I could see the fire in the tree. So, I called the Fire
Department and they came and put out the fire. Actually, they had to come back
because it started to smolder again I think a day or so later. It washed it away. I
would have to literally go back and try to find the dates when that happened
because I was gone so much.
Ms. Yukimura: But what impact did the fire have on the
road situation?
Ms. Janelle: When the Fire Department came and they
used our water hose, they were shooting at the tree, but at the same time they were
shooting at whatever shoulder was there. So, they washed away all of the dirt. If
you go there, the edge is like right here and it goes straight down.
Ms. Yukimura: Is this it?
Ms. Janelle: That is the picture.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay.
Ms. Janelle: Now people are throwing tree branches and
rubbish down there. They cut their trees and they go throw it over there.
Ms. Yukimura: How wide was it before the fire, from the
pavement toward the valley or the ravine?
Ms. Janelle: It was probably, I thought the road was
eighteen (18) feet across when they paved it. Somebody called me recently and I
thought it was Larry and I have to apologize to Larry. They said our road was
subpar so it is not as wide as a regular road, but that area right there, there are two
(2) driveways across. I think there is a photo in that set of pictures right there that
shows the two (2) driveways that are joined just like this. So, there is extra room
over there so it is easier for people to go around on that side, but people drive like
maniacs through there. We are getting way more traffic than we used to have. We
have a lot of trucks. They have been doing a lot of building. They are driving
cranes and giant dump trucks and things down the roads. So, I am not sure what
the weight limit is supposed to be actually for Wawae Road.
COUNCIL MEETING 41 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: It is probably part of the implications of
agricultural land development. A lot of new subdivisions up there.
Ms. Janelle: I am sorry.
Ms. Yukimura: Are there new agricultural subdivisions up
there?
Ms. Janelle: I am not sure, but there has been a few new
large homes built on the mountainside up there in that area.
Ms. Yukimura: So, did you make a request for guardrails?
Ms. Janelle: Yes, I did.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, and this one (1) mile of guardrails, is
that in response to your request or maybe we need Mr. Dill here?
Ms. Janelle: I do not know. Larry probably has the
information. I am not sure. I do not know how long that guardrail would have to
be.
Mr. Chock: I know Larry probably has a presentation
that he wants to go through as well. Do we have any further questions?
Ms. Yukimura: No, he does not. He does not have a
PowerPoint.
Mr. Chock: I know he said he had a presentation, but for
the sake of other Councilmembers and you can definitely not lose track of that
question. Are there any specific questions for Anne before we bring Larry up? If
not, and maybe you want to stay as well.
Ms. Janelle: Oh, I will stay.
Mr. Chock: Larry, can we ask for you to come up as well?
Did you want to present on the specifics? I know we wanted to hear from her first.
Mr. Dill: For the record, Larry Dill, County Engineer.
My understanding has been that we were concerned about safety about the drop offs
et cetera on the side. So, that was our recent investigation that we did. There are
obviously a lot of other issues that were brought up during the presentation. As the
Council knows, we have gone through all of our inventory of County roads and done
an assessment as to roads that should be prioritized for our next Island-Wide
Resurfacing Project. So, obviously this road would be a candidate for inclusion as
being prioritized for resurfacing and reconstruction. Some of the issues, I have been
taking notes. There are concerns about maintenance like vegetation being cut back
et cetera. One of the issues I will just note for the Council and for the resident is
that vegetation that encroaches on the power lines, we stay away from. Kaua`i
Island Utility Cooperative (KIUC) has to take care of those because we are not
qualified or I think even authorized to address those issues. Certainly other areas
where there are overhanging branches or trees on the road, we would address those.
So, we will look into that and see what can be done. Short of inclusion in the
Island-Wide Resurfacing Project, if there are other areas that are imminent safety
COUNCIL MEETING 42 JANUARY 29, 2014
hazards, we will take a look at something that should be done in advance to the
Island-Wide Resurfacing Project. Let me ask one (1) thing and it was brought up
before or maybe I misunderstood. I may have said this road is substandard, and so
when I said that the road is substandard what I am saying is the County has
certain road standards as everybody knows, the width of pavement and for drainage
swales on either side. Also, we all know there are many County roads that the
County has come into ownership of that do not meet those standards. This is a very
narrow winding road with in some places, no opportunities without building
substantial retaining walls and et cetera to provide a new sort of roadway shoulder
to accommodate standard drainage swales. From that standpoint, it is a
substandard road. That by no means disqualifies its permitting our attention. So, I
apologize if I was not clear on that communication before.
Ms. Janelle: I am unaware of how wide the roads are
supposed to be. I think I put that in my memorandum to all of you. Was that you
that I talked to the other day? Someone called me from the County and told me
that the road was subpar. That was the term that was used to me. I do not know
who it was. I thought it was you.
Mr. Dill: At any rate, I would say that nevertheless,
there are things that we might may be able to look at to help some of the drainage
issues and et cetera in those areas short of doing something that meets our
standards.
Mr. Chock: Alright. Councilmember Yukimura.
Ms. Yukimura: I think we need to clear here that we at this
point, it is not our goal to bring all the road on Kaua`i up to the current standards of
width for example, because they are roads that existed prior to our standards. Now,
we should be asking the questions whether we should be allowing more
development along the road if it is substandard and that is an issue for the
Planning Department and the Planning Commission. But in terms of Public Works
responsibility and our goals as a County I think certainly, repairs for imminent
danger and safety, we want to do. My question is Larry, when are we going to see
the report which I have been waiting for, for about five (5) years of the
comprehensive assessment of our roads and how much total it is going to cost us to
bring it up to a preventive maintenance routine? When are we going to see that? I
am trusting the latest we are going to see that is this budget session, but I would
even request if it is ready for us to see it earlier so we can think about it before
budget session. To me, I would be more willing to raise the weight tax that is
pending before us if I saw a plan about how that money was going to be expended
rather than just raising it in a vacuum because I think the taxpayers do not mind
when we raise taxes if we show how it is going to be used and there is a nexus
between weight and road damage. What is the status, when will we get that report?
There being no objections, Chairmanship was returned to Council
Chair Furfaro.
Mr. Dill: We have completed the assessment
inspection of all of the roads. So, we do have the information. We are still working
on implementing the plan to have a comprehensive maintenance plan and schedule
in place. I do not have a date for you that I can say right now at this meeting.
COUNCIL MEETING 43 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Well, I hope you are aiming for this budget
because we are all expecting it. We were told that it was going to be prepared for
this budget.
Mr. Dill Right.
Ms. Yukimura: You had already done a rough assessment
last budget. I saw the...and I was impressed by the chart that showed zero (0)
years of life left, fifteen (15) years of life left or whatever, but I am expecting more
than that this year. So, you do not...
Mr. Dill: I do not have a date for you as I said earlier.
Ms. Yukimura: Chair, we do need, that date because I am
assuming it is coming at budget. I would like it earlier to give us some time to
really dig into it and understand it, but if not earlier, at least by budget. I am
expecting that. I think we were told we could expect it.
Chair Furfaro: The expectation is Larry, that we were told
that we would have it. I think it is fair to say that at minimum at least two (2)
weeks before we get into budget session, we should have some dedicated discussion
about repair, maintenance, and the ongoing needs assessments for the Roads
Division. So, please do expect that from me and I will try and get you a date as
early as possible.
Mr. Dill: Alright.
Ms. Yukimura: May I continue?
Chair Furfaro: Yes, continue please.
Ms. Yukimura: With respect to the guardrails that you
mentioned, one (1) mile of guardrails at a cost of seven hundred twenty thousand
dollars ($720,000)?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Were you going to get back to us about where
the guardrails are propose for or do you know at this point?
Mr. Dill: We have some preliminary indication of the
locations we would put the guardrails in. So, we have tallied all of that up. I do not
really want to share details because it is very quick and dirty what we have done in
order to prepare for this Council Meeting, but we will be of course, tidying that up
and then presenting that before you in much more detail by the time we get to
budget time.
Ms. Yukimura: If you think about putting a guardrail here,
to me, the guardrail would be in danger of eroding within five (5) years. Maybe I
am misinterpreting the soil structure of this narrow, what looks like about one (1)
foot. If you put that footings of the guardrail you might erode further. I am not an
engineer, but there are issues of whether you can put guardrails where there should
be guardrails.
COUNCIL MEETING 44 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Dill: Right.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, let us say for this purpose because I do
want to get to the next Bill before we break for lunch. Let us say that my
expectations Larry, on the one (1) mile of guardrails would be one that you show a
high priority over a three (3) year period that says incrementally where we would be
putting these safety items in a three (3) year plan and maybe let us talk about that
before we get capital discussion. I am sorry, we are recognizing the Engineer now
and I am going to recognize the Vice Chair, then Mr. Kagawa again, and then I will
ask you to comment on the pictures.
Ms. Janelle: Okay, thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead.
Mr. Chock: Thank you, Chair. Without getting into the
broader issue of diversion of water, Larry, can you move into some response to the
drainage issue which is really the underlying issue to all of the things that are
happening on this road and what we can to respond to that? Thank you.
Mr. Dill: I have seen the pictures as were presented
here today, so I acknowledge that there are certain drainage issues. I am reluctant
to go much further as far as how we can respond to those without sending our
Engineering Division out there to review, inspect, and come back with
recommendations.
Chair Furfaro: Is it fair for us to expect though, after seeing
the picture you will be sending some engineers out to make an assessment?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: That is fair to assume?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. Larry, I discussed our
maintenance plan for the overgrowth earlier and then I got into this conversation
that I had with Mr. Suga and you have seen those copies of those E-mails regarding
the area, Kikala Road and all of that area up there. I think they said that two (2)
moths ago I think they were up in Koke`e and working their way east. Where are
we right now?
Mr. Dill: I could not tell you exactly where we are
right now, somewhere near the West Side.
Mr. Kagawa: Are we still in Koke`e or have we moved
down to Waimea?
Mr. Dill: Well, they might be on Koke`e, but I know
that they are on the West Side working their way east. I could not tell you exactly
the status of our maintenance crews are at.
COUNCIL MEETING 45 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: Can we maybe find out a projected time so
we can give Anne some kind of date as to when she can tell her community that
they will be doing growth maintenance in that area? The alternative like I said,
was that I had a worker on that crew tell me that certain residents are not cleaning
the frontage of their areas and perhaps that is the short-term solution, however, I
think it would be nice to at least let the residents know when they are coming so
that they do not go clean their area a week before the County crews are there with
their heavy equipment. Just generally, is it fair to say that we are very
short-handed with road maintenance cleaning ability?
Mr. Dill: The way things grow on this island, we could
always use more staff to keep with cutting back vegetation.
Mr. Kagawa: What is realistic for a community to expect
road maintenance such a Kalaheo where it is wet and there is a lot guinea grass
and what have you?
Mr. Dill: I would have to get back to you on that. I
know they have a schedule to get around all of the various parts of the island. I
would have to get back to you on that answer.
Mr. Kagawa: Okay. I was just wondering if you had just
general —it would be nice if we can get out there every half a year.
Mr. Dill: I am sorry. I do not have an answer for you.
Mr. Kagawa: Okay. Alright. My final question. What
kind of pipe was that that was exposed on that shoulder?
Mr. Dill: I did not see that in picture.
Mr. Kagawa: You did not see that in the picture that she
showed of that pipe?
Mr. Dill: No.
Mr. Kagawa: Because if it is a water pipe, I would think
that we would contact the Department of Water and they would not want that pipe
exposed because if a tire goes over a rock or something, it will puncture the pipe if
you have a heavy truck I would think. So, if we can kind of relay that. It looks like
a water pipe to me.
Mr. Dill: Okay.
Mr. Kagawa: I am not sure. Thank you, Chair.
Chair Furfaro: I am going to go back to you so you can
comment on the picture, just to comment on that picture.
Ms. Janelle: Can you hear me now? Yes, one of the other
photos from across the road where the street sign is, there is a double drive there.
Yes. Right behind there is kind of a double drive. You really cannot see it like that
because they did not photograph it. So, that is actually across from where the fire
took place. So, people have been driving into that area to try to go around. I do not
COUNCIL MEETING 46 JANUARY 29, 2014
know what can be done about that, an easement maybe into there. I do not know
where the actual line is for that. So, that is a consideration in order to be able to
put the guardrail far enough in for protection where the land will not disappear in
five (5) years. Also, that pipe...
Chair Furfaro: Alright. Now, in this procedure when we
direct a question directly at you, it has to come from a new question. No additional.
Was there a question posed by one of the Councilmembers?
Ms. Janelle: Yes, about the pipe.
Chair Furfaro: Okay.
Ms. Janelle: I am not sure what kind of pipe it is. It could
be a water pipe. When the big trucks come down the cement drive, they actually
drive over that.
Chair Furfaro: Larry, it looks like a three-quarter (%) inch
water line to maybe one (1) or two (2) houses. So, you might want to raise that with
the Water Department. Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you. Larry, when do you think you
would be able to get an inspector out or an engineer out?
Mr. Dill: Within a week.
Mr. Rapozo: Within a week? I guess Mr. Chair, would it
be appropriate to refer this to the Public Works Committee and have a follow-up? I
have to say, I have to apologize to Ms. Janelle because how many years ago was
that, that you put together that packet? I am looking at the background
information that we were provided here and we had some activity in 2005, so I am
not sure. It would probably about that time. She had put together, and this
proceeds Larry by many, many years. So, I want to make that clear, that this is
Larry's first introduction to this issue. Anne had put together an excellent
documented packet of what was going on, on Wawae Road and this area and I do
not know what happened to that packet. I thought it had gone across to Public
Works, but there is no record of them receiving it or us sending it. So, I am not sure
what occurred, but I am concerned about those areas that are unsafe for the drivers,
the vehicles. I know it is seven hundred plus thousand dollars ($700,000+) a mile,
but I mean, there are some of these areas and throughout the island. A lot of these
mauka roads up in Lawa`i in that area are going through the same thing, but we
have to start somewhere. I am not sure. I do not think it will take one (1) mile of
guardrails to take care of this problem. There are some areas that look like a very
short span would at least mitigate some of those safety issues and that is my
biggest concern right now especially with the overgrowth where we can determine
that there is a substantial drop off that we probably have to look at some emergency
funding or whatever it takes to get those up there. So, if it is going to take you one
(1) week, I guess, maybe Mr. Chair, Public Works Committee not next week but the
meeting after that. That would be in three (3) weeks. That would give you time
Larry, to come back with an assessment and recommendations for this body. Is that
something that you could do?
Mr. Dill: I will certainly have an inspector up there
within one (1) week. Some of the drainage issues, as I said, we have gotten some
COUNCIL MEETING 47 JANUARY 29, 2014
preliminary findings and recommendations for the guardrails. Usually guardrails
warrants are pretty black and white, pretty straight forward. You look at the
height of the slope, the steepness of the slope, and decide whether you need a
guardrail there. The drainage issues may be a little more difficult and a little more
involved to come up with a proposed solution.
Mr. Rapozo: Well, how about just an update on the
guardrail issue?
Mr. Dill: Certainly.
Mr. Rapozo: I understand the drainage issue will take
probably some technical analysis. I am not sure, but as far as the guardrail issue in
this area, I think that would...
Mr. Dill: Well, on the guardrail issue, it is simply a
matter I think of fine tuning what we have already determined and the real next
step would be looking at budget and seeing what we can afford to do and what we
prioritize. I guess we could present to you what area we had planned to prioritize
and that would be the presentation pretty much.
Mr. Rapozo: It is more for the residents. They have been
waiting a long time and I feel partially responsible because I did take a two (2) week
vacation from the Council. So, I guess I should have followed-up better and I did
not expecting that it had already been taken care of. I have not heard from Anne,
but I did again, and I think we need to address some of these safety concerns.
Chair Furfaro: Why do we not do this? Mr. Rapozo, if you
agree to it, we will put it in Ross's Committee, we will put it in for
February 19, 2014 on which time we would expect kind of this incremental proposal
on the guardrails and any additional information you could add at that time would
be appreciated, but not mandated, but do know that we would want an update on
these roads before budget and that will show up again, in Mr. Kagawa's Committee.
Acceptable to you Mr. Kagawa?
Mr. Kagawa: Yes, thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Fine. Mel, I am going to give you my file on
this road.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, so that will be our plan. To the Clerk,
guardrail review February 19, 2014 and at least two (2) weeks prior to budget start
we will have another review on the general roadways and some solutions. Fair
enough to you, Larry?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: I need to take public testimony if there is
any and I want to start the cat dialogue before we break for lunch. We will be
asking them to come back on the 19th, if you could put that in your calendar.
Ms. Janelle: Okay.
COUNCIL MEETING 48 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Are we going to keep your pictures for now?
Ms. Janelle: Yes, and I am going to number the, put them
in order from Pu'uwai Road because that was a mess and I have made notes on the
other side of the photos because there is another issue in there that I did not
address about an abandoned house. At a late date, I would like to address that
issue.
Chair Furfaro: Well, we do not typically have you work
directly with to Chair on these agenda items...
Ms. Janelle: No, I understand.
Chair Furfaro: ...but if it is housing, then we have to start a
new agenda item. This item is going to carry out on the repair and maintenance of
the roads.
Ms. Janelle: Okay, that is fine. I really appreciate
everybody's time. This had really been an important project that I have had for
years and I am happy to be here today to present to you and I appreciate the twenty
(20) minutes to be able to show you my photos. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: You got it. Members, before I see if there is
any more testimony, what I am going to look for is I would like to receive this item
in the context it was and expand the posting for the 19th as suggested by
Mr. Rapozo. Is there anyone in the audience that would like to give any more
testimony on this item?
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: Members, I gave you an idea of what I am
wanting to do. Is there any more narrative to that point? If not, all those in...
Mr. Watanabe: Chair, we need a motion. We do not have a
motion.
Ms. Yukimura: Chair, move to refer this item to Public...
Mr. Watanabe: No, receive.
Chair Furfaro: No. I am going to say it again.
Ms. Yukimura: Oh, we are going to receive. I am sorry.
Chair Furfaro: We want to receive it because when we post
it on the 19th we are going to add some scope on the guardrails and so forth.
Ms. Yukimura moved to receive C 2014-28 for the record, seconded by
Mr. Kagawa, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Dill, thank you very much. Ms. Janelle,
thank you very much as well. I would like to get a reading and start at least on the
feline Bill. Is that how you refer to it?
COUNCIL MEETING 49 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Watanabe: Yes. Council Chair, we are on the bottom of
page 7.
There being no objections, Bill No. 2517 was taken out of order.
BILLS FOR SECOND READING:
Bill No. 2517 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE TO ESTABLISH A NEW
ARTICLE UNDER CHAPTER 22, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED,
ENTITLED CAT LICENSING PROGRAM: Mr. Bynum moved to adopt Bill
No. 2517 on second and final reading, and that is be transmitted to the Mayor for
his approval, seconded by Mr. Chock.
Chair Furfaro: We have a motion and a second to approve.
Give me that number again on page 7.
Mr. Watanabe: It is Bill No. 2517 and Chair, we have...
Chair Furfaro: This is the Bills for Second Reading?
Mr. Watanabe: Yes. We have three (3) people signed up.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, do you want to call the first one up?
