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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2018_0920_KHPRC_Minutes_DraftDRAFTjTj )Rq)AIDt ousel COUNTY OF KAUA'I KAUA'I HISTORIC PRESERVATION REVIEW COMMISSION Mo'ikeha Building, Meeting Room 2A/2B MINUTES A regular meeting of the Kauai Historic Preservation Review Commission (KHPRC) was held on September 20, 2018, in the Mo'ikeha Building, Meeting Room 2A/2B. The following Commissioners were present: Chair Pro Tem Anne Schneider, Althea Arinaga, Lawrence Chaffin Jr., Deatri Nakea, Aubrey Summers and Victoria Wichman. The following Commissioners were excused: Chair James Guerber and Commissioner Gerald Ida The following staff members were present: Planning Department Myles Hironaka (arrived at 3: 09 p.m.), Deputy Planning Director Ka`aina Hull, Shanlee Jimenez, and Alex Wong. Deputy County Attorney Mark Ishmael (arrived at 3: 08 p.m.). Office of Boards and Commissions Administrator Nicholas R. Courson and Support Clerk Sandra Muragin. The following staff members were excused: Deputy County Attorney Jodi Higuchi-Sayegusa Prior to the meeting being called to order, Administrative Assistant to the County Clerk Eddie Topenio administered the Oath of Office to the new Architecture Council Appointee Aubrey Summers, serving a 1st term ending 12/31/20. CALL TO ORDER The meeting was called to order at 3:04 p.m. ROLL CALL Deputy Planning Director Ka`aina Hull: Commissioner Arinaga. Ms. Arinaga: Here. Mr. Hull: Commissioner Chaffin. Mr. Chaffin: Here. Mr. Hull: Commissioner Guerber is excused. Commissioner Ida is excused. Commissioner Nakea. Ms. Nakea: Here. Mr. Hull: Commissioner Schneider. Chair Pro Tem. Schneider: Here. Mr. Hull: Commissioner Summers. Ms. Summers: Here. Mr. Hull: Commissioner Wichman. Ms. Wichman: Here. Mr. Hull: Madame Chair, we have a quorum. APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA Mr. Hull: Next agenda item is approval of the agenda. The Department would recommend, given the amount of members of the public we have present here today, to amend the agenda so that the discussion of the Certified Local Government be placed at the end of the agenda before Agenda Item J. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: So you need a motion to... Mr. Hull: Motion to approve — oh yes, motion to amend. Mr. Chaffin: Second. Ms. Wichman: I'll move to amend. Ms. Arinaga: Second. Chair Pro Tem. Schneider: All in favor? (Unanimous voice vote) Motion carried 6:0. Mr. Hull: Motion (sic) has been amended. APPROVAL OF THE JULY 19, 2018 MINUTES Mr. Hull: The next agenda item is approval of the July 19, 2018, minutes. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Do we have a motion to approve the minutes? Mr. Chaffin: I'll make a motion to approve the minutes. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: And a second? September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 2 of 24 Ms. Summers: I'll second. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: All in favor? (Unanimous voice vote) Motion carried 6:0. HEARINGS AND PUBLIC COMMENT Mr. Hull: Next agenda item is Hearings and Public Comment. This agenda item is for any members of the public who would like to testify on any agenda item at this time. The Chair generally reserves the ability for members of the public to also testify at the individual agenda item, so if you'd like to wait for the individual agenda item, that is acceptable, but if you have to go somewhere, essentially for the members of the public to testify at the beginning of the agenda, now would be the time. Seeing none, Madame Chair. ANNOUNCEMENTS AND GENERAL BUSINESS MATTERS Mr. Hull: There are no announcements. COMMUNICATIONS Mr. Hull: No communications. (Agenda Item) H.1., has been moved to the end of the agenda, so it is I., New Business. NEW BUSINESS 1. Restaurant Kiibo TMK: (4) 3-6-007:024 2991 Umi St., Lihu`e, Hawaii 96766 Proposed demolition of existing restaurant building. a. Director's Report pertaining to this matter. Mr. Hull: And Alex has a report pertaining to this matter. Historic Planner Alex Wong: Aloha, Alex Wong for the record. Mr. Wong read the Director's Report dated September 20, 2018, for the record. (Document on file) Mr. Alan Satta: Hello, my name is Alan Satta. I am (a) co-owner. I am the son of the owner, so that makes me an owner too. I am here on behalf of my dad who has owned Restaurant Kiibo for the past ... over 40 years. During the 40 years that we've been doing business here, we've seen a lot of changes. Times are changing. The way we're doing business is changing, September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 3 of 24 obviously. The whole restaurant business is changing and with that, our building is changing. It's breaking down; there's a lot of stuff that we need to fix, obviously. I don't know if you guys have been or seen our building, but there's a lot of wear and tear, and we would like to revamp it so we can keep up with the times. The first phase we would like is (to) just (fix) the restaurant side. We would like to fix that first, so we would kind of scale back. If you can look at the pictures, (and) this is totally like a rough draft. Obviously depending on cost and stuff, but this is our idea; is to scale back the restaurant side. So we would be on the left side over there (referring to the picture) that would be like the kitchen and we want kind of like a more open feel, so it's more welcoming. We also want to make room for food trucks to be parked outside. So on the right side it'd be open like that, where there'll be a common eating area. There'll also be a little stage with live music and stuff so people can easily come walking in and out, and it would be more walking friendly. Unidentified Speaker: (Inaudible) Mr. Satta: Yes, we need to. Yes, the main problem right now is the roof and they can't fix the roof ...I mean, they can't just only fix the roof right now because it's so damaged that we would have to actually remodel the whole thing. Yes. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Hello. Okay, just checking the mic. Thank you. Mr. Satta: So that's just the restaurant side. We would keep the Prosser (Realty) building side for now — just the way it is. So we would only remodel the actual restaurant side first. Then depending on our budget and all that, we want to fix the studio side that we have right next door, so we can have like an apartment up there and then eventually move on to the Prosser (Realty building) side. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Commissioners, any questions for the applicant? Mr. Chaffin: What are your (inaudible) requirements (inaudible)? Mr. Satta: According to the special plan, the Rice Street Planning requirements, it requires a certain amount of biking stalls that will replace parking. So I would have to obviously double- check on that, but I was told that the parking restraints aren't as strict if we install biking stalls. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: And what's before us is the demolition, not the new building at the moment. Mr. Chaffin: I guess my question is — how does this remodeling, or whatever their calling it, fit in with the parking requirements for a restaurant? Mr. Hull: Yes, so what's actually being proposed right now is, I think as Alan (Satta) has pointed out, is they do have plans to reconstruct eventually, but the proposal right now on the table is not the reconstruction; it's just solely the demolition. They don't have the actual plans for