Mr. Watanabe: First, we have Annette Oda, followed by
Michael Oda.
Chair Furfaro: Sure.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
Chair Furfaro: Again, members, I want to get at least to
testimony from those that want to speak before we break for lunch so people do not
have to stay the whole time. Go right ahead and introduce yourself one more time.
MICHAEL ODA: My name is Michael Oda and the subject is
cats. My reference is science laws, that is how I determined what I am going to talk
about. If some of the problem when you decide to now affect the birth rate of
animals, every organisms from the microbes to the largest animal or organism, they
kind of have a birth rate because nature changes. So, how do I come to that
understanding? Studying. So, it is not by what you think of controlling the
behavior of an organism because they have a natural tendency for how they were
created whether you believe it, understand it, or really care. It does not matter.
They have a natural behavior. For instance, if you wanted to create a mutant
product out of genetics by introducing a partial thing for your integration of your
deoxyribonucleic acid (DNA) system, without the displacement factor in the DNA
process, you are creating a compound mutant which is fallible. Anyway, if a rat is
part of the environment and the cat by nature does control rats who may interfere
with chickens, bird eggs, and things, you are causing other problems in your system
and organism all have a kind of food supply. Their kind of food supply. When they
become less and less, they start to consume other things because they do not have
an environment. So, going back to the controlling of the birth of these animals, as
the changing climate progresses, you can find yourself in very troublesome times. If
you want to say that feral cats are a problem with feces, chemicals like herbicide,
COUNCIL MEETING 50 JANUARY 29, 2014
pesticide, and fertilizer or any form of chemical can in condition, spur growth in
microorganisms or larger organisms. It can. It is not only feces. So, if one of your
concerns is prorogation of pathogens or microorganisms, well, maybe forms of
chemicals can also do that. That is part of what they consume, chemicals. There
are things that are already processed. So, they can consume that and they can grow
in condition.
Mr. Watanabe: Three (3) minutes.
Chair Furfaro: That is your first three (3) minutes.
Mr. Oda: Okay, thank you.
Chair Furfaro: No. I am going to give you your second
minutes here, three (3) minutes if you would like to summarize. Go ahead.
Mr. Oda: I do not believe how the government controls
things, but the organization to me, how they solve the problem to me, in my opinion,
is not true. It is not true. They should find other people who are much more
diverse in science and especially in this time because it is going to be very crucial in
understanding why they are doing the wrong things in trying to control the cats. I
have not mentioned cats, but it is about cats. You need to really think about this
because cats play a very important thing in the environment like all of the created
organisms from the largest to the smallest. They all play a major thing just like a
whale going five thousand (5,000) miles. There is a purpose why it goes five
thousand (5,000) miles. Everything. Cats have a purpose why they do things as the
way they do. You have to study and it does not come by written books because you
have to integrate concepts. You have to integrate the concepts of (inaudible) of
them according to the manifestation laws or you will never understand it. You
never will. It is impossible, but anyway, that is all I have to say. Thank you very
much.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you for your testimony.
Mr. Oda: Oh, you are welcome. Bye.
Chair Furfaro: Next speaker please.
Mr. Watanabe: Next speaker is Annette Oda, followed by
Charles M. Brown.
Ms. Oda: Annette Oda. Actually, I made a lot of
assumptions that the Committee would have done their research, done their study,
and come to the same conclusions. However, it does not seem like that is what
happened. So, I am in defense of the cats. Number one, I really strongly feel that if
this is really a problem which I do not even know what the problem is, we need an
independent study and I want to see the statistics of how bad a problem this is
because as far as I am concerned we read the papers, we try to keep up on the news,
we keep up on everybody's difficulties and problems on the island and that does not
seem to be number one on the topic of problems on the island. So, I would really
like to see the statistics and see how bad a problem this is to warrant this kind of
attention and money involved. I would like to have details in that with the
frequency of the problem, detailed descriptions, dates, locations, et cetera. I want to
see the whole picture of why this is such a problem that the County Council needs
COUNCIL MEETING 51 JANUARY 29, 2014
to address. Also, cats and dogs, but in this case cats in particular, are part of our
habitat. I understood that this is America. What we do on our property is our
affairs, our concern, and our business; nobody else's. In the past ships have used
cats for rat control; towns have used it; communities and homes have used them for
mainly the purpose of especially if they have a huge acreage. They use cats for rat
control and this keeps with the balance of nature. On a larger scale, prevention of
bubonic plague and I do not know. Did you folks receive my E-mail? Okay. In that,
there were facts and it showed, itemized in detail, in history all of the times that
they have been bothered by bubonic plague. Incidents as recent as December of
2013, yes last month on Los Angeles. So, we have to be more responsible in making
sure we have all of the facts. Crimes; burglary, home invasion, and trespassing. I
want to know that statistics. I want to see here on the island how bad is it because
this item relates to more of the barking dogs, but it also related to cats.
Mr. Watanabe: Three (3) minutes.
Chair Furfaro: That is your first three (3) minutes.
Ms. Oda: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: I am going to give you another three (3)
minutes.
Ms. Oda: I am going. Number five, people are
dropping off cats at Kaua`i Humane Society, but have you folks seen any kind of a
log that says exactly why they are dropping it off? It cannot be because they are
just merely stray cats. I know that some of the reasons are because some people
that are very caring they have to move or they can no longer have cats in their
possession, they cannot have them part of their family for whatever reason. They
are dropping them off thinking Kaua`i Humane Society logically, would be the best
place to go find a good home for these cats. If the Kaua`i Humane Society cannot
handle, then they should make a public announcement saying, "I am sorry, but our
facilities cannot handle any more cats. I am sorry. We cannot take them."
Albright? If they keep on persisting on collecting cats that are deposited there, I
want to see their log in the past five (5) years. How frequent and what are their
reasons for dropping them off? I would like to have the Kaua`i Humane Society
investigated on their financial accountability of their budget because I understand
that they have been given somewhere in the excess of seven hundred thousand
dollars ($700,000). I might be wrong, but I would like to know if they were even
given one dollar ($1), I would like to know why. For what purpose? I would like to
know that I trust the County Council because they are allocating a huge amount of
money to the Kaua`i Humane Society. I want to know in detail, exactly. I want
them to account for every single dollar. The Federal government, if they fund, they
give you a whole guideline of accountability that you better follow because if you do
not, then you know what, end of funding and you know that. So, what is the dollar
amount that the County Council is funding, has been funding the Kaua`i Humane
Society? I want to know exactly or where can I find that information because I have
a right to know as a citizen, as well as many other citizens on the island. I want to
know how much it has been in the last five (5) to ten (10) years. I do not want to
know just recently, I want to know now, from now to all the way back ten (10) years.
There is no transparency of Kaua`i Humane Society. It is a non-profit they claim.
They hide, but you know what, if you really look hard and you really investigate
them, they will say, "Oh, yes, we are for profit. Part of us is for profit, part of us is
for non-profit, and whatever."
COUNCIL MEETING 52 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Watanabe: Six (6) minutes.
Chair Furfaro: That is your time.
Ms. Oda: Okay, two (2) more minutes, please?
Chair Furfaro: Not two (2) more minutes. I will give you ten
(10) seconds for a summary.
Ms. Oda: Okay, ten (10) seconds. There are crimes
against cats being — I want the statistics. Did you know here on the island there
are cat haters for whatever their reason? They are being poisoned and abducted.
We have had five (5) of our Siamese cats abducted and we know abducted because
they do not wander off. I mean, they might wander off, but you know what, they
are home when it is time for feeding. They have been assaulted, they have had
injuries like blindness. Pretty cruel cat haters. They have had puncture wounds,
broken limbs, and in Guam, tree snakes ate the bird eggs. That is why no birds.
Scientific proof...
Chair Furfaro: Your time is up and I want to answer some
of your questions for you.
Ms. Oda: Good.
Chair Furfaro: First of all, the transparency with the
Historical Society...
Ms. Oda: Kaua`i Humane Society.
Chair Furfaro: Not Historical Society. I am sorry. With the
Kaua`i Humane Society is done in a quarterly report to which you as a citizen can
apply and we will respond to you for public information within a ten (10) day period.
I will personally get the last few reports for you if you would like, that identify those
operating costs. You are entitled to do that and that is why the transparency exists.
The previous years there was a budget allocation of six hundred fifty thousand
dollars ($650,000), no six hundred thousand dollars ($600,000) to the Kaua`i
Humane Society of which in the last budget session which is open to the public, a
request to increase the budget to one hundred fifty thousand dollars ($150,000)
more was made by Mr. Hooser. That measure failed. The next measure was
introduced by myself to increase the budget by one hundred thousand dollars
($100,000). All of that is well documented and that did pass to give them an
operating budget of seven hundred thousand dollars ($700,000). There are certain
requirements by State law and so forth that have expectations that the County
Council work with the Kaua`i Humane Society on certain contracted services. That
is all well documented as well and the negotiators is not the Council, but actually
the Director of Finance and you can request those reports as wells and they can get
them back to you within ten (10) days according to the regulation itself. If you
would like, I will start getting reports gathered, but anything going forward on the
new contract and so forth, you would need to go through the Mayor's Office. It is all
pretty well documented and I will be glad to fulfill those requests for you.
Ms. Oda: Question.
Chair Furfaro: You have a question?
COUNCIL MEETING 53 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Oda: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead.
Ms. Oda: Six hundred thousand dollars ($600,000),
that is from...
Chair Furfaro: Was the previous budget.
Ms. Oda: Was their previous budget?
Chair Furfaro: No, was the previous budget for the
services...
Ms. Oda: Allocation to the Kaua`i Humane Society...
Chair Furfaro: If you let me finish answering, then you will
get a clear picture.
Ms. Oda: I am just clarifying.
Chair Furfaro: That six hundred thousand dollars
($600,000) is allocated from the County to their budget. Their budget is much
larger than that and the information that I will provide you itemizes their services
and the contribution from the County. If I get that to you, I will be glad to meet
with you privately and explain the line items for you.
Ms. Oda: Wonderful.
Chair Furfaro: But let me gather that information first and
the contractual pieces, you would make that request from the Mayor's Office.
JoAnn, had a question?
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, Annette.
Ms. Oda: You are welcome.
Ms. Yukimura: You obviously own cats. So, how many cats
do you have? I am really sorry about your Siamese cats.
Ms. Oda: Why would you need to know that
information?
Ms. Yukimura: Oh, just to know your circumstances. I do
not need to know how — I might just need to know approximately just because I am
concerned about the theft or whatever you call it of your Siamese cats. My last cat
was a Siamese cat too.
Ms. Oda: What does that have to do with what is
happening here?
Ms. Yukimura: Well, because you may really be opposed to
this because you feel like it costs you money to license your cats. Is that also part of
it?
COUNCIL MEETING 54 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Oda: No.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. That is fine.
Ms. Oda: What I am opposed to — okay, yes.
Financially, it is ridiculous. Why would they impose such a heavy fine if our cats
wander? Cats naturally wander. Dogs normally wander, but cats even more so.
Ms. Yukimura: There is no fine. This is not a leash law for
cats. All it is saying is if you have a cat that goes off your property occasionally, we
want it licensed because...
Ms. Oda: So that when somebody picks up the cat or
abducts our cat which they have been doing lots of times...
Ms. Yukimura: I am so sorry.
Ms. Oda: ...and only in the recent years which is really
interesting because Kaua`i Humane Society has had such a heavy powerful rule
over all of this and they are ridiculous. They are really ridiculous.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay...
Ms. Oda: Anyway, but what I am saying is the thing is
there should not be any fines. There should not be any licensing of the cat because
if you basically understand biology, cats are not meant to be licensed, not meant to
just roam in the confidence of the property.
Chair Furfaro: Hold on one (1) second. Let us follow our
rules. You have this extra time because the Councilmember asked you a question.
Ms. Oda: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: I gave you your six (6) minutes for your
testimony. You have to focus on answering her question now, not expanding your
testimony.
Ms. Oda: Alright.
Chair Furfaro: So, JoAnn has the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead.
Ms. Yukimura: So, I am just trying to get clear about how
you understand this Bill because it is not a leash law, it does not say you have to
keep your cat leashed, all it says is if you have a cat that you let outside, which
means that sometimes it may go off your property, you need to license it. Then, in
licensing it there are variation for a neutered cat or an unneutered cat because the
unneutered cat has the potential for creating a lot more unwanted cats that create
problems for a society. We are not talking about getting rid of cats. Not in any way.
In fact, feral cats have a much shorter life than cats that are at home. So, we are
trying to reduce the number of feral cats; cats that have no owner.
COUNCIL MEETING 55 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: I need a question, JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. So, you said that if the Kaua`i
Humane Society says it cannot handle cats right now, then there may be a reason,
but unless that is so there is no reason. In fact, the Kaua`i Humane Society is
saying that they cannot handle it. How would we handle unwanted cats or the
whole cat problem if the Kaua`i Humane Society does not do that job? What would
be the alternative to the Kaua`i Humane Society?
Ms. Oda: Okay, very easy. If you go back to my first
item it says I want to know. I want to have an independent study of the statistics of
this problem. I want to try to understand what the big deal is about the cats. Why
do we have to go further...
Ms. Yukimura: But you have not answered...
Ms. Oda: ...and licensing them?
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, but...
Ms. Oda: What is the problem?
Ms. Yukimura: The Chair is going to give you the statistics
and the budget. My question is, if you say we should not give the Kaua`i Humane
Society money or this licensing Bill which helps both get revenues for the Kaua`i
Humane Society and helps to control the creation of feral cats, who will do that?
Chair Furfaro: I am going to end it right there.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, fine.
Chair Furfaro: When I get her the statistics of which I am
going to get, I will meet you privately. In that report you will find some very
interesting information that talks about statistics with cats and with dogs that the
Kaua`i Humane Society provides to us and I am going to get you a sample of that as
soon as I can and collect some more. Then within the next ten (10) days, you and I
can meet. I will be glad to meet with you and your husband to answer the questions
about their report.
Ms. Oda: So, will the report answer this question, that
there is going to be an independent study of the statistics of the...
Chair Furfaro: We already funded that study.
Ms. Oda: ...of the scope of the problem?
Chair Furfaro: We already funded a study for that and I will
get you those results too.
Ms. Oda: Okay, I do not want the results from the
Kaua`i Humane Society because that is biased.
Chair Furfaro: Well, that is your opinion. That is not mine.
I will get you the statistics that I can and it was an independent group that was
COUNCIL MEETING 56 JANUARY 29, 2014
facilitated and most of it focused on the problem with abandoned cats and so forth.
I will share that with you, but let us meet after I get you the information and I will
try and get you at least one (1) report before the day is over so you can see the
format.
Ms. Oda: That is great.
Chair Furfaro: Is that acceptable?
Ms. Oda: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Very good. I am sorry, JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: No, I think that is a good sequence to follow.
Thank you, Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Thank you very much.
Ms. Oda: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Now, we have one (1) more person.
Mr. Watanabe: We have two (2) more speakers.
Chair Furfaro: Two (2) more speakers.
Mr. Watanabe: Charles M. Brown, followed by Maka'ala
Ka'aumoana.
Chair Furfaro: Go right ahead.
CHARLES M. BROWN: Well, thank you everybody. I think that
public affairs are in good hands here. I like and I am listening. So, I wrote my
remarks so I could be succinct about them on cat control. I feel legislated policy
concerning cats are overly controlling. Feral cats may settle into a life of hard, but
endurable existence. Linking to people who should — well, I made some scratches.
Okay. Well, one factor might be that the one exception that I make here is that if
somebody sees a yowling female cat, they should probably confine it as a matter of
public policy. Cats to me, are semi-domesticated, psychologically and socially
interesting animals. On this basis, they should have some choice in their selection
of their breeding. Enough to be short of the analogy where people are told by
doctors how to run their family life. Cat mills continuing mostly cat generations.
Any comments?
Chair Furfaro: Any comments for Charlie? No?
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, Charlie.
Chair Furfaro: Charlie, thank you and thank you for being
here. I know you are coming from the North Shore.
Mr. Brown: Before I close, I did go to the Kaua`i Humane
Society to volunteer as a cat socializer.
COUNCIL MEETING 57 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Okay, well thank you for that volunteerism.
Ms. Yukimura: Great.
Mr. Watanabe: Maka'ala.
Chair Furfaro: Maka'ala, and Maka'ala, you will be our last
testifier. We need to adjourn appropriately for the time, but we will take your
testimony before we adjourn.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: In my very best Portuguese succinct, I will
do my very best. Maka'ala Ka'aumoana, testifying as an individual with a
disclaimer that I am a member of the Feral Cat Task Force. From my perspective
as a watershed steward and cultural practitioner, this is clearly part of a larger
issue. You know I provided testimony to this Council saying that I really support
the idea of a comprehensive Ordinance. I continue to believe that is the way to
proceed. I understand this is as Penny calls it, Step 1. I would like to call it
Phase 1. I would like to hear some commitment form the Council that it is Phase 1
and that we are committed to, I know you are, and that we are committed to the full
comprehensive Ordinance. This is a good way however, to get some information out
into the community and so I appear today in support with reservations. My
reservations are that I do not like segmentation and I do believe that we should be
looking at the whole issue. I am not politically naive and I understand that
sometime we need to take things in order and I believe this Council has a
commitment to address this issue correctly. I would like to inform this Council and
our community that the goals is no cats at-large. There is deep scientific evidence
for Kaua`i. We are talking about Kaua`i and on Kaua`i, we are a Noah's Ark for
many rare and endangered Hawaiian native species. This is a different
conversation for us on Kaua`i than it is for other locations, even O`ahu. We have a
special kuleana here to take care of things that exist nowhere else. In fact, there
are place on Kaua`i where things exist no place else on Kauai. As a resident of the
North Shore, we are one of those places. Shearwaters is a very good example. If
you are caring for a cat in my opinion, the cat must be contained. I think this
licensing is a good way for us to provide outreach and education to our community
about the reasons for that, the seriousness of the issue, and for us to understand our
responsibility as citizens of this planet and this island. I want to add that the
Hawai`i Sierra Club Executive Director, Robert Harris, does not support any cats
at-large fed or not. I have confidence in the Kaua`i Humane Society to perform the
services described in this Bill and stand on my previous testimony that I really
want this to be Phase 1. If the two (2) things do not happen together, we have not
solve the problem. I believe the Kaua`i Humane Society deserves the support of
enforcement and as the Manager for this issue because indeed, as you suggest, they
are the only ones in that position who can. As a member of this community, I
respect their work and support them continuing it.
Mr. Watanabe: Three (3) minutes.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: I mahalo the Council for introducing this
legislation and would be happy to also provide any evidence that one might need
about how free roaming cats threaten our native and cultural resources. Mahalo.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Maka'ala. Questions?
Mr. Kagawa.
COUNCIL MEETING 58 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Maka'ala. We had a couple of
recent, I think, articles in the paper about feral cats being involved in I guess
killings of, was that the Wedged-Tail Shearwater?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: It was the Wedge-Tailed.
Mr. Kagawa: Was that in Koloa and Kilauea?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes.
Mr. Kagawa: Po`ipu I guess and Kilauea.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: We have film of cats way mauka, upper
Limahuli, upper Lumaha`i killing.
Mr. Kagawa: So, very far from residential areas?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes.
Mr. Kagawa: So, that would be feral cats, right?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: They are all feral cats, but the cats that did
the killing in Kilauea may have been domestically owned. Without licensing and
capturing, you cannot be sure.
Mr. Kagawa: And the estimates of the impact was in the
hundreds?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes, and the Feral Cat Task Force has been
receiving really, really good information on both sides, people that support kitty
management and people that do not. (Inaudible.)
Mr. Kagawa: Are the cats eating the chicks or are they
eating the eggs as well?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: The cats to not eat the eggs. The cats eat the
chicks, but they can also eat an adult bird. Remember that these are ground
nesting birds. This is not a bird that can take off. For example, the Newell
Shearwater cannot take off the ground and suddenly fly into a tree. They may have
wings, but that is not how they function and that is not how they fly. So, they are
stuck. What are they supposed to do? They go in their hole and the cat follows
them. We have film.
Mr. Kagawa: Okay. I guess I am done before I go onto rats
and I am going on a different subject. Thank you.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes, I will be happy to have a conversation
with you about rats on another time.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Chair and thank you Maka'ala
for being here. You mentioned the Feral Cat Task Force, have you been involved
with that process at all?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: From day one (1).
COUNCIL MEETING 59 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: Are you on the Task Force?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: I am.
Mr. Rapozo: When can we expect something from them?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Patience Councilmember. It is really...
Mr. Rapozo: I am exercising patience. That is why I
asked the question because we are working on a Bill prior to getting the report and
recommendation from the Feral Cat Task Force. So, I am very patient, but the Bill
may be impatient.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: I understand.
Mr. Rapozo: All I want to know is when can this body
expect a report from the Feral Cat Task Force?
Ms. Ka'aumoana: We have our final meeting scheduled for
February 10, 2014. I would expect a report out from then. It is possible with all fair
warning, that a sub-Committee may need to meet a little bit after that because the
ultimate goal is to develop and Ordinance as well. Again, my reason for wanting a
comprehensive Ordinance.
Chair Furfaro: Let me clarify that. We funded it, we are
expecting the final report in April. No ifs, ands, or buts.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Ifs, ands, or buts.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Rapozo, I just want to let you know.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Got it.
Mr. Rapozo: Well, I did not know that you were on the
Task Force and I appreciate you being here even more. Just that it just seems
premature at this point because I have not seen anything out of that Task Force.
The Chair is right. We funded that I believe two (2) budgets ago. It may have been
two (2) budgets ago that we funded the thirty thousand dollars ($30,000) for that
study. I may be wrong. Maybe it was last year, but for some reason I am thinking
— if I could get help from staff. Two (2) years? 2013-2014, so this last budget?
Chair Furfaro: I have a track for a year.
Mr. Rapozo: Regardless, it has been a year at least which
is not a problem for me. I had expected the Task Force to work through all of the
data and statistics as Ms. Oda talked about because I think she hits it right on the
head that we do not have. We have a purpose in the Bill, but we do not have the
data and statistics. We do have some, but I think the recommendations from the
Feral Cat Task Force would be important especially if the Feral Cat Task Force is
contemplating a Bill.
COUNCIL MEETING 60 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Ka'aumoana: We are and we are working through that. It
is a very—you remember as the original introducer. It is a difficult...
Mr. Rapozo: I remember. I remember quite well.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: You remember me.
Mr. Rapozo: But what I do remember was many different
possible solutions to the feral cat problem which were all good, in my opinion. I do
not know which one and that is what the purpose of the Task Force was to vet out
all of the potential solutions, come up with a recommendation to this body on how
we respond to the problem, and...
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Penny and I are both on the Task Force as
are representatives of those organizations who want to manage feral cats and there
will be report, absolutely. What we are hoping to do is have an Ordinance. I am not
suggesting it is an either or with these two (2) Ordinances, Councilmember. I am
suggesting that I want commitment that this is Phase 1 or a comprehensive thing
because I abhor segmentation. I do not think it gets us where we want to go. I do
not think it creates a pono product.
Mr. Rapozo: Well, I just will say that this County has
often times followed what has become a clique, "ready, fire, aim."
Ms. Ka'aumoana: Yes.
Mr. Rapozo: And I am not a proponent of the "ready, fire,
aim" system.
Ms. Ka'aumoana: And neither am I.
Mr. Rapozo: I did not think so. Thank you again. Thank
you, Mr. Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Now, I am going to break. We are going to
break. Contractually, we have to get our people lunch. We are fifteen (15) minutes
past our time. We have other agenda items coming up and we will pick this up
when we come back from lunch break at approximately ten (10) minutes of
2:00 p.m. We are on recess.
There being no objections, the Council recessed at 12:48 p.m.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order at 1:55 p.m.,
and proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We are back from our lunch recess. For
those of you that were in the audience, we did not break for lunch until ten (10)
minutes of 1:00 p.m. So, we are exactly one (1) hour and four (4) minutes back from
our lunch break. Jade, we were still dealing with taking testimony on the cat Bill.
If I can reference it as the Cat Licensing Bill and so forth. I believe Kaua`i Humane
Society was hoping to be able to testify. Am I correct? Pleases come right up.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
COUNCIL MEETING 61 JANUARY 29, 2014
PENNY CISTARO: Good afternoon Council. Penny Cistaro,
Executive Director of the Kaua`i Human Society. Obviously, the Kaua`i Humane
Society is in support of the Cat Licensing Bill. There has been discussion and
questions about the cat licensing being separated from the bigger picture of the cat
problem on the island. That is a deliberate choice to separate them because the
feral cat problem facing the island, the free roaming un-owned cat problem, facing
the island is a much greater problem and an issue that is going to require extensive
discussion once it does come to Council. Dealing with owners that are willing to
accept responsibility and take responsibility for their cats is an easier issue for the
community, for the Kaua`i Humane Society, and for the Council to undertake.
There are people that are willing to take responsibility and claim ownership for cats
and those are the ones that this Ordinance would target. There is a concern from
the community that people that own cats are not participating in the cost of the
Animal Control Program and this would address that piece. There may or may not
be any fees, revenue associated with addressing the feral cat population and the
fear is of how much that resolution to that issue would cost the County. So,
intentionally kept those separate. We would like to look at this as Phase 1 or the
first piece of a comprehensive approach to how to manage cats on the island. Thank
you.
Chair Furfaro: JoAnn, you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: So, nothing in this Cat Licensing Bill will
foreclose any feral cat options, right?
Ms. Cistaro: No. It is quite common to keep those two (2)
portions of an Ordinance separate because of how the public views feral cats versus
cats that they care for in their own home.
Ms. Yukimura: Just in response to Maka'ala's question, I
just want to state publicly that I am committed to a comprehensive solution and
will work on that. This feral Cat Licensing Bill is part of my commitment...
Ms. Cistaro: It is not a feral cat licensing.
Ms. Yukimura: I am sorry. This Cat Licensing Bill thank
you. That is a big distinction.
Chair Furfaro: Big difference.
Ms. Yukimura: This Cat Licensing Bill is part of my
commitment that was made when we were dealing with dog licenses. So, I would
like to see this part pass to start revenues coming in, but I am absolutely committed
and willing to work on the next phase after that.
Chair Furfaro: Just let me ask, I shared five (5) years of
reports with the group that we here to testify; one (1) of your reports and two (2)
reports from the previous starting from 2007. I also extended your business card to
them and I told them that I would be willing to meet with them to talk after they
have reviewed the material. One of the questions that came up was, when do we
expect and in a very firm expectation on the first week of April, and this was a
follow-up to Mr. Rapozo's question. Because that money was set aside two (2) years
ago and he is absolutely right. That is when we initiated it and we are really in
need of having a presentation before we get into budget session.
COUNCIL MEETING 62 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Cistaro: I agree with...
Chair Furfaro: My expectation is the first week of April.
Ms. Cistaro: And I agree with you. The last meeting that
I know is scheduled with the final meeting is February 10th. There is
comprehensive recommendations already put forth in the Task Force meeting.
There is some disagreement within the Task Force of what to bring to Council and
that is what is being hammered out on the 10th of February.
Chair Furfaro: Okay.
Ms. Cistaro: I anticipate that you would have something
March versus April.
Chair Furfaro: Well, again, I said the first week of April. If
we can do it in March, that is good, but no exceptions to that.
Ms. Cistaro: No.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Rapozo, did you have any follow-up on
that point? That is it. Thank you very much. Charlie, did you want to speak again
because you only spoke for three (3) minutes the first time? Charlie Brown is back
for his second three (3) minutes. Go ahead.
Mr. Brown: Working a relationship as a civilization of
people as individuals and organizations concerning nature's land, plants, and
animals requires high sophistication. Beyond today's sessions of cats, could there
be a cat wilderness/reservation/adoption center? Cats are such deep pets. They are
worth attention. Someone gave dogs their yards and they made interesting
burrows. Rats and birds needs to be segwayed into this system.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Charlie for that. We will see
what material is covered in the report in April.
There being no further testimony, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: Members, what is your — we have a motion.
We have a motion and a second. If I may ask, any continued narrative here from
the members? JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes. Mr. Chair, thank you. I will be
supporting this Bill and I hope that my colleagues will also. As I recall just a few
moments ago, this Bill is a fulfillment of a promise that I made to Robert Kramer
who was one of the dog owners that said, cats should be paying their fair share and
who said that we should have some sort of fee for cats. This Bill imposes such as fee
for cats that are let outdoors and it is tied to a fee schedule that encourages the
spaying and neutering of those cats that are let out. It is not a leash law. It does
not require cats to be held on property even. So, I want to be clear about that. The
other thing that this Bill does is it begins to bring in revenues to help the Kaua`i
Humane Society pay for the services that are rendered for cats and as we heard
from the Kaua`i Humane Society, cats are actually demanding more of their time
COUNCIL MEETING 63 JANUARY 29, 2014
and revenues and causing more costs then the dogs are. So, it is a needed Bill. It is
very small in terms of license fees and I hope that we can pass this Bill. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Any other dialogue members? Mr. Bynum
and then Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Bynum: I am just going to share some thoughts.
When I think about cat licensing, my first reaction was are you kidding, are you
serious? I know many members of the public especially if they have come into this
dialogue at this point might be saying the same thing. But this is part of a larger
issue and as Maka'ala's testimony was so on point. Cat issues on Kaua`i are
different than cat issues anywhere else. I am so pleased that there is a Feral Cat
Task Force and that Maka'ala and others are serving on it. I heard Councilmember
Hooser was like well, when you look at the revenue potential of this and you think
about the enforcement and all of that, why would you do this? I understand all of
those things which makes this kind of a tough vote just on the face validity level for
the general public, but for those of us who really care about endangered species on
this island and know that that is a blessing and a responsibility as well as a
difficulty for us, but it is our kuleana. It fell on us. The reality is we have this very
special island. So, I intend to support this today. I am very impressed with the
Kaua`i Humane Society overall. Heck yes, there are problems. They engage with
the public daily and the public is so emotional about the love they have for their
animals and for their sanctity of their homes when irresponsible owners do not
control their animals like they are supposed to. I have a great admiration for the
Kaua`i Humane Society. I am very impressed with the new Director who came here
saying, "Hey, we are not going to coast along and not address these financial issues
of the Kaua`i Humane Society and the County and kind of brought us into that
dialogue. We had a difficult time in terms of financing. For all of those reasons, I
am going to support this Bill and support the efforts of people who really spend a lot
more time than I caring about the animal management on our island. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Anyone else? Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Let me just start by
clarifying one of the comments that in fact this cat license is not required for cats
that do not leave the property. That is not what the Bill says. The Bill is quite
clear that you cannot own a cat whether they are indoors or outdoors, without the
license. So, every cat owner is required by this Bill to get a license.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you for the clarification.
Mr. Rapozo: Well, I think it is important for the public
because that could cause problems when people say well, my intent was not to let
the cat out. So, I did not get a license, but it got out. So, it just causes problems. It
is the Police and me that looks at all of the technical issues should a case be
prosecuted, what is going to be needed. The second thing that I want to say is that
in sales training they tell you when someone says no, it does not mean no. It means
not right now. They have not closed the door and that is kind of where I am at today
simply because of the Task Force that is so close to submitting a recommendation to
this body. I mean months away. Two (2) months, or not even two (2) months.
Probably a month and a half if we can get the report here in March. We are talking
about very close. The purpose of that Task Force for members that were not here,
was simply to find out what the County can do to control the feral cat problem. The
purpose of this Bill is not to generate revenue according to the purpose and findings
COUNCIL MEETING 64 JANUARY 29, 2014
on page 1. It is to control homeless and free roaming cats. It is to reduce the
number of cats being euthanized. The purpose of this Bill is not revenue generation
and I know I heard JoAnn say that the good thing is we can get started at least
collecting the funds, but that is not the purpose of this Bill. The purpose of this Bill
is to control the free roaming cats. I am still trying to find that connection how this
is going to do it, but I think this is something down the road we are going to have to
consider. Mr. Bynum said that when he first heard about this he says, "Are you
kidding?" When I first heard about it I said, "Damn right, we need to do this." But
as I have spoken to a lot of people and researched and more specifically the Feral
Cat Task Force and the work that they have done, I just believe that it is premature
at this time to pass a Bill knowing that we are going to get some recommendations
from the Task,Force that we funded to suggest recommendations. Mr. Hooser made
a point about the seventy thousand dollars ($70,000) and to put the public in an
uproar for seventy thousand dollars ($70,000) would be much easier just to find that
money from the General Fund. I think that is probably an accurate statement.
This Bill has generated quite a bit of stir in the community from both supporters
and opponents of the Bill. Again, I am not sure what the recommendations of the
Task Force is because I have not really have not paid much attention to it. To be
honest with you, I forgot that we commissioned that Task Force two (2) years ago. I
honestly just forgot and I am really curious to see what their recommendations are.
I am sure it will be multi-pronged because I do believe that the feral cat problem
needs to be addressed and I know it is not going to be cheap. This may be one of the
recommendations. I do not know that, but it may not be. What happened if we pass
a Bill a month and half prior to the recommendations and the recommendations
come up and say that this is not part of it? Basically, we have undermined the Task
Force that we commissioned to do the recommendations. So, I will not be
supporting the Bill today. Again, it is not a no, no. It is and I am ready because I
have yet to see the recommendations from the Feral Cat Task Force. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa, you have the floor.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. I think just to provide
some clarification as to why we have this cat licensing Bill in front of us was a few
months ago we had increases to the dog licensing. We had hunters come before us
and say, "Why are we only singling out dogs are being licensed? Why not license all
animals? Cats, horse, and etcetera." I think Penny, to her credit, she wanted to
show that she is fair to all animals. They provide services to cats and dogs, she
came up with a Bill, and she did not take very long. She has a solution to what the
hunters are saying about equity, being fair to all animals. For me, I cannot see
licensing cats. I think cats and dogs are very different pets. Their nature is very
different. For me, I had owned a cat when I was young and it is very different from
having a dog. Whereas a cat, you basically feed it, it rubs against your leg, and you
pet it. Basically, it goes after you are done petting it. It will walk off and do
whatever it does. We had it spayed, it was a female. That is the right term,
spayed? So, it would not make more babies that we cannot take care of and it will
not create a feral cat population. I think that is where we are headed. That is the
way you control a population, is to somehow spay and neuter as much cats out there
that do not belong to a household that wants to take care of their babies. Hopefully,
the Feral Cat Task Force can come up with some solutions soon otherwise we will
have no more Wedged-Tail Shearwaters left because they have proof that the cats
are moving up into remote areas as well. I just would like to say, again, we always
point to the State. Department of Land and Natural Resources (DLNR), they are
the ones that work with National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration
(NOAA), they work with Earthjustice and tell us how important it is to protect the
COUNCIL MEETING 65 JANUARY 29, 2014
Shearwaters, yet what do they do to limit the feral cats from entering those
habitats. I know before they used to do rat control et cetera and I heard that they
do not do that anymore. They do not rat control and they do not do cat control. All
they do is they tell us to turn off our lights so that we do not kill any Shearwaters. I
want to see some action out of DLNR, Forestry, and Wildlife if they want to protect
the wildlife. Hopefully, that is where we will be headed at some point with their
help and the County's helps to attack the feral cat problem. I just cannot see
licensing cats. I cannot see owners being willing to bring their cats in. Cats are
different than dogs. I think homeowners will find that if their cat gets taken to the
Kaua`i Humane Society, I think the amount of people that will go and recover their
cats or license their cats is going to be very small, the amount of that. Whereas, the
dog, it serves a purpose. For me, it is an alarm to protect against robbery and what
have you. I had a neighbor that told me he has a dog, his two (2) neighbors on the
side of him without dogs have gotten robbed recently during the day and his house
did not get touched. He has a dog. So, it not only appears like it works, it does
work. When you have a dog, you have less of a chance of your home being broken
into and I think for that service alone, that is why you see a high number of people
who go and get their dogs back from the Kaua`i Humane Society. Again, like I said,
I see a very small number of people who would be participating in the cat licensing
program anyway and that is why I will not be supporting this Bill. Thank you.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you. I wanted to respond to
Councilmember Rapozo's points. First of all, I want to thank him for correcting me.
It is true that it is not just applied to cats that are kept outside because indoor cats
often get outside too. So, it is applied to all owned cats. Cats who have owners, but
that is why it is actually related to the purpose of controlling un-owned cats because
you have to have a way of distinguishing cats that are owned from cats that are not
owned, which are feral cats. So, this licensing Bill puts in place the basic
framework from which you then deal with feral cats. How exactly we deal with
feral cats will depend on the recommendation of the Feral Cat Task Force. That is
why this is needed, but as Maka'ala pointed out, it is only Phase 1 of several phases.
Now, we keep talking about we need the solutions from the Feral Cat Task Force.
There is a possibility that they will not come to agreement and if they do not, guess
who is going to have to find the solutions? It is going to be this body ultimately and
I want to tell you that the solutions are not that easy. So, even if they come forward
with their recommendations in April, there is a good chance that we will take
several months to grapple with this issue. That is my experience as someone who
has been in office dealing with highly controversial, conflicted Bills. That is why I
think we should pass the easy part, the part which is not controversial, and the part
that we need to put in place before we go to the feral cats. If you think it is easy to
get seventy thousand dollars ($70,000) in the budget —pardon me.
Mr. Rapozo: Seventeen thousand dollars ($17,000).
Ms. Yukimura: Oh, seventeen thousand dollars ($17,000),
but actually the additional revenues will also come not from the registration, but
from the other services that are tied to registration or will be stimulated.
Seventeen thousand dollars ($17,000). We were not able to pass a Transportation
Planner position at about sixty thousand dollars ($60,000). We could not. We cut,
not by my vote, but we cut the music performances at the airport which uses our
musicians. It must have been around seventeen thousand dollars ($17,000) or
twenty-five thousand dollars ($25,000).
Mr. Bynum: Twenty-five thousand dollars ($25,000).
COUNCIL MEETING 66 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Every dollar is so important in this really
tight budget and the things we would have to cut off in order to pay seventeen
thousand dollars ($17,000) or sixty-seven thousand dollars ($67,000), whatever it is,
is going to be very, very difficult. We need to get whatever revenues we can from —
this is a user fee. This is not taxpayers' money. This is based on ownership and
responsibility for ownership. So, this is one of the varied ways we should be looking
at to get more revenues. To me, this is an important public policy that we are
dealing with here and it is only the beginning because as has been pointed out, the
feral cats issue affects a lot of things besides cats. It affects public health,
endangered species, just nuisance controls, and that sort of thing. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Anybody else wishes to speak before I speak?
I think we all recognize the two (2) parts here that are really important. I am going
to go out on a limb here and I want the public to know, let alone of few others to
know the fact that we could be twelve million dollars ($12,000,000) upside down
next year with our Operating Budget. I just have to tell you, that is looking into my
global piece. I think you have heard me say it before to Steve, that is where I think
we are at. We are at the point we are trying to add a very important police beat
that will take care of some grant money and then we want to have a ten (10) year
plan. So, every two (2) years we are adding another police beat to the County. That
is the kind of things we are dealing with, not just the entertainment at the airport
and so forth. To have our visitors have a great experience, it is nice to have music,
but if they go home missing their wallet because there was no loss prevention, there
is no amount of music that would make up for that. So, we are in a tight situation
so this money does come into the picture. It does, but as JoAnn talked about
phasing the work, I could save thirty thousand dollars ($30,000) by not having the
Task Force either, but we went out on a reach and I think these people need to
understand the importance of responding to us when we are willing to partner with
these kinds of things. I am looking forward to that report and yet at the same time,
when I go home to my makaha house, I go out to Ka`ena Point. I mean, I have a
fence around Ka`ena Point now from Yokohama Bay going north trying to keep the
feral cats out from the bird nesting. It is hard to find that kind of balance. I believe
everything that Mr. Rapozo has said is important for us, but I want to know if we
are going forward, money is not readily available folks; no matter what phase we go
into. So, I will be supporting this Bill at this point and I want to make sure you
folks all understand. I do not care if you are shaking your head no to me and so
forth, that is where I believe we are because we have other responsibilities that are
mandated to us, but it is also being driven by the fact that we have to be very
realistic about one hundred fifty-eight million dollars ($158,000,000) Operating
Budget and overpromising and under delivering on services. To the same effect,
anything that we do effectively put in place, if it is not working we can always
repeal it. That is the bottom line. Mr. Rapozo makes some very objective points
about having good information in front of us as we go forward. If your Task Force is
split and you are not coming back to us in April, hear it from me, I will never
approve extra money for that kind of period of time only to be able to get a point
well, we do not have a resolution. We do not have a proposal. That is not
acceptable. On that note, I will be supporting this and I would like to call a roll call
now.
JADE K. FOUNTAIN-TANIGAWA, Deputy County Clerk: There is a
motion and a second to approve Bill No. 2517.
COUNCIL MEETING 67 JANUARY 29, 2014
The motion to adopt Bill No. 2517 on second and final reading, and that it be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, was then put, and carried by the
following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chock, Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL— 4,
AGAINST ADOPTION: Kagawa, Rapozo TOTAL— 2,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: 4:2.
Chair Furfaro: 4:2. I would like to make sure that we all
understand that Mr. Rapozo's comments were taken very seriously from me and we
will be looking for more dialogue in April. If we do not have some other
recommendations, who knows, we may reconsider what we have just done here
today. Okay, next item please.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Next item is on page 3.
C 2014-29 Communication (01/06/2014) from the Acting Director of
Personnel Services, transmitting for Council information, the
October-December 2013 Department of Personnel Services Quarterly Report,
pursuant to Section 19 of the Fiscal Year 2013-2014 Operating Budget, Ordinance
No. B-2013-753, which includes new hires, transfers, reallocations, promotions, and
vacancies for the second quarter: Mr. Kagawa moved to receive C 2014-29 for the
record, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Chair Furfaro: Tom, may I ask you and your staff to come
up? So, Tom, I will give this to you on a few notes before we start and I want to
make it very clear. In the Bargaining Unit role, the County of Kaua`i has very little
final influence on an outcome because with the eight (8) voting members, the reality
is we have got to somehow find ourselves supporting something by being part of a
five (5) person vote or we have to be a part of something to be a four (4) person no.
So, we are not at the best position and we have had some well-deserved increases
and we have has a few outstanding reviews on some of our personnel, especially
Police and Fire with the work that they are doing in our community. They are
constantly making improvements, but these are items that do cost us and we want
to put firemen in a place that they always have four (4) people on a shift and we
always have a situation that maybe we have a ten (10) year plan to add officers on
additional beats every two (2) years. We are at a point when we see the vacancy
reports, which you referenced. What was the date on that report?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: This is October through December 2013.
Chair Furfaro: So, this is year end and we are getting ready
to get into another period. Mr. Rapozo has been the champion of this comment, and
I am starting to fall more and more on his side. If we have vacancies that exist in
vacant positions for more than six (6) months at a time, it kind of starts me to
think, is that really a position that we need or should we be using that money to go
elsewhere in our staff planning during budget? As of right now, how many positions
that we have budgeted that are actually vacant? I want to say going forward every
quarter, that is going to be the first question out of my agenda time. How many
COUNCIL MEETING 68 JANUARY 29, 2014
positions are currently vacant? Then, the second part of that question is how many
of those positions have been vacant for more than one hundred twenty (120) days?
Now we have a Human Resources (HR) Department and we are supposed to be
sharper, quicker, faster, and more accurate on our recruiting. How many current
vacant positions do we have?
Mr. Rapozo: Mr. Chair, you are asking as of today?
Chair Furfaro: As of today.
Mr. Rapozo: Not as of December?
Chair Furfaro: No, I am sorry. As of December report.
Mr. Rapozo: Okay. I do not know if it is possible to know
what is maybe...
Chair Furfaro: I meant for the end of their report which was
twenty-seven (27) days ago.
Mr. Rapozo: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: At the end of this report, December 31st, how
many vacant positions did we have?
THOMAS TAKATSUKI, Acting Director of Personnel Services: In
doing a quick count, I am looking at about one hundred six (106) to about one
hundred ten (110).
Chair Furfaro: Between one hundred six (106) and one
hundred ten (110). Being that staff planning is functional between Department
Heads and the new HR Department, I want to make sure that you realize that
every quarterly report, that is going to be the first question that is going to come
out. So, ten percent (10%) of our positions if we have roughly one thousand sixty
(1,060) positions budgeted for in the County of Kaua`i, ten percent (10%) of them are
currently vacant and they do contribute to what ends up being the year end surplus
because they are unfilled, they also impact Payroll, Taxes and Employee (PT&E)
benefits because there is nobody earning those benefits, and could we actually
identify that in a line item as far as your quarterly reports go? Not intended to
embarrass anybody, but let me tell you that when the payroll of this County and the
benefits of this County equal eight-one percent (81%) of our Operating Budget, it is
time to make sure that we have a pulse on what is going on there. Then, with the
request on demands on services, maybe we have to evaluate some of those vacant
positions to add a Lifeguard somewhere else or expand a bus driver or I think
JoAnn mentioned it in the last agenda item, finding money for a Planner. We have
to get better at that going forward and you folks can help very much by having that
as part of you report. So, can we get an agreement on that, that will be a part of
your quarterly reports?
Mr. Takatsuki: Yes, we can.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Tom. Thank you very much.
Mel, you had questions?
COUNCIL MEETING 69 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: I think my questions go along the same line
as yours. As I look at the list there are quite a few positions that have been vacant
for a while and I am assuming Grounds Helper is Parks and Recreation for
part-time a position, and this thing is showing it has been vacant since 2009. I
mean, there are a few of these that go back quite a ways. Some of them we have
dollar-funded in past budgets, but a lot of them we have not. So, like the Chair has
said, it contributes to the surplus at the end of the year. As you accurately stated, I
think that has been my concern every budget. If this position is vacant for more
than six (6) months, than we should dollar fund that position and if it is vacant for
more than one (1) year, we should remove it. If this County is operating in a year
and again, with the HR, you would think anyway that these processes would be
accelerated, but apparently not. How do we do that, which leads me to the next
question, this Council in the last budget defunded a position and then I see it
showing up here under the new hires. Walk us through the process of that. If this
Council, in the budget, basically feels that a position is not needed and the Council
agrees that the position is not needed and then it shows up as a new hire, can you
walk me through the process of how that happens because the Budget Ordinance — I
keep saying this. The budget Ordinance is the law. It is an Ordinance. I think that
is what concerns me. We have the dialogue and it is agreed upon by the Council, a
position is removed, and then it pops up here in your quarterly report as a new hire
and it is the first one on the list. I have not gone through all of the rest, but how
does that work? How does that happen?
JANINE RAPOZO, Human Resources Manager II: Janine Rapozo, HR
Manager II. That particular position is federally funded. So, when it comes into
Department of Personnel Services (DPS) to establish the position, as long as there is
funding in the grant budget, it is established that way.
Mr. Rapozo: Sorry, what was that again?
Ms. Rapozo: This particular position in question is
federally funded and so as far as establishment of the position, as long as there is
funding in the grant budget, it is established that way.
Mr. Rapozo: But this position is a permanent position?
Ms. Rapozo: No. It is federally funded so it is not.
Mr. Rapozo: How does it go down? Is it like a temporary
position? How do you folks designate a position like that?
Ms. Rapozo: I think it was an exempt appointment.
Mr. Rapozo: Federally funded, so as long as the funds are
available, you create the position?
Ms. Rapozo: That is correct.
Mr. Rapozo: Are you aware of any others like that in this
report that may have been defunded by the Council and picked up under some other
grant?
Ms. Rapozo: I think that is the only one.
COUNCIL MEETING 70 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: Then, the reallocations, I am hearing a lot of
concerns from Departments that the reallocations are taking a long time. How long
does it take to reallocate a position once a request is submitted by a Department
Head?
Mr. Takatsuki: It can vary from a day, two (2) days, ten (10)
days depending on number one, amount of staff work because at this point in time
we had one (1), now I have two (2) individuals that are doing classification and pay
work in addition to labor relations, grievances, and everything else that falls within
that section. So, within the two (2), it can vary.
Mr. Rapozo: Is it true that I am hearing some of these
take months or even more than a year?
Mr. Takatsuki: Some of them have taken that long, a year.
Mr. Rapozo: I think that is a concern. When we had the
discussion of the creation of the new HR, that was going to be resolved. That was
part of the selling point, that we could get through some of these things much faster
and I am not hearing that. I am hearing that it is taking an unusually long time to
get some reclassifications done.
Mr. Takatsuki: Most of them are being pushed out as they
come in within a reasonable time between zero (0) to ninety (90) days. Then, there
have been a few that have been held over and over and over. I think that is the
concern.
Mr. Rapozo: I think that is the concern.
Mr. Takatsuki: We have been trying to eliminate that,
getting it in first in and first out as soon as we can, but then sometimes we do it
that way then certain ones on the bottom has to get out and the top ones start
complaining about when are we going to get reallocations? So, the simple and easy
ones we have been pushing them out as fast as we can.
Mr. Rapozo: But when you push out a simple and easy
one, you are taking time away from the difficult one so that person keeps waiting
and waiting and waiting. I guess I am concerned because I hear that some get
turned around in a day.
Mr. Takatsuki: Oh, yes. Especially those that do not require
any review as far as being audited, staff will have to go out and audit the positions
and when you are auditing the positions by interviewing the incumbent,
interviewing the Supervisors and everything else, and then making a decision.
Chair Furfaro: Excuse me on that note. Mr. Rapozo, we are
going to take a tape change.
Mr. Rapozo: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: You have the floor when we come back, but I
would like to make this a ten (10) recess if I could please. Ten (10) minute recess.
There being no objections, the Council recessed at 2:38 p.m.
COUNCIL MEETING 71 JANUARY 29, 2014
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order at 2:49 p.m.,
and proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We are back and before we go any further,
Tom, and to the other Councilmembers, the County Council is sponsoring Grace
Peralta to do some shadowing as the role of a Councilmember. Since I have an
empty seat today I thought I would ask Grace come up and have a seat at the table.
I would like to give the floor to Mr. Chock for three (3) minutes since he has been
assigned for his ongoing training to be her shadower. Vice Chair, you have the
floor.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended for a moment of personal
privilege.
Mr. Chock: Thank you Chair. I just wanted to introduce
to everyone an outstanding student and someone that have gotten to know over the
last year, Grace Peralta, a senior from Kaua`i High School. I am serving as her
mentor for her Senior Project this year. She has had the opportunity to come out
and see a lot of different projects that I work on. I will let Grace introduce herself
and the many roles that she has in the community. She is looking to serve our
community in the future. Thank you for being here, Grace.
Chair Furfaro: Grace, welcome. If you could take a few
minutes to introduce yourself to the Council and the viewing audience. Welcome.
GRACE PERALTA: Thank you. Hi everyone. My name is Grace
Peralta. I am a senior at Kaua`i High School and I am doing a Senior Project.
Mason is my mentor like he said before. When he was my mentor, I did not know
he would be part of Council. What I wanted to do with my Senior Project was going
to be on the invasive mangrove. You folks know that Mason works on that in
Niumalu. As I found out all the different things he was involved with, it was
perfect because that is what I want to do in the future, to work in the community
and work for the people. For me, I primarily like spending my time with the Boys &
Girls Club. I am the President of the Leaders in Training Program which is the
high school volunteer program with JoAnn too. She is there. I am also the Youth of
the Year candidate. So, I am going to be competing on O`ahu for a scholarship in
essays. We have essays. We need recommendation letters. Speeches, and
interviewing. So, this is a good experience so I can get ready for that. I also am on
the Kaua`i Leaders Against Suicide. I am the spokesperson so I kind of do all of the
talking for that group. Our purpose of the group is to tell the community and
present to our peers the signs of suicide and where to get help. Did you know that
one (1) out of every six (6) teenagers in Hawai`i considers suicide? That fact right
there really hit me and I just want to make a difference in that and just to promote
life. Basically, that is what we do for that class, to promote life and go out to the
community. We just did a sign-holding at the mall, saying who we are and the
contact number of the National hotline. I am on the basketball team. I think that
is it.
Chair Furfaro: Well, very good. Members, if Mr. Chock is
finished. Are you finished?
Mr. Chock: Yes.
Chair Frufaro: Members, you have time right now. JoAnn.
COUNCIL MEETING 72 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Well, it has been a privilege to work as an
Advisory Board Member of the Boys & Girls Club and work with club members like
Grace. She mentioned the Youth of the Year competition and I just wanted to
mention that besides speaking on Honolulu, she is going to be speaking on Kaua`i at
the Youth of Year Brunch February 22nd at the Kaua`i Beach Resort. So, Grace and
I think eight (8) other young people?
Ms. Peralta: Around there.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes, seven (7) or eight (8) young people will
be speaking, giving three (3) minute speeches. As she mentioned, they learn
interview techniques. They learn how to dress professionally. They learn how to
speak. I mean I am in awe of these young people. They speak better than a lot of
adults. They give very moving talks about their lives and how the Boys & Girls
Club has affected them. It is open to the public, so if any of you are interested to
come hear Grace and the others. I hope that you will join us. I want to just
acknowledge that Grace is a truly a leader and as she mentioned, she is the
President of Leaders in Training, which is a program in Boys & Girls Club. She is
one of our shining stars.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa, Mr. Rapozo, go ahead.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you. I would just like to welcome you,
Grace. You did a great job on your first speech here at the table. I think you have
what it takes, the main quality of a Councilmember. I think why all of us ran is to
try and make Kaua`i a better place for our people and those things that you said
that you wish to do with your projects and with your I welcome you and hopefully
you being here will show other youth of Kaua`i that the County Council is a good
thing and that we need more candidates. Last election we had nine (9) people run
and for such an important job, I think we need more candidates running to give
people more choices. I welcome you and hopefully your being here will spread for
the next election. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Rapozo and then Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you for being
here. Are you going to be here for the rest of the day or night? I do not know how
long it is going to be?
Ms. Peralta: Until 4:00 p.m.
Mr. Rapozo: Huh?
Chair Furfaro: Until 4:00 p.m.
Mr. Rapozo: Okay, well, thank you and congratulations
on all that you have accomplished and you will continue to do. I can see that you
will be a well-known member of the community very shortly. I want you to know
that three are millions and millions of people watch this show on a daily basis. So,
take this opportunity to share. I am hoping that the Chair will allow you to sit
there until you have to leave and try to gain as much as you can from the
discussions coming up. Your mentor, I was just listening to you speak and
Councilmember Yukimura is correct, you speak well. You said more in three (3)
COUNCIL MEETING 73 JANUARY 29, 2014
minutes than Mr. Chock has said since he got appointed to this position.
Sometimes the student becomes the teacher.
Mr. Chock: That is right.
Mr. Rapozo: Anyway, I look forward to the next hour.
Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: Ms. Peralta, welcome to this side of the table.
Can we have her vote today too? Very well said. You took your opportunity, you
talked about what you are doing, and even plugged the things that you are
interested in. Well done. Thank you very much.
Chair Furfaro: From me, I would like to say that we are
glad you can spend this hour with us and you can sit at the table with us today. Of
the skills you referenced, I do want you to know that my wife Emma, is the single
biggest wahine basketball fan on Kauai. I am sure we would like to see you on the
court one day. Welcome.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: To the HR Department, thank you for giving
us a few moments to welcome her. Tom, we will come back to you. I think
Mr. Rapozo, you had the floor when we broke for recess.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Mr. Rapozo: No, I think he answered my question. I just
wanted to share that that is the concern that I am gearing. I am sure you hear it
too, Tom, and just trying to see how we can improve the process so everyone can get
a fair and consistent opportunity as they reclassify positions within their
Departments. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Other questions for HR, in particular on the
report? Steve, I want to compliment you and Tom on the report, the format. I know
the ladies even talked to me about some of the changes. They are all really, really
good progress that we have made here, but I think the one thing that we would like
to see is this. Can I use the term "aging" of the vacant positions? So, I would like to
see how many of those positions are thirty (30) days, sixty (60) days, ninety (90)
days, and one hundred twenty (120) days. Go ahead, Steve.
STEVEN A. HUNT, Director of Finance: If I could speak to
that.
Chair Furfaro: Yes.
Mr. Hunt: Steve Hunt, Director of Finance. Welcome
honorary Councilmember Peralta. The vacancies and the aging list is actually a
concern to us too from the creation of fund balance. As you are very aware, we have
been using twelve million dollars ($12,000,000) to balance the budget from
unassigned fund balance each year. As we are getting close to this budgeting to
COUNCIL MEETING 74 JANUARY 29, 2014
actual figures, we anticipate that the lapse in those fund balances will be much
smaller. One of the ways that we have been attempting to create and preserve that
fund balance has been instructions to Department Heads to curb vehicle purchases,
equipment purchases, and reduce their travel by half. Those were instructions for
Fiscal Year 2014 and are continuing to go on in Fiscal Year 2015 to hold the line.
Another one which is germane to this discussion is filling vacancies. We have
advised Departments where practical, to hold vacancies for six (6) months. In many
cases, it is not practical. It is something that there are functions that have to be
done, that cannot be done if the staff is not filled. There are health and safety that
get priority. Those are filled with more urgency, but we are practical and we are
reviewing those requests as they come in through NEOGOV, is to hold that line for
six (6) months prior to filling. So, there is actually some method to the madness if
you will, for some of the positions not filled immediately and that is the attempt to
create fund balance from unexpended salaries for the remainder of the year.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Steve for that and I guess that is
why I made the comment about the Police Department, the Fire Department, public
safety, and so forth. The policy that you just also shared can bite us in the okole
and you know exactly that I am talking about. We have positions that are vacant
that we do not need, but ultimately, the purpose of that is only to earn more money
to lapse and there has to be another way to do that too. I think this Council is in a
position that we would like to have more information about the aging of the
vacancies and that will help us understand if we want to fill a position that we feel
we need more than another, we have that opportunity to have the discussion with
the Administration. I appreciate the fact you know exactly where I was coming
from.
Mr. Hunt: To that, too, if you are looking at that as a
sort of a position by position the same way we are, then I am a little more reassured
as to a general policy that if it is not filled in six (6) months, it is dollar-funded and
if it is not filled in a year then it is gone. My case in point, I have sort of return
rights that I have exercised to leave. If my position goes vacant for more than had a
year and it is now gone, I have concerns, speaking selflessly.
Chair Furfaro: Yes, but you are not going back to your old
position.
Mr. Hunt: No comment.
Chair Furfaro: I had to put that in there to help to
compliment how pleased we are with the work you are doing right now. The point
is well made. If we could have something to looks a little bit at the aging, it would
help us. Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Steve, the return
right is a right that the County has to acknowledge. It is not something that we
have a choice. So, when a position becomes vacant and we maintain that position,
again, that rolls into the surplus, unless it is dollar-funded.
Mr. Hunt: In case mine was dollar-funded, yes.
Mr. Rapozo: Right, so that is not impacting the surplus,
but it was never that way. Every position, vacant position, historically was always
fully funded and that always contributed to that exorbitant surplus that we would
COUNCIL MEETING 75 JANUARY 29, 2014
have enjoyed at the end of the year. I think some adjustments have been made now
where we do the dollar-funding so it does not impact. I will just make sure that the
public understands that the public is not paying for a position waiting for Steve
Hunt to decide whether or not he will stay as Finance Director.
Mr. Hunt: No.
Mr. Rapozo: It is a dollar.
Mr. Hunt: Correct.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. This one came to me from
the public as soon as we started the automated system of trash service. There is
one (1) worker who drives that automated truck and when we had it manually, we
had as much as three (3) people on the truck at a time or four (4)?
Ms. Yukimura: Three (3).
Mr. Kagawa: Three (3)? So, this one came from the public,
right away they told me, we are going with the automated, what happens to those
other two (2) workers that used to be on that truck? You do not have to really
answer that now, but what I am saying is that I am hoping that when those people
retire, that we do not fill that position because we know we are moving into fully
automated. We are at Lihu`e and Kapa'a right now and we are trying to expand
even more. When those positions retire, that we do not fill that position already
because we can see the trend that it is no longer needed, right? As I understand it,
they stay on that huki pau schedule forever, right?
Ms. Yukimura: It is insane.
Mr. Kagawa: I mean even if they are not on the truck
again, they still stay on that huki pau hours, right? I do not know if you folks can
answer that right now. Anyway, those are the kind of moves that I want to see by
the Administration, knowing it is not benefiting the County to keep filling those
types of vacancies and it would be a wise move. There may be other needs in Public
Works for that body, but let us get that position out of the huki pau schedule. We
have to utilize those retirements and start making those positions work to the best
ability for the County.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa, if you could add. There is a
communication from me to the Administration that talks about this evolution just
the way you are pointing it out. It has not come back on the agenda yet, but it is as
these people were incurring overtime, large amounts, with the automation they
were able to move staff to other routes to pick up their allocation. That
communication went over, but I have not seen the return on it yet, but when it does
return, we will put it on the agenda because you and I are on same page with that.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you. I just wanted to make sure that
the public brought it up to me and I bring it up to the proper authority because it is
simple. Looking at the same job with less manpower, why would we continue to
hire that huki pau schedule worker when it is not needed and in future, they are
going to be needed less as we expand? Thank you. Thank you, Chair.
COUNCIL MEETING 76 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Tom, so you understand, what we are looking
at is as the automation expands, the first thing we are looking at the reduction in
overtime from the Public Works people because they are able to spread some of this
work out to a point that we need something from you that shows what the end goal
is on the staffing. So, that commination went over and Ernie, you are familiar with
what I am talking about, right? We will put that on as a separate agenda item.
Mr. Kagawa: Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Go right ahead.
Mr. Kagawa: If I can follow-up. We just heard earlier that
we had an item regarding road maintenance and they said that they are way behind
because I guess they no longer can use as much pesticides as before. They have to
manually cut brush along the roads. If we are so short-handed there, there could be
the need of that huki pau schedule worker. I am not saying that we do not need
that worker. I am just saying that we could utilize that worker in a better position,
but let us get them off that huki pau schedule as we have those retirements. Thank
you.
Chair Furfaro: I think that is a point in the communication
to, that they can then be used for road maintenance.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Additional questions?
Mr. Rapozo: One (1) more question.
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead.
Mr. Rapozo: Maybe you know Tom, but maybe more for
Finance. On the positions that are funded by Solid Waste Fund or Highway Fund,
those that are not filled and there are a few in here several years, are we able to use
those funds for anything else or is that restricted for salaries?
Mr. Hunt: They would not be restricted for salaries, but
they would be restricted to uses within those funds that would be eligible for that
use. So, if you had Highway Fund moneys that you wanted to use for paving roads
or other purposes that were salary, and that position was not filled, then they could
be used for other dedicated purposes.
Mr. Rapozo: Right, but we are being led to believe at
budget time, that these positions are needed. I do not have a problem moving the
funds if you take out the position that has been vacant since 2011 or 2010 and just
put that money into the paving. I always had a problem with what the budget says
and what we end up using the funds for. That has just always been a problem for
me. I am really glad that the Council in years past has at least agreed to
dollar-fund some of those positions. In cases like this, there is almost an incentive
not to fill it because you want to use — not you, but the Administration or the
Department wants to use those funds for something else. That is a concern.
Mr. Hunt: There is a policy within our Office though, in
terms of transfer of funds. So, if you are looking to use funds that are earmarked
COUNCIL MEETING 77 JANUARY 29, 2014
for salaries and put them into another use that is not an appropriate use and we do
not approve that unless there is a strong justification. It is not essentially a slush
fund that you have unspent salaries that you can then buy equipment with or do
other things with. You just cannot do that transferred.
Mr. Rapozo: • You can with permission.
Mr. Hunt: You can, but...
Mr. Rapozo: Permission that is not the Council's
permission?
Mr. Hunt: Correct, myself and the Mayor. That is
correct.
Mr. Rapozo: I think that is my point. The Administration
comes here and says we need all this money for bodies and then throughout the
years the money is transferred without the public ever knowing because it is not
brought here.
Mr. Hunt: Right.
Mr. Rapozo: And that is I think...
Mr. Hunt: There are a number that I have turned down
and I can speak to it that have come in for request.
Mr. Rapozo: That is good, Steve. But you are new. Do
you know what I am saying? You are relatively new and maybe things have
changed, but it still does not take away the fact the public never gets to see those
transfers. What they see is that the budget that the positions are justified and then
it is 2011 or 2008 or whatever. There are years and years and years that we have
not filled it. The question was about the use of those funds. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Steve. Additional HR report
questions? If not, Tom and your staff, thank you very much. We certainly
appreciate the new reporting and if you could take an aging note from Steve on
those vacancies, it would be much appreciated. Thank you very much. This is a
move to receive item, right?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Yes, we have a motion to receive and a
second.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: Members any further discussion? Seems we
were able to follow-up some of our expectations.
The motion to receive C 2014-29 for the record was then put, and carried by a
vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: 6:0.
COUNCIL MEETING 78 JANUARY 29, 2014
C 2014-30 Communication (01/06/2014) from the Director of Finance,
transmitting for Council information, the Second Quarter Statement of Equipment
Purchases for Fiscal Year 2013-2014, pursuant to Section 17 of Ordinance
No. B-2013-753, the Operating Budget of the County of Kaua`i for Fiscal
Year 2013-2014: Mr. Kagawa moved to receive C 2014-30 for the record, seconded
by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: I have a motion to receive and second. Do
we have any specific questions of I guess, Ernie is here for that or Steve? If not, I
would like to move to receive.
The motion to receive C 2014-30 for the record was then put, and carried by a
vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Very good. Next item, please.
C 2014-31 Communication (01/08/2014) from Jennifer S. Winn, Deputy
County Attorney, transmitting for Council information, the Quarterly Report on
Settled Claims against the County of Kaua`i from October 1, 2013 through
December 31, 2013: Mr. Rapozo moved to receive C 2014-31 for the record,
seconded by Mr. Bynum.
Chair Furfaro: Jennifer is out ill, but we do have someone
here from the County Attorney's Office. If there are no questions, I would like to
move to receive.
The motion to receive C 2014-31 for the record, was then put and carried by a
vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Next item, please.
C 2014-32 Communication (01/08/2014) from the Salary Commission,
transmitting for Council information, the Salary Commission's Resolution
No. 2013-2, Relating to the Salaries of Certain Officers and Employees of the
County of Kaua`i: Mr. Kagawa moved to receive C 2014-32 for the record, seconded
by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: We have a motion to receive and second. If
there are any questions, I believe we do have Mr. Hunt here.
Mr. Bynum: Can I have one (1) minute to talk to Jade
just to ask a quick question?
Chair Furfaro: Sure, go right ahead. Steve, would you just
come up. You can just mosey on up.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Chair Furfaro: Have we met all the compliance as far as
date specific, when this report should be put in?
Mr. Hunt: I am sorry, this is the report for the Salary
Commission?
COUNCIL MEETING 79 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Yes, have we met the criteria for dates or are
they planning to?
Mr. Hunt: I cannot speak to that.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Well, was Paula planning to come
over to answer that question?
Mr. Hunt: I am not aware.
Chair Furfaro: Okay.
Ms. Yukimura: I have a question for Steve.
Chair Furfaro: Steve, I want to make sure that you
understand what I am saying. The last time we went through this piece, we had a
difficulty with the recommendation being on the back end of what should have met
the Charter requirement for the date.
Mr. Hunt: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum does not have any questions?
Mr. Bynum: I am fine.
Chair Furfaro: You are fine. JoAnn, you have the floor if
you would like.
Ms. Yukimura: Steve, would you know what the value of
subsidy is?
Mr. Hunt: The Police subsidy?
Ms. Yukimura: Yes.
Mr. Hunt: I believe it is five hundred sixty-two dollars
($562) a month.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, five hundred sixty-two dollars ($562).
Mr. Hunt: Yes, and there were two (2) that were being
offered that; the Chief of Police and Deputy Chief of Police. I believe only the
Deputy Chief of Police has expressed a willingness to apply for that.
Ms. Yukimura: Because they either use the Police car or this
is a subsidy if they use their own car?
Mr. Hunt: Correct. The subsidy would actually only be
if they used their own car.
Ms. Yukimura: Right, okay.
Mr. Hunt: And they are non-pursuit vehicles. These
are not your typical squad car that are sent out. These are more Sports Utility
COUNCIL MEETING 80 JANUARY 29, 2014
Vehicle (SUV). They do have certain ratings and criteria and they have certain
inspections that they go to keep them in service, but the intent is that because it is
their personal car, they will take much better care of them, drive them carefully,
and have a longer, less maintenance to the County.
Chair Furfaro: You okay with that JoAnn?
Ms. Yukimura: Yes, and the reason it is before the Salary
Commission is because it is considered part of the salary.
Chair Furfaro: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Right?
Mr. Hunt: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: There is a tax liability for the individuals
associated with that.
Mr. Hunt: It is taxable.
Chair Furfaro: I just want to make sure that we all realize
that. Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. The five hundred
sixty-two dollars ($562), how did we get that figure? Did we follow...
Mr. Hunt: It is part of the State of Hawai`i
Organization of Police Officers (SHOPO) negotiations and it is for all Counties.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Scott. JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: Does the Chief and the Deputy get Standard
of Conduct pay as well?
Mr. Hunt: That was also negotiated in this last
agreement with the Salary Commission, that they would receive that as well.
Ms. Yukimura: Is that in here, too?
Mr. Hunt: I believe that came in a prior
correspondence. This latest one I believe, only updated the subsidy for vehicles.
Chair Furfaro: I think the issue there was, JoAnn, that this
came up in the SHOPO negotiation of which it was rather late this year, right?
Mr. Hunt: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: But the Chief and the Deputy are not
involved in SHOPO negotiations, are they?
COUNCIL MEETING 81 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Hunt: Well, they are not involved per se, but they
are subject to the findings of them.
Ms. Yukimura: They are?
Mr. Hunt: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: They are part of the union rank and file?
Mr. Hunt: Not the rank and file, no, but they are
eligible for the Standard of Conduct is my understanding.
Ms. Yukimura: How is that if they are not part of the rank
and file?
Chair Furfaro: Actually I think that is a question we will
send over to you, Steve.
Mr. Hunt: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: The fact of the matter is the recommendation
was then made by the Salary Commission and if there is any clarity, we should
make sure we are on the same page as them.
Ms. Yukimura: Theoretically, the Standard of Conduct is
justified at least the Union's justification for is that, as I understand it and maybe I
do not fully understand it, that Police can be prosecuted if they do not respond
off-duty?
Mr. Hunt: I think it also has to do with carrying a gun
as well. There are certain...
Chair Furfaro: Steve, hold on a second here. The decision
came from the Salary Commission, okay? We are all going to sit here at the table
and have some discussion here, but I think Mel can contribute something to this.
We would still like to ask the Salary Commission what supported their
recommendation and we need to be there, not all of us guessing here. Mr. Rapozo
you have the floor.
Mr. Rapozo: I just want to clarify Standard of Conduct. It
is not about the gun or it is not about — what it is, is the Officers can be punished
internally at the Department for actions that they do off-duty. That is what
separates them from any other — Mel Rapozo as a Councilmember could go out
today and get drunk and get a Driving Under the Influence (DUI). I cannot be
disciplined for my actions off-duty.
Ms. Yukimura: I think you can.
Mr. Rapozo: No, you cannot. The Police Officer can. If
the Officer does something off-duty, he gets punished by the Department and that is
why the Standard of Conduct was created years ago. That is the difference. That is
why they get this, because they have to be professional on-duty and off-duty and
they are subject to employment punishment for any action that they do off-duty.
COUNCIL MEETING 82 JANUARY 29, 2014
That is Standard of Conduct. I just want to make sure that the right information is
going out because there are millions of people watching.
Chair Furfaro: What I would like to do is I am going to send
the inquiry over to Paula, copying you, so that they can have that discussion with
the Salary Commission on their interpretation, okay? That is what we need to
know first, how they made that interpretation. Any more questions? If not, I will
excuse you, Steve.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We have a motion to receive. Do we not? Is
there anyone in the audience wanting to testify on this item?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one to provide testimony, the meeting was called back to
order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to receive C 2014-32 for the record was then put, and carried by a
vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Let the record show — was that a nay,
JoAnn?
Ms. Yukimura: No.
Chair Furfaro: I did not mean to call you, Jo.
Ms. Yukimura: It is not a problem.
Chair Furfaro: Every time I use the word "guy," I address a
woman with that, I hear it from my wife. So, I want to make sure.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, Chair
Chair Furfaro: JoAnn, okay. We are fine on receiving that
6:0, right? Next item, please.
C 2014-33 Communication (01/08/2014) from the Director of Parks and
Recreation, requesting Council approval to accept a monetary donation in the
amount of$1,500 from the M.A. Rikard Charitable Trust for youth programs at the
Kalaheo Neighborhood Center/Gymnasium: Mr. Kagawa moved to approve
C 2014-33 with a thank-you letter to follow, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: Seconded by Mr. Rapozo. Are there any
questions? The Deputy is here along with his trustee support. Any questions here?
No questions? Thank you gentlemen for being here.
Mr. Kagawa: That is the wrong one.
COUNCIL MEETING 83 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Oh, I am sorry. I am here? Oh, thank you.
Do not leave. It would help if I put my glasses on. Okay, we are on C 2014-33? Any
questions for the Department?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: We have a motion and a second.
Chair Furfaro: None? Yes, I want to restate since I am on
the right number. I read the number. Is there any questions for the Department?
No? On that note, discussion members? Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. A lot of times we have
donations in the form of equipment or something that a person does not need
anymore or anything, but this is a cash donation of one thousand five hundred
dollars ($1,500) that will go specifically to the Kalaheo Neighborhood Center. So, I
just really want to say that is a really nice gesture and one thousand five hundred
dollars ($1,500) in cash can do a lot of good things for the center. I want to thank
them.
Chair Furfaro: Very nice to point that out as a cash
donation. Any further comments or discussion? None. This is a vote to approve,
please.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Approve with thank-you letter.
Chair Furfaro: Yes
The motion to approve C 2014-33 with a thank-you letter to follow was then
put, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Gentlemen, we will go to the next item,
which actually has an extra zero (0) in it. The first one was one thousand five
hundred dollars ($1,500) and the next one is fifteen thousand dollars ($15,000).
May we read that communication, please?
C 2014-34 Communication (01/09/2014) from the Fire Chief, requesting
Council approval to reallocate funds from Account No. 001-1102-566.89-06 (Fire
Department, Fire Operations — Public Safety) for the purchase of swiftwater rescue
safety gear and equipment in the amount of$15,000: Mr. Chock moved to approve
C 2014-34, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: Chief, I am going to ask you to come up for a
moment, if you could. You can bring your colleague with you too, if you would like
to come up.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Chair Furfaro: Okay, dropping in at Makaha Point Surf, you
probably drop in at about twenty-three miles per hour (23 mph). What is
referencing here "swiftwater?"
JOHN BLALOCK, Deputy Fire Chief: Good afternoon Chair
and Councilmembers. For the record John Blalock, Deputy Fire Chief, Kaua`i Fire
Department.
COUNCIL MEETING 84 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead and introduce yourself.
JASON ORNELLAS, Kaua`i Fire Department Battalion Chief: Good
afternoon, Council Chair, Jason Ornellas Battalion Chief with the Kaua`i Fire
Department.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Jason. Could you give us a
better definition of"swiftwater?"
Mr. Blalock: I am glad you asked that because I just
looked it up. Chair, it was swiftwater and what the definition was and I did talk to
some of the Firefighters that went to the training. According to the NFPA, National
Fire Protection Association, swiftwater is any water moving at one (1) knot or
greater, which is basically one mile per hour (1 mph).
Chair Furfaro: So, shoreline current could be swiftwater.
Dropping in at Makaha at twenty-three miles per hour (23 mph) is swiftwater too.
What would this safety gear amount to as far as a purchase? Is it a special torpedo
pack? What is it?
Mr. Blalock: Basically, what we are looking at is this
personal protective equipment and for those Firefighters. Actually, what we are
looking at is to man stations. Certain things will be assigned to certain
Firefighters, but some of the equipment is basically for each station, that they will
be afforded the equipment that we can start the training. A lot things that we do,
we have identified — I mean we have been dealing with swiftwater incidences for
years on Kaua`i and as people know, with all of our tributaries and waterways that
we have, we are almost like the capital swiftwater for the State. We could almost
do swiftwater rescues here. We have gone through this with years and our training,
not only on the rescue side, but as Firefighters we have mitigated a lot of situations
that have come about. Kind of what brought this to the forefront again for us is
that in 2013 in February, again we had our big rains again. We had flooding on all
parts of the island. Hanalei, the bridge closed down. We had that one big really big
rescue. I think it made a lot of YouTubes and things about going into — excuse me
Grace. Hi, Grace. But we went into Hanakapi`ai and did a rescue with — there was
like forty (40) people stuck all over there. So, this kind of got us into this and we
did lose a life there. Again, we need to reprioritize and looking at risk managers.
Where are we doing it and what are we doing with the moneys that we had? So,
before the end of Fiscal Year 2012-2013, we did have some money left in training
that we sent three (3) personnel up to Colorado for swiftwater training. As part of
their tasks, we asked them to do the Risk Analysis, do your Standard Operating
Guidelines (SOG), and again to start the training. What it came down to is that
before we got to the point and we looked at it, we did not have the equipment even
to start the training, even at an awareness level, which is something that we are
saying that we have to start to do to have these things in place. So, when we look at
our budget, these moneys that were assigned here were for airbags, which needs
replacement. They have a shelf life of about ten (10) years and airbags is what we
use to extricate — well, not only extrication, but also a lifting mechanism in certain
areas. Battalion Chief (BC) Ornellas went back and talked to the provider of the
airbag and they said, "Hey, what can we do instead of buying the whole unites?
Could we go back and try to bring the costs down so that we could allocate some of
these moneys towards some swiftwater gear?" So, what happened is that we
identified the airbags and keeping all the hardware, the regulators and hoses and
COUNCIL MEETING 85 JANUARY 29, 2014
things that are already in place and use the remainder of those moneys to purchase
this swiftwater gear.
Chair Furfaro: Who wrote the grant?
Mr. Blalock: This is actually a line item that we had in
our budget. It was not so much a grant per se for this equipment. It was a line item
we had in our budget.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. I just wanted to get some
clarification. Steve, as a line item approved in their budget, what is the
requirement for them to come back to us if this is not a grant?
Mr. Hunt: Is it equipment purchased over ten thousand
dollars ($10,000)?
Chair Furfaro: Okay, got it. I should have known that. It
did not make the minimum. Thank you. JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: Chief, does swiftwater rescue refers to both
ocean and freshwater streams or mainly freshwater?
Mr. Blalock: Basically the way that the NFPA and a lot of
what we are going through, that is our standard in the fire service. NFPA is
actually, when they say swiftwater, it is more tributary freshwater incidents that
we have, not only here, but in Colorado and Nationwide. That is the way that they
look at a swiftwater incident.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay. How many swiftwater rescues have
we had on Kaua`i?
Mr. Blalock: Many, and actually, like I said, I almost
wanted to say a story that even in that same season that we had all of the
swiftwater rescues there was a truck at Loop Road that was swept in and you still
need to do a rescue. There were people in Waimea Valley. You want to share that
one?
Mr. Ornellas: Yes as Chief Blalock said, it happened in last
year or so, up Loop Road there are several crossings and there is water crossing
over the culvert. People tried to cross and they got swept over the bridge. They
were on the roof of the car and the Kapa'a Fire Station responded and without
really any formal training per se, we have kind of been doing the best we can and
training and trying to be aware of it, but without any formal equipment or training.
They got a rope to him and got the person secured. Basically, it was like a
pendulum to the bank of the river and the truck got swept away right after that. In
the same vein, the same occurrence at Hanakapi`ai Stream, I was on-duty BC. We
had a vehicle trying to cross up in Waimea Valley. This is in the middle of the
night. We had the rescue squads tied up overnight in the valley. So, the Waimea
Firefighters went out there and they went out. The people were out in the middle of
the stream and they went and secured them. Like I said, we were kind of
improvising. We try to get the job down our talents. We have a lot of surfers and so
they basically ties the ropes to the surfboard and paddled out into the river and
drifted down towards the vehicle in the stream and they were able to secure the
passenger in the vehicle. Then as things started to escalating, there was a resident
COUNCIL MEETING 86 JANUARY 29, 2014
from Waimea Valley who came out with the mule and the mule pretty much made
its way out to the vehicle and everybody came to shore safely.
Ms. Yukimura: Wow.
Mr. Ornellas: As Chief Blalock said, recently, we have been
doing a lot with what we have for a long time. We have higher populations, just the
type of tourism that we have. There are a lot of adventure tourism and all of these
people going into these hidden place that we never really used to have to deal with
before. A lot of the times it would be just residents that would now to find shelter in
place or hunters, but now we are finding ourselves responding a lot more to these
occurrence where people are not equipped for the situation at-hand. We needed to
be proactive in our approach in trying to get the training and equipment to better
accomplish our Department's mission to serve the public and ourselves. Also,
ourselves to be safe because we are going to go. We are going not respond. We are
not going to sit on the bank and wait for anything to happen we are going to go. So,
it is better for us to be safe for our personnel also. We are trying to protect our
people.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, thank you for the explanations. When
you cite those specific incidents, it is really clear what you are being called to do and
also how proactive you are by developing this training and getting the equipment
for it. So, that is really good. It also really illustrates the justification for us to get
more Transient Accommodation Tax (TAT) money because so many of your rescues
and the expense for is being caused by the visitors that are here. Thank you very
much.
Chair Furfaro: Who else? Vice Chair.
Mr. Chock: Thank you, Chair. I can recall many
swiftwater incidences in the Fire Department. I had just a clarification question.
Are you saying that the equipment that was being purchased is for each Firefighter
and the second question I had was is there a maintenance cost for the equipment
that you are purchasing?
Mr. Blalock: Basically, what we are looking at
Councilmember Chock, is that some of the equipment will be for Personal Protective
Equipment (PPE) to each Firefighter, but some of the cash that we are looking at is
going to be to specific stations. Some is to specific stations and then some is to
outfit all stations with a certain cache to at least come in and to make an
assessment and to maybe stabilize the situation to which we come upon.
Mr. Chock: Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you. A lot of you do not know, but
Jason used to be from Pop Warner pee wee to high school, we were against each
other, going head-on, and basically fighting out there. It is kind of funny to see
Jason across the rail here, but we have got Super Bowl coming up. Anyway, with
the fifteen thousand dollars ($15,000), it does not seem much for equipment to
spread amongst all of our stations. Are we still deciding how we are going to spread
all of the equipment out or we kind of know?
COUNCIL MEETING 87 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Blalock: A lot it is PPEs. We are looking at personal
PPEs and what is required by the training that they had through NFPA. Maybe I
did not answer Councilmember Chock's question on the ongoing and the
maintenance of equipment that we would be purchasing. Through attrition, you
need to supply as new Firefighters come in and things like that. Basically, the
caches that are there, probably has a life span of ten (10) to fifteen (15) years as far
as when we are having it there and then you have the cycle problem that you have
to redo the cache. One of the very unique items that is we are going to be procuring
is like a banana boat. A banana boat is like a floatation boat, but there is a hole in
the bottom and the water can still flow through and you can still get it to wherever
the victims are. These are some of the things that again, for us even on an
awareness level, we did not have prior to going through the training. The personnel
that went to the training are training the trainers. So, they have received the
training and now we are looking at this to train the Department.
Mr. Kagawa: Basically, you said that you folks have been
doing swiftwater rescues for many years, but this equipment here will give you folks
better resources and tools to do future swiftwater rescues and things?
Mr. Blalock: Definitely on the risk management side, not
only for Firefighters, but also for the community as a whole and how we approach
these incidents moving forward.
Mr. Kagawa: This is mostly for freshwater or even in some
cases can the ocean, too?
Mr. Blalock: Chair brought it up, but it is the delineation
as far as when you are saying swiftwater and ocean rescue. These equipments
basically, no. We already have a cache and PPEs as far as pertaining to ocean
rescues and things like that. So, this is basically going to be focusing on freshwater.
Mr. Kagawa: Mahalo. Thank you, Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Any more questions? Jason, were you
defense or offense when you folks played across from each other?
Mr. Ornellas: We were both ways. We were always facing
each other, offense and defense and then we played community basketball after
that, without pads.
Chair Furfaro: Chief, I just want you to know that I will
revisit this with Steve afterwards. The reason I asked the question if it was
previously in the budget, and so forth, this Section 17 in the proviso kind of makes
an exception for emergency equipment previously budgeted for. I think we would
need a little bit more clarity because I would think that something is in the Fire
budget or Police budget and it is budgeted for, it is not accepting a grant and it is for
emergency services, I did not think you had to come back to us. If it was intended
for all other types of equipment, but we will just get some clarity going forward.
Thank you very much for the work that you did in putting this together. I will
excuse the two of you and see if we have any testimony from anyone in the public.
It does not look like it.
Mr. Ornellas: Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 88 JANUARY 29, 2014
There being no one to provide testimony, the meeting was called back to
order, and proceed as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We are going to vote on this item right now.
Further discussion?
Mr. Rapozo: Mr. Chair?
Chair Furfaro: Yes.
Mr. Rapozo: I know they are walking out.
Chair Furfaro: Hui.
Mr. Rapozo: No, no. I just wanted to thank them. I think
their examples that they cited really, really tell the story about what the Fire
Department does. I mean a lot of the things that they do not make the —that is the
Waianae.
Chair Furfaro: I know, it just came out. You folks are
talking football, the next thing I know, I am giving them the old Country call. Talk
about looking kua aina.
Mr. Rapozo: But a lot of the things that they do, we read
about it in the paper because some truck got flipped into the stream. But the
details about the mule and about improvising. I think it is important that the
public understand that these gentlemen and ladies in the Fire Department do risk
their lives and they do whatever it takes to save lives. This request here is no new
money. It is a departure of what the budget, and exactly what I was talking about
in a prior item. I mean it makes no sense to me as the Chair has stated that they
are required to come here to move money from a line item that was supposed to be
used for airbags and attachments to swiftwater rescue equipment, which is helmets,
ropes, carbineers, and gloves, minor things that they need. But yet, for the other
Departments, they can take salary money and move it to something completely
different and not step in this office. I think that is where I am saying there needs to
be some consistency. I do appreciate it because this is different from what the
budgeted item was and the public gets to see that the transfer is happening. It is
happening for equipment, but it is for equipment that is much needed. Again, it is
not new money and the Kaua`i Fire Department will realize a cost savings in the
process. Thank you, again. I do not know if you got the first part of it, but I am
curious to see how Ross votes because of your competitive nature. He may vote no,
but I still think we have the votes to make it happen. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. If there is no other dialogue, Chief, we
are going to vote on this now. You can leave today with an answer one way or the
other, if you should go right ahead and we will seek some clarity on emergency
equipment versus emergency purchases going forward. Any further dialogue? If
not, this motion C 2014-34 for approval.
The motion to approve C 2014-34 was then put, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1
(Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: If not, Chief, 6:0, you are fine. Jade, we are
going to top of the page 4.
COUNCIL MEETING 89 JANUARY 29, 2014
CLAIMS:
C 2014-37 Communication (12/26/2013) from the Deputy County Clerk,
transmitting a claim filed against the County of Kaua`i by Alamo Rental Damage
Recovery Unit, for damages to their vehicle, pursuant to Section 23.06, Charter of
the County of Kaua`i: Mr. Kagawa moved to refer C 2014-37 to the County
Attorney's Office for disposition and/or report back to the Council, seconded by
Mr. Rapozo, and carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Next claim, item 2.
C 2014-38 Communication (01/06/2014) from the Deputy County Clerk,
transmitting a claim filed against the County of Kaua`i by Amy Bonvillain, for
damages to her vehicle, pursuant to Section 23.06, Charter of the County of Kauai:
Mr. Kagawa moved to refer C 2014-38 to the County Attorney's Office for
disposition and/or report back to the Council, seconded by Mr. Chock, and carried by
a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: We are going to go to Committee Reports
now.
COMMITTEE REPORTS:
ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICES / PUBLIC SAFETY/ COMMUNITY ASSISTANCE
COMMITTEE:
A report (No. CR-EPC 2014-01) submitted by the Environmental Services /
Public Safety / Community Assistance Committee, recommending that the following
be Received for the Record:
"C 2014-14 Communication (12/06/2013) from the Civil Defense
Manager, requesting Council approval to receive and expend grant funds in
the amount of $475,000 from the United States Department of Homeland
Security via the State of Hawai`i, Department of Defense, for the Fiscal
Year 2013 State Homeland Security Grant Program for the following:
1) Continue to enhance the capability of State and local units of
government to prevent, deter, respond to, and recover from threats
and incidents of terrorism involving the use of chemical, biological,
radiological, nuclear and explosive weapons, and cyber attacks, in
addition to day-to-day all-hazards scenarios;
2) Continue to provide support to Citizen Corps Councils with
planning, outreach, and management of Citizen Corps programs
and activities, such as Community Emergency Response Teams and
Neighborhood Watch,"
Mr. Bynum moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Kagawa, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
A report (No. CR-EPC 2014-02) submitted by the Environmental Services /
Public Safety / Community Assistance Committee, recommending that the following
be Amended to Bill No. 2515, Draft 1; Received for the Record on second and final
reading:
COUNCIL MEETING 90 JANUARY 29, 2014
"Bill No. 2515 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
SECTION 21-9.2 OF THE KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED,
RELATING TO INTEGRATED SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT,"
Mr. Bynum moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Kagawa, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
FINANCE & ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT (TOURISM / VISITOR INDUSTRY /
SMALL BUSINESS DEVELOPMENT / SPORTS & RECREATION
DEVELOPMENT/ OTHER ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AREAS) COMMITTEE:
A report (No. CR-FED 2014-02) submitted by the Finance & Economic
Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business Development / Sports &
Recreation Development / Other Economic Development Areas) Committee,
recommending that the following be Approved on second and final reading:
"Bill No. 2517 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE TO ESTABLISH A
NEW ARTICLE UNDER CHAPTER 22, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS
AMENDED, ENTITLED CAT LICENSING PROGRAM,"
Mr. Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Bynum, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
A report (No. CR-FED 2014-03) submitted by the Finance & Economic
Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business Development / Sports &
Recreation Development / Other Economic Development Areas) Committee,
recommending that the following be Approved as Amended on second and final
reading:
"Bill No. 2513 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. B 2013-753, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE
OPERATING BUDGET OF THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE OF HAWAII,
FOR THE FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2013 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2014, BY
REVISING THE AMOUNTS ESTIMATED IN THE GENERAL FUND (Office
of Economic Development, Executive/Consultant Services (Joint Fact Finding
Group (JFFG) Scope-of-Work Environmental Public Health Impact Study
(EPHIS)) - $100,000),"
Mr. Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Bynum, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
A report (No. CR-FED 2014-04) submitted by the Finance & Economic
Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business Development / Sports &
Recreation Development / Other Economic Development Areas) Committee,
recommending that the following be Received for the Record on second and final
reading:
"Bill No. 2514 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
SECTION 5 2.3, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED, RELATING
TO THE COUNTY MOTOR VEHICLE WEIGHT TAX,"
Mr. Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Bynum, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
COUNCIL MEETING 91 JANUARY 29, 2014
A report (No. CR-FED 2014-05) submitted by the Finance & Economic
Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business Development / Sports &
Recreation Development / Other Economic Development Areas) Committee,
recommending that the following be Approved on second and final reading:
"Bill No. 2518 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. B 2013-754, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE
CAPITAL BUDGET OF THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE OF HAWAII,
FOR THE FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2013 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2014, BY
REVISING THE AMOUNTS ESTIMATED IN THE SPECIAL TRUST FUND
FOR PARKS & PLAYGROUNDS (Black Pot Park Expansion - $94,427),"
Mr. Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Bynum, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE:
A report (No. CR-COW 2014-02) submitted by the Committee of the Whole,
recommending that the following be Received for the Record:
"COW 2014-01 Communication (01/10/2014) from Councilmember
Yukimura, requesting agenda time for a presentation from Families First
Hawai`i Services, Inc., on the Feasibility Study for the proposed Residential
Adolescent Drug Treatment Center),"
Mr. Bynum moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Rapozo, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
A report (No. CR-COW 2014-03) submitted by the Committee of the Whole,
recommending that the following be Approved on second and final reading:
"Bill No. 2519 A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE APPROVING A
COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT FOR BARGAINING UNIT 11
BETWEEN JULY 1, 2011 AND JUNE 30, 2017,"
Mr. Bynum moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Rapozo, and
carried by a vote of 6:0:1 (Mr. Hooser was excused).
RESOLUTION:
Resolution No. 2014-01 — RESOLUTION ESTABLISHING NO PARKING AT
ANY TIME ALONG PORTION OF KOLOA ROAD, KOLOA DISTRICT, COUNTY
OF KAUAI: Mr. Bynum moved to adopt Resolution No. 2014-01, seconded by
Mr. Chock.
Chair Furfaro: May I ask, Larry, do we have a map of what
area this contains here? I have one in a packet, but is it the entire Koloa Road? It
cannot be the entire Koloa Road, right?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Mr. Dill: For the record, Larry Dill, County Engineer.
Chair, you should have in your packet, a location map and an Exhibit A which is a
COUNCIL MEETING 92 JANUARY 29, 2014
close up of the specific area where we are proposing to implement the no-parking.
So, the location map shows you the location...
Chair Furfaro: I am sorry. It was one (1) page ahead of me.
I had just the aerial overview. Thank you for being here, Larry.
Mr. Dill: Sure.
Chair Furfaro: Any other questions for Larry while he is up?
No?
Mr. Rapozo: I have a question
Chair Furfaro: Question for you, Mr. Dill.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Mr. Chair. So, this was in
response to the Committee request?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Mr. Rapozo: How did this come about and was the
community in general notified or the Koloa Community Association...?
Mr. Dill: No, our communication was with the owner
of the property whose customers has had difficulty getting in and out safely.
Mr. Rapozo: We did not have an opportunity to?
Mr. Dill: That is correct. We did not speak with the
community.
Mr. Rapozo: We have been down this road Mr. Chair, and
I am really hesitant to approve these things without having some input. To me, it
looks like a reasonable request, but this is a request from an individual landowner
and as we went through this exercise with Koloa Road as well — I am sorry, it was
Po`ipu Road. I just want to make sure before we — I think that would be part of the
engineering. As they go through the request like this, maybe the person who is
considering this, the landowner, is required to notify people within a five hundred
(500) foot radius or something like that because this is a major change and I feel
uncomfortable voting today because I have no idea. I think at least the Koloa
Neighborhood Association should have the opportunity anyway to chime in.
Chair Furfaro: At minimum.
Mr. Rapozo: That is all that I am saying.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. I agree. I think if we
pass this and the no-parking signs go up, they will be blaming the Council for not
giving them ample time to respond. I would appreciate it if Public Works or the
Mayor could check with some of the nearby businesses there, if they have any
problems. If they do, they can contact the Council. I will even be contacting the
Koloa Fish Market and let them know, too, to let some of their neighbors know
COUNCIL MEETING 93 JANUARY 29, 2014
about this proposal. However, if the businesses around the area feel like it will not
impact business and that they are okay with it, then I have no problems approving
this. I would not mind waiting a week or two (2). Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kagawa, are you interpreting this the
same way I am? Bert's Fish House is somewhere where Beverly Hashimoto's
property is, right? So, Larry, if we are interpreting the same thing, that is a sixty
(60) foot setback of no parking from the corner? That is sixty (60) feet?
Mr. Dill: I thought it was fifty (50) from the center. I
am sorry. You are right. Sixty (60) feet, correct.
Chair Furfaro: Sixty (60) feet, that is a lot. Go ahead, Vice
Chair.
Mr. Chock: Just another clarification, is the proposed
no-parking area also fronting the business owner's property?
Mr. Dill: No.
Mr. Chock: It is not?
Mr. Dill: No.
Chair Furfaro: Larry, how urgent if we defer this for two (2)
meetings?
Mr. Dill: We can defer it and take care of those things.
That is not a problem.
Chair Furfaro: I have a tendency on this one to agree with
Mr. Kagawa and Mr. Rapozo. It would be right to do follow-up and talk to the
Community Association because with these other businesses over here, I think all
that will do is force these people to park in the parking lot of the Post Office.
Mr. Dill: I am sorry. There is more parking along and
in frontage of the other property. This is just in the vicinity, but I hear you.
Chair Furfaro: I would like to defer this members, for two
(2) weeks if I could.
Mr. Rapozo: I just have one (1) more question.
Chair Furfaro: Go ahead.
Mr. Rapozo: Larry, on the map, this is not to scale
obviously, right? The close-up map where you are showing the intersection? It is
between the Koloa Cultural Center building. The requester, is that the Koloa
Cultural Center building?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
COUNCIL MEETING 94 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: I do not know if you are even prepared to
answer this, but from Wiliwili Road intersection to the start of the property of the
requester, how far is that?
Mr. Dill: I do not know that distance.
Mr. Rapozo: Because I am just looking at the little black
mark.
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Mr. Rapozo: I do not think that actually depicts sixty (60)
feet.
Mr. Dill: It may not.
Mr. Rapozo: When you look at this picture, it looks like
maybe one (1) car, but sixty (60), you are talking removing parking of six (6)
vehicles.
Mr. Dill: No, that would be three (3) vehicles.
Mr. Rapozo: Three (3) for sixty (60) feet?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Really?
Mr. Rapozo: One (1) car is twenty (20) feet long.
Mr. Dill: Well, a typical parking stall is eighteen (18)
feet.
Mr. Rapozo: Eighteen (18) feet?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Mr. Rapozo: So, that would be three (3) parking stalls?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Well, then for lateral parking, my daughter
should never had ever has a problem with eighteen (18) feet.
Mr. Dill: No comment.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: Just a clarification. It says sixty (60) feet
from the center line of the entrance. So, some of that sixty (60) feet is a driveway.
(Inaudible.)
Mr. Dill: Correct, three-ish parking stalls.
COUNCIL MEETING 95 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: Okay, we will see. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Is everybody okay with the request to defer
for two (2) weeks? We are going to get a motion to defer here.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceed
as follows:
Ms. Yukimura: Was there a motion?
Mr. Rapozo moved to defer Resolution No. 2014-01, seconded by
Ms. Yukimura, and carried by a 6:0:1 vote (Mr. Hooser was excused).
Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Larry. We will see you in two (2)
weeks. Next item, please.
BILL FOR FIRST READING:
Proposed Draft Bill (No. 2529) —A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. B-2013-753, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE OPERATING
BUDGET OF THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE OF HAWAII, FOR THE FISCAL
YEAR JULY 1, 2013 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2014, BY REVISING THE AMOUNTS
ESTIMATED IN THE GENERAL FUND (Police Department Workers
Compensation Medical — $110,000): Mr. Kagawa moved for passage of Proposed
Draft Bill No. 2529 on first reading, that it be ordered to print, that a public hearing
thereon be scheduled for February 26, 2014, and that it thereafter be referred to the
Finance & Economic. Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business
Development / Sports & Recreation Development / Other Economic Development
Areas) Committee, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: I have a second from Mr. Rapozo, a motion
by Mr. Kagawa. Discussion? JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura: I would like to send a question to the Police
Department while we go through the process of public hearing, to see, if like the
Fire Department they have looked in their budget to find the money somewhere in
their budget.
Chair Furfaro: While this is for first reading, to send over a
query in their current budget if they could not find the money from other
opportunities.
Ms. Yukimura: Even unexpended salaries.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. We will send that communication
over. But in the meantime, we have a motion to approve on first reading with
public hearing for February 26th and on that note, I would like a roll call vote
please.
COUNCIL MEETING 96 JANUARY 29, 2014
The motion for passage of Proposed Draft Bill No. 2529 on first reading, that
it be ordered to print, that a public hearing thereon be scheduled for
February 26, 2014, and that it thereafter be referred to the Finance &
Economic Development (Tourism / Visitor Industry / Small Business
Development / Sports & Recreation Development / Other Economic
Development Areas) Committee, was then put, and carried by the following
vote:
FOR PASSAGE: Bynum, Chock, Kagawa, Rapozo,
Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL— 6,
AGAINST PASSAGE: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Six (6) ayes.
Chair Furfaro: 6:0. Thank you. we are going to go to Bills
for Second Reading now.
BILLS FOR SECOND READING:
Bill No. 2513, Draft 1 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
ORDINANCE NO. B-2013-753, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE OPERATING
BUDGET OF THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE OF HAWAII, FOR THE FISCAL
YEAR JULY 1, 2013 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2014, BY REVISING THE AMOUNTS
ESTIMATED IN THE GENERAL FUND (Office of Economic Development,
Executive/Consultant Services (Joint Fact Finding Group (JFFG) Scope-of-Work
Environmental Public Health Impact Study (EPHIS)) - $100,000): Mr. Rapozo
moved to adopt Bill No. 2513, Draft 1 on second and final reading, and that is be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, seconded by Ms. Yukimura.
Chair Furfaro: Discussion? Mr. Kagawa.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. This relates to Bill
No. 2491, now Ordinance No. 960. I did not support the Bill and I did not think
that it belonged in the County's hands to pursue these types of studies or these kind
of fact finding. However, the Bill is now an Ordinance and one of the main things
that I came out with after going through all of the hours and hours of discussion
and community input, is that somebody needs to do a study on the health impacts
and on the impacts on the environment. I think I will reluctantly support this Bill
on Second Reading because I feel like the Federal government and the State has the
expertise to know what to do with a study like this and they have the knowledge.
When we are done with the study, what are we going to do here at the County? We
do not have scientists or doctors. The State and Federal government have people
like that on their payroll. I just feel like we are doing a study, but at some point
when we find out what is happening to the environment and to the health and
safety of the public, that will flow back to the State and flow back to the Federal to
do something about it. For that reason, I will vote in support of this Bill on Second
Reading just because I believe that the people of Kaua`i deserve to know the
impacts of pesticide use on their health and on the environment. Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 97 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much for that statement,
Mr. Kagawa. I do believe that the people in our County deserve the right to know.
One way to find out is by doing the fact-finding piece. Thank you for those
comments.
Mr. Kagawa: You are welcome.
Chair Furfaro: JoAnn, you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: I, too, appreciate Councilmember Kagawa's
thinking and intention to vote "yes" on this. To me, it was the crux of the debate on
Bill No. 2491. I do not think nobody else is embarking on a study like this. So,
somebody needs to do it. I think this joint fact-finding process is the way to go
about dealing with it. I think it can be a real contribution to setting good public
policy on this issue.
Chair Furfaro: Any more discussion? To the Deputy Clerk,
this will be a voice vote? No? Roll call vote. That is what I meant. I am sorry.
Now, before we go any further, members, there are other Money Bills coming up
today and at the same time, we have a number of people traveling to Denver for the
Planning Conference. If you would like to defer any of these future Bills, please
make a date specific and the date we are looking at is February 26th. Okay? JoAnn,
you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: No, I will make my comments on the next
Bills. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Are we ready to have a roll call vote here?
Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: I am going to support this. This is the first
stage of creating the scope-of-work for a study that the community, I think, has
requested and needs. I want to point out just in these comments that we need to do
this study because no one to my knowledge, has ever studied the impact on any
community of the research agricultural practices that are occurring here on Kaua`i.
All the regulations, State, County, and Federal, are all focused and assume
production agriculture. What is occurring here on Kaua`i is experimentation on a
vast majority of the lands that are held by the seed companies. The things that
they grow on the vast majority of the land are not sold to anyone. They are
destroyed because they are experiments. They are not growing seeds here to sell to
other farmers or growing corn that feeds in the vast majority of their work. The
reason the study is happening is because of the unique things that are occurring
here on Kaua`i, where large quantities of pesticides, much higher than production
and very frequently being sprayed on Kaua`i. We need to know about the impacts of
this unique circumstance that is here on Kaua`i, that has not been studied by
anyone, I believe. So, I just want to say why I am supporting this. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Any more dialogue before I call for the vote?
Mr. Chock: Chief — I am sorry I said Chief. Chair. I
forgot where I was. Chair, Grace Peralta is going to be departing. I just wanted to
recognize her as she leaves and thank her for her time here. Hopefully, we inspired
her to consider a seat one day.
COUNCIL MEETING 98 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Peralta: Thank you everyone for having me. I hope
you have a good rest of the meeting.
Chair Furfaro: We will.
Mr. Chock: Grace, do you have any questions before you
leave?
Ms. Peralta: No.
Mr. Chock: We can catch up later. Thank you, Chair.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Any further dialogue before I actually
call for the vote? Roll call, please.
The motion to adopt Bill No. 2513, Draft 1 on second and final reading, and
that it be transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, was then put, and
carried by the following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chock, Kagawa, Rapozo,
Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL — 6,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Chair Furfaro: We have a 6:0 vote on that. Thank you very
much everyone. Now, we will go to the next item, and if you folks feel you want to
be here for upcoming Bill, then you want to defer. Remember, use the date I gave
you of February 26th.
Bill No. 2514 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING SECTION 5-2.3,
KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE COUNTY
MOTOR VEHICLE WEIGHT TAX: Mr. Rapozo moved to receive Bill No. 2514 for
the record on second and final reading, seconded by Mr. Kagawa.
Ms. Yukimura: It is not a motion until it is recognized.
Mr. Rapozo: I am sorry?
Mr. Kagawa: Oh, whoever he recognizes then.
Mr. Rapozo: Mr. Chair?
Chair Furfaro: Yes, I am thinking about this. Go ahead
JoAnn.
Ms. Yukimura moved to defer Bill No. 2514 to May 14, 2014.
Mr. Rapozo: I would suggest that we have some
discussion before you do a deferral.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay.
Ms. Yukimura withdrew her motion to defer Bill No. 2514 to May 14, 2014.
COUNCIL MEETING 99 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Rapozo: Have the courtesy of at least allowing us to
discuss this before you defer.
Ms. Yukimura: Mr. Chair, then for discussion purposes.
Chair Furfaro: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: I would like to move the decision until
May 14th. It is one (1) week after the public hearing on the budget and it is one (1)
week before our vote on the budget. To me, it is important to have this Bill after we
have seen all of the context of the budget, what our needs are, and what the balance
comes out otherwise, if we kill it and then vote, we have to retrieve it and set a
public hearing again and everything. We have already gone through that. So, I
would rather defer it to May 14th, when we already gone through the budget
process. We will have a much better sense of what our revenue needs are and we
can vote on it then to either to kill it, to amend it, or to pass it.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum, you are next.
Mr. Bynum: Thank you for your comments,
Councilmember Yukimura and Chair. These are both bills I put before the Council
in consultation with the Administration. I would like a deferral to all seven (7)
members can discuss this issue and they will be present. I believe we will all be
present on the 26th. I would like to defer this until February 26th, that is prior to
the Mayor submitting his budget and these were purposefully brought to the table
so a decision could be made prior to the Mayor submitting a budget. The Mayor is
going to have a very difficult challenge in giving us a balanced budget and then we
will have that challenge, but clarity about whether the Council supports these
revenue measures that were brought here by the Administration previously will
assist the Administration in their budget decision-making. So, I would strongly
encourage the Council to support a deferral until February 26th as suggested by the
Chair. I will make that motion when everyone has had an opportunity to speak.
Chair Furfaro: Well, the motion we have on the table is a
motion to receive and a second. Now, the way we would do this procedurally is if
you would like to find ourselves having this on either on the 26th as I stated or
May 14th as JoAnn stated, we would first have to vote on receiving it. The fact of
the matter is, you would vote not to receive the item and then we would entertain
another motion other than a deferral motion, which a deferral motion would
supersede the motion to receive. Are we all clear on that?
Ms. Yukimura: Point of clarification, Chair. I think you are
right that the motion to defer supersedes the motion to receive, so what will happen
then if we do have a motion to defer and we vote on it, that whole Bill will move to
wherever we defer it to.
Chair Furfaro: Yes, you have to defer it to date-specific,
which I had mentioned earlier.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: But, let us continue to have dialogue on the
rationale, okay? Mr. Kagawa, you would like the floor?
COUNCIL MEETING 100 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Kagawa: I think he was first.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Kagawa: I will go next.
Mr. Rapozo: I think the Mayor submits the budget, I
think this year March 14th. I would guess it is best to take care of this Bill before
March 15th or March 14th before they prepare their budget. I think this generates
quite a bit of revenue and to take action on this Bill prior to March 15th puts the
Administration in a predicament because they do not know whether or not they can
count on this revenue. My position is to just do it today. I like seven (7) people
here, but we are not always going to have seven (7) people here and to continue to
defer Bills because someone is not here, I think we need to take care of this as soon
as possible. I am not going to be supporting this for the reasons I stated at the
Committee Meeting. The Committee has recommended that we receive it. The
Committee has the discussion and I think we should take action today. To defer it
to May, that puts the Administration in a really tough position because they will
not know and they cannot assume revenue that has not been voted on by the
Council. So, I think let this thing pass or fail today and then they will have a better
idea and we can deal with whatever the result is when we have our budget
discussions. But to prolong this until May, I think puts the Administration,
especially the people trying to put their budgets together, in a tough position. That
is just my position.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. I would like to suspend the rules for a
moment and ask Steve to coming up, if you do not mind?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Chair Furfaro: Steve, I am hoping you can shed some light
on what the Administration's desire of this Bill would be and here are the options.
Receive it today, which pretty much would kill the Bill; number 2, defer it to a
date-specific, which is February 26th to have discussion here with it; and/or wait
until, as Mr. Rapozo has pointed out, May 14th which is what JoAnn's
recommendation that we look at it after we are close to finalizing the budget. Does
the Administration first feel it might be necessary to leave this Bill open to look at
for some possible revenue or would it be the Administration's position that if the
Bill died here, it is done?
Mr. Hunt: It would be the position of the
Administration that we would like to keep this alive. I have not had the
opportunity to review the Public Works budget which is scheduled for the 31st, I
believe or it might have gotten moved. I did have the preliminary budget meeting
with Transportation and based on what their needs are along with some of the
requests, I will segregate the two (2). But between the combination of needs and
requests, it is about one million three hundred thousand dollars ($1,300,000)
increase. Certainly, the Highway Funds would be useful in covering some of the
transportation needs and to the extent we can address their wants, we may look at
that, but we would like to keep these alive.
Chair Furfaro: So, wanting to keep those alive, would be
feeling more comfortable to have a discussion on February 26th or would you feel
more comfortable to revisit it with JoAnn's date on May 14th?
COUNCIL MEETING 101 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Hunt: I would be more comfortable with having it
earlier. It would be nice knowing going into budget what we are dealing with
because it will affect decisions that we have to make.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Any questions of Steve? JoAnn?
Ms. Yukimura: Yes. After consulting with staff, I want to let
everybody know that I am not looking at May 14th anymore, but I am thinking
about April. It would be after the budget, but if the Bill dies, you will know what
you do not want to know, is that you will not have any revenues. So, I would rather
keep the option open, but I would like to see how the Administration is going to — I
mean, the Administration will have the ability to show us what the need is by
showing us what it has had to cut out in the budget you present to us and that may
show us that we need to give those moneys. But I do not want to give it to them to
assume that they have it while they are doing the budget.
Chair Furfaro: A great process in the democratic principles
here, as I asked you for your testimony. You would like to leave it alive and you
would like to have the discussion on February 26th? The April or May date and so
forth is not something that you could support?
Mr. Hunt: Well, again there is the original submission
that we will be having in March and there will be a supplemental in May. So,
certainly, we will have to make some decisions for the March, which may or may not
be predicated on that revenue. If we are assuming it will not be there, then there
will be some adjusted both to potentially Solid Waste and to Transportation.
Chair Furfaro: So, February 26th is something that would be
a healthy discussion for you folks. Any questions for Steve? No? Steve, thank you.
I am going to let you go.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: So members we have a motion to receive
and/or if there is going to be any attempt here, I need date-specific deferral with a
second to February 26th. Mr. Bynum, you have the floor.
Mr. Bynum moved to defer Bill No. 2514 to February 26, 2014, seconded by
Mr. Chock.
Chair Furfaro: I have a second here. No discussion on a
deferral, deferral date specific. Do a roll call, please.
The motion to defer Bill No. 2514 to February 26, 2014 was then put, and
carried by the following vote:
FOR DEFERRAL: Bynum, Chock, Furfaro TOTAL— 3,
AGAINST DEFERRAL: Kagawa, Rapozo, Yukimura TOTAL— 3,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Chair Furfaro: So, we have a 3:3 tie. This will automatically
come back up at the two (2) weeks space here. Two (2) weeks is comes back up, I
COUNCIL MEETING 102 JANUARY 29, 2014
have a bunch of people in Denver and it will not pass. So, that is the way the rules
are.
Mr. Bynum: Let us move on.
Chair Furfaro: Did you have a difference in my opinion? I
said it comes up in two (2) weeks, but we will not have all members here.
Mr. Rapozo: No, I am agreeing with that.
Chair Furfaro: Okay.
Mr. Rapozo: I wanted to have more discussion, but a
deferral was made. So, I respect the rule and I am moving on. Let us go to the next
item.
Chair Furfaro: So, that is how it is interpreted in the Rules.
We go to the next item please.
Bill No. 2515, Draft 1 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
SECTION 21-9.2 OF THE KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED,
RELATING TO INTEGRATED SOLID WASTE MANAGEMENT: Mr. Bynum moved
to adopt Bill No. 2515, Draft 1 on second and final reading, and that is be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: Second for discussion, okay. Mr. Bynum, you
have the floor.
Mr. Bynum: I want to make sure that we have an
opportunity to discuss, but my intention would be to make the same motion to defer
to February 26th.
Chair Furfaro: Any more comments, Mr. Kagawa and then
Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. We had this in
Committee and it was received. I think we agreed this was very premature to have
to adjust our fee. It is not like our fees are cheap. I think the fees are already close
to what the other islands are paying and to increase our tipping fees which will pass
on to businesses, businesses that our people do business at. If we keep increasing
amounts of expenses is for our businesses, it is going to hurt our public. It is going
to hurt the small businesses that we want to thrive. We do not want a County full
of big box businesses and we need to keep our mom and pop businesses alive. They
are the ones that employ our local people, and not like the big box does not, but we
want that mixture. I think again, the Garden Island Disposal will just pass on
these tipping fees to the businesses and the businesses will pass it on to our
residents. Like I said earlier, it is not like our tipping fees are lower anyway and
we are trying to catch up to the other islands. It is like we want to be the highest
tipping fee island in the State. To me, that is nothing to brag about. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Further dialogue? Mr. Rapozo.
Mr. Rapozo: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Again, for the same
reasons that I cited in the Committee Meeting I am not going to be supporting this.
COUNCIL MEETING 103 JANUARY 29, 2014
We are months away from the budget submittal. We talk about some of the
questions regarding the management of Solid Waste. We had a discussion today
about what happens with the four (4) men crew that became a one (1) man crew.
How are we allocating those resources? How are we saving money? Is our overtime
excessive? What plans does Solid Waste have to reduce the spending and
expenditures? Is it reassigning people or putting people in other positions? There
are a lot of questions that I have. What we are doing today or we are trying to do is
we are just trying to put more money in the budget so that the Administration can
continue on the trends that we have seen, the overspending, over the years. We
have seen for the last four (4) years or five (5) years that the spending has
outweighed our revenue and yet, we continue to try and increase revenue without
hearing from the Administration. That is what the budget process is for. That is
when the budget processes comes to us and says, "Hey, this is what we need." It is
our opportunity to scrutinize the budget, find out ways — not these two percent (2%),
or three percent (3%) cuts across the board. That does not satisfy me because a big
Department three percent (3%), small department, three percent (3%) or ten
percent (10%) or whatever it is, that is not how to do it. You have to look at each
Department, what are the essentials? What is non-essential? What can wait for
next year? What can wait for three (3) years? That is what the budget is for. We
vote on this today and we approve this, we just hand them a few more million
dollars and yet, I question the efficiency of Solid Waste. I mean, are we getting the
"bang for our bucks" in recycling? In trash pick-up? So, the vehicle is in place for us
to analyze the expenses of this County, that is called the budget. We were here a
couple of months before, trying to increase revenues again. Mr. Kagawa is
absolutely correct. The companies, a lot of the companies here are surviving. They
are struggling and they are barely making it and every increase in overhead gets
transferred down to the user, to the customer, which everybody will pay. I am not
going to support this. I can count too. It will probably be deferred, but the budget
process in my opinion, is where we determine whether or not we need to increase
revenues after cost-cutting measures have been implemented to the Council's
satisfaction. Thank you.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: I wanted to avoid general discussion about
budget, but I feel compelled to at least say that we have all sat here at the same
table. This is not a normal year. This is a year that we finally are getting our
employees wage increases that they deserve, in my opinion. We have made a
commitment to expand the Police force. We have made commitments for tens of
millions of spending that we do not have much control over. We have to fund the
Hawai`i Government Employees Association (HGEA), United Public Workers
(UPW), Fire and Police raises. It is time for us to do that in my opinion. So, we sit
here week after week, making commitment for expenditures, very large. We are not
talking about ten million dollars ($10,000,000) out of whack, ten million dollars
($10,000,000) that we have to find for a project. We are talking about ten million
dollars ($10,000,000) of revenue that we need to match our expenditures. Now,
there are some facts that will get presented here over the next few weeks. The fact
is that since 2008, local residents have had fee increase and trash fee increases,
they have paid additional property tax, increases over a four-(4) year period as a
class. While every other tax category had decreases, our sixty-five million dollars
($65,000,000) surplus is now down to ten million dollars ($10,000,000) and we
expect to spend all of that next year, we were told. These are just facts. At the end
of the day, we have to present a balanced budget. If we do not take this potential
two million five hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) of revenue that was
COUNCIL MEETING 104 JANUARY 29, 2014
recommended to us, that makes sense with public policy, that has businesses — yes,
contributing like residents have over the last four (4) or five (5) years. Everybody
has got to step up to the plate. Yes, some of this will get transferred. We went over
that, but we cannot just sit here approving additional spending. Our surplus will be
gone next year, totally gone. It is irresponsible to go into a budget season and plan
on spending every spare penny you that you have over the next two (2) years and
that is our plan as we sit here. Without this revenue, which is appropriate and
targeted at use, we are going to give the Mayor a much more difficult task to deal
with the budget. The Mayor asked for these revenues last year. We did not get
them. Eventually, we are going to say yes to some of this. We have to. This makes
more sense than waiting until later. Having said all of that, I hope to make a
deferral when people feel like they have their say and make a motion to defer until
February 26th, when all Councilmembers could be present to make this critical
decision or could be present on the 26th.
Ms. Yukimura: I would like to ask Councilmember Bynum
who proposed this? This was not proposed by the Administration?
Mr. Bynum: I proposed both of these Bills.
Ms. Yukimura: But it is not by request?
Mr. Bynum: No.
Ms. Yukimura: It is your proposal?
Mr. Bynum: I am taking responsibility. I was the
Finance Chair until a couple of weeks ago and I may be again in a few weeks and I
have worked with Finance on these finance issues for the last five (5) years, which
is all part of the public record.
Ms. Yukimura: That is all. You clarified who is proposing it.
That is all that I wanted to clarify.
Mr. Bynum: It is proposed by me and I have consulted
with the Administration along the way and Mr. Hunt has made it clear that the
Administration supports this proposal.
Ms. Yukimura: May I have some discussion?
Chair Furfaro: I gave you the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you. I want to say that I am in
agreement with Councilmember Rapozo about the management issues of the Solid
Waste Division. That is not new. I have been speaking about this for years and I
am very concerned that we would raise our fees to just pay for management error
costs and I do not believe that is proper to do. On the other hand, I understand the
issues of the need for more revenues, but I think it behooves the Administration to
come forward with a budget and a plan that shows us that the Solid Waste
Management Division will be well-managed and to show us the need for these
moneys. That is why I would like to defer this matter until we are able to look at all
of these issues through the budget process. I would like to see this matter deferred
and I think let us have the Administration come forward and give us the budget
without the moneys, but have a full discussion about if that is on their first budget
COUNCIL MEETING 105 JANUARY 29, 2014
submittal, have the budget hearings where they lay out what they want to do with
the extra moneys, and if we agree, to defer to March — I am sorry. April 23rd, before
the supplemental budget would allow them, if we pass it then, to come back with a
supplemental budget. I think there is a logical sequence that gives a fair hearing
and a fair chance to the Administration to put forth its plan and show how these
moneys will be used.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: I have to strongly object and I am sorry that
I have to say this to Councilmember Yukimura, linking the Mayor's staffing
decisions to our financial picture and our need to fund. Councilmember Yukimura
has been very clear that she is holding this whole process hostage because she
wants the Mayor to fire people in the Solid Waste Division and I am tired of us not
talking the truth here. It is irresponsible Councilmember Yukimura, to link this
issue about our finances with an issue about what the Mayor's prerogatives are.
Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum, I want to take a five (5) minute
recess. Everybody takes their temperament. County Attorney, I would like to see
you while we are on this recess.
There being no objections, the Council recessed at 4:25 p.m.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order at 4:38 p.m.,
and proceeded as follows:
Chair Furfaro: We are back from when I called a recess.
Mr. Bynum had the floor, his second recognition on the floor and he has the floor
again. Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: I think I said what I needed to say.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. JoAnn, you have the floor.
Ms. Yukimura: Yes, thank you. I just wanted to clarify and
repeat what I have said, that I think we are exercising appropriate budgetary
oversight when we ask the Solid Waste Division and the Public Works Department
to come up with a plan for the use of any extra fees that might be anticipated and
before we pass any Bill raising fees.
Chair Furfaro: As I summarize this, a reminder, we have a
motion by Mr. Kagawa and Mr. Rapozo to receive. Am I correct?
Ms. Yukimura: No, there was a motion to approve.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. I was corrected on the previous
Bill. So, we have a motion to approve, but not date specific or anything, just a
motion to approve. That is what we have on the table. Mr. Bynum and then JoAnn.
Mr. Bynum: As I stated, I would like to make a motion if
everyone is finished with discussing, to defer until February 26th as the Chair
suggested when all Councilmembers will be available to vote on this issue.
Chair Furfaro: JoAnn, you want to follow-up with that?
COUNCIL MEETING 106 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Yes. Maybe we can ask Larry Dill if Public
Works will have a proposed plan for the use of these fees by February 26th?
Chair Furfaro: Larry, it sounds like we have a short
question for you. You might get in the habit to sit in the front row so you do not
have to walk all the way from the back of the room. JoAnn, the rules are suspended
and pose your question to Mr. Dill again please.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Ms. Yukimura: Larry, the proposal for this increase in Solid
Waste fees did not come from the Administration. It came from Councilmember
Bynum, though he did say he had talked to the Administration. So, if it came from
the Administration either directly or indirectly, I presume there is a plan for how
these extra moneys would be used. My question is, does the Administration have a
plan for the use of that money?
Mr. Dill: For the record Larry Dill, County Engineer.
When Councilmember Bynum brought his proposal forward, we looked at our
numbers. As you recall, we did come forward with a proposal some time ago
requesting an increase in the tipping fees from ninety dollars ($90) to one hundred
nineteen dollars ($119) and we recently revisited those numbers. In quick analysis,
we estimate the cost of going up to the neighborhood of what Councilmember
Bynum was proposing. On the side of how we would use those funds, I agree with
you, that that a full analysis would be in the context of a budget discussion, but as I
think I have mentioned to a couple of the Councilmembers in offline discussions, a
couple of things we are looking at for this budget would be a new position in
conjunction with the two (2) Ordinances that were discussed at Council; the
Construction & Demolition Diversion (C & D) Ordinance and Business Recycling
Ordinance. We will need a position to properly manage those Ordinances to enforce
them and to provide outreach and education for all of the impacted businesses.
Another would be a Collection Supervisor position, especially with the work that we
are doing now to transfer all of the trash collection operations from the supervision
of our Roads Division to our Solid Waste Division.
Ms. Yukimura: That would take one million two hundred
thousand dollars ($1,200,000)?
Mr. Dill: I did not say it would take one million two
hundred thousand dollars ($1,200,000).
Ms. Yukimura: Yes, but that is how much the fees would
produce.
Mr. Dill: Yes, I understand. As I had mentioned,
those are two (2) things that off the top of my head would be priorities to add to this
year's budget.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, but there is no...
Mr. Dill: Beyond that, I do not have anything for you
at this time. That is right.
COUNCIL MEETING 107 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, and you would not be able to
propose it on February 26th or would you?
Mr. Dill: As far as new initiatives are concerned, as
you well know, the Solid Waste budget is significantly supported by the General
Fund. So, we would look for that initiative to help to do two (2) things. To help us
implement new programs such as these two (2) new positions, we would like to
bring programs back that were cut at last year's budget. The Recycling Grant
Program got cut. I think the Used Motor Oil Program got cut. We would like to
bring those back. I do not have the numbers off the top of my head, but it would
also serve to help us are reduce reliance on General Fund support for the Solid
Waste operations.
Ms. Yukimura: So, actually that is really a budget issue for
us?
Mr. Dill: Certainly, it is a budget issue, yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Are you ready to talk about how you are
better managing the Solid Waste processes and issues? Any kinds of changes that
you are making to ensure that we do not make mistakes that we have made in the
past in that Division? We have talked, for example, about things like contract
management training and et cetera?
Mr. Dill: Yes, we have done some of those things
Ms. Yukimura: But are you able to pretty much address that
issue?
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Ms. Yukimura: Okay, by February 26th?
Mr. Dill: Yes. It would help me. I know you have
been very concerned about that issue in the past. If you have certain areas of
concern about where you think things have gone awry at the Department. We have
done things like contract management training, that is a very specific item we can
address.
Ms. Yukimura: We can look at lawsuits, penalties, and
things like that we have.
Mr. Dill: I am not aware of any lawsuits.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, legal issues then.
Mr. Dill: Okay.
Ms. Yukimura: I guess the other way to do is an audit of the
Solid Waste Division, but it is management of transfer stations, overall planning for
the upkeep of our facilities, and using Environmental Impact Studies (EIS) instead
of Feasibility Studies. I mean, just things like that.
COUNCIL MEETING 108 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: So that we are not confused, Larry, I am
going to just read off two (2) numbers if you could acknowledge it. Our landfill
operations are approximately twelve million six hundred thousand dollars
($12,600,000) million a year. Confirm?
Mr. Dill: Our Solid Waste operations?
Chair Furfaro: Yes.
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Chair Furfaro: Twelve million six hundred thousand dollars
($12,600,000) a year. In our current situation five million five hundred thousand
dollars ($5,500,000) of that is subsidized by the General Fund.
Mr. Dill: Correct.
Chair Furfaro: I just want to make sure that everybody
understands the scope here that we are laying out. Now, I am going recognize
Mr. Bynum.
Mr. Bynum: Thanks Larry. Maybe this question is for
Steve, but Solid Waste and the expenses involved is kind of a moving target. You
would agree, correct?
Mr. Dill: To some degree, yes.
Mr. Bynum: Well, in the last couple of years we had a lot
of unexpected expenses from the Puhi issue. We know we are going to spend a
considerable amount of money because of concern about an existing liner that the
Health Department is going to make us look into, correct?
Mr. Dill: Well, we have yet to complete the
investigation of that.
Mr. Bynum: We do not know what is wrong, but we have
to investigate.
Mr. Dill: Correct.
Mr. Bynum: And that is going to require a considerable
sum.
Mr. Dill: Oh, yes, definitely an investigation is
required.
Mr. Bynum: And if we find a problem, it could be more.
Mr. Dill: Yes.
Mr. Bynum: So, we are all hopeful that we will discover
there is no further action, but I believe that was in the tune of seven hundred fifty
thousand dollars ($750,000).
COUNCIL MEETING 109 JANUARY 29, 2014
Mr. Dill: Yes, but I have to be honest with you that we
do not have a firm number until we complete the investigation.
Mr. Bynum: Right. I am just making this point.
Mr. Dill: Sure.
Mr. Bynum: In Finance, in the Solid Waste Division, it is
true that the General Fund has to contribute along with the contributions made by
the solid waste fees, correct, to make that up? The General Fund has to contribute
to that. In the last couple of budgets with Ernie, we tightened up all of the funds.
The Solid Waste Fund was carrying a balance and in the last couple of years we
made sure that that balance was not greater than needed to be set aside for future
landfill closures. My guess is, last year we had to contribute from the General Fund
to meet the Solid Waste needs. My guess is that we will have to contribute more in
the upcoming budget?
Mr. Dill: Yes, I believe that will be the case, yes.
Mr. Bynum: I believe that both Steve and you would have
more to share with us about that on February 26th. Is that correct or could have
more?
Mr. Dill: We could have more. We are certainly
preparing for budget right now and that is certainly one of the things that will be a
topic of discussion at budget time. I am not sure how mature that discussion will be
on February 26th.
Mr. Bynum: Thank you.
Mr. Dill: Okay.
Chair Furfaro: Okay. Make sure when we prepare to talk
about this, that I would like to see Steve as it relates to the Comprehensive Annual
Financial Report (CAFR), how much money is in the landfill closure reserves so we
understand where we are at, over the last several years the contributions we have
made to that reserve. What we have on the floor, is Larry has responded to the
February 26th date as you just heard and I need a motion to defer to a date specific,
if you want? JoAnn and then Tim.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Ms. Yukimura: More discussion. I really think this is a
budget discussion. I would rather that Public Works/Solid Waste prepare a clear
program for this coming year and tell us what that is going to be because as was
pointed out, these fees — I mean I voted for a lot of fee increases last year because
we had not raised fees and we were far below the other Counties. This fee is taking
us above all of the other Counties. To me, there needs to be some real clear
justification and assurance that there is a good plan for these moneys. I mean, I
asked questions about the 26th because if they could really be ready to tell us, I
would be open to it, but I think they are still developing their own budget and plans.
I think we are better for April 23rd which is right after our budget hearings, but
before the supplemental budget and I am open to other dates.
COUNCIL MEETING 110 JANUARY 29, 2014
Chair Furfaro: I am going to be very honest with you. We
keep discussing new dates, new dates. I want us to get a date on the table so we
can vote on it and not just continue with the discussion because if not, I am about to
vote with other side here and just kill it. So, give me a date.
Ms. Yukimura: Well, if there is no more discussion, I will
make a motion.
Chair Furfaro: Make a motion to defer to a date specific.
Ms. Yukimura moved to defer Bill No. 2515, Draft 1 to April 23, 2014,
seconded by Mr. Chock.
Chair Furfaro: We have a second. This is a deferral to
April 23rd.
Ms. Yukimura: It is a Council Meeting day.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Roll call vote, please.
The motion to defer Bill No. 2515, Draft 1 to April 23, 2014 was then put, and
carried by the following vote:
FOR DEFERRAL: Chock, Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL— 3,
AGAINST DEFERRAL: Bynum, Kagawa, Rapozo TOTAL— 3,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Chair Furfaro: So, we are back to 3:3 and now we have just
spent forty-five (45) minutes on basically saying to ourselves, schedule it again
another time. That is what happens with our rules. Now next item, please.
Bill No. 2518 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING ORDINANCE
NO. B-2013-754, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO THE CAPITAL BUDGET OF
THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE OF HAWAII, FOR THE FISCAL YEAR JULY
1, 2013 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2014, BY REVISING THE AMOUNTS ESTIMATED
IN THE SPECIAL TRUST FUND FOR PARKS & PLAYGROUNDS (Black Pot
Park Expansion - $94,427): Ms. Yukimura moved to adopt Bill No. 2518 on second
and final reading, and that is be transmitted to the Mayor for his approval,
seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: I have a motion to approve and a second
from Mr. Rapozo. Discussion? If not, this will be a roll call vote.
The motion to adopt Bill No. 2518 on second and final reading, and that it be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, was then put, and carried by the
following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chock, Kagawa, Rapozo,
Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL— 6,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
COUNCIL MEETING 111 JANUARY 29, 2014
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Six (6) ayes.
Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much. Next item.
Bill No. 2519 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE APPROVING A
COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT FOR BARGAINING UNIT 11
BETWEEN JULY 1, 2011 AND JUNE 30, 2017: Mr. Kagawa moved to adopt Bill
No. 2519 on second and final reading, and that is be transmitted to the Mayor for
his approval, seconded by Mr. Rapozo.
Chair Furfaro: It has been moved and seconded for an
approval on Bill No. 2519. Discussion? Steve, I want to thank you personally for
doing the spreadsheet for us many how these increases get compounded over the
future years. Thank you very much. Let us do a roll call vote, please.
The motion to adopt Bill No. 2519 on second and final reading, and that it be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, was then put, and carried by the
following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chock, Kagawa, Rapozo,
Yukimura, Furfaro TOTAL— 6,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Hooser TOTAL— 1,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Six (6) ayes.
Chair Furfaro: Six (6) ayes. Okay, I think that completes
our business for today. BC, thank you very much. We are now adjourned.
ADJOURNMENT.
There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 4:53 p.m.
Res• -ct 1 .u, s itted,
JADE • u TAIN-TANIGAWA
Deputy County Clerk
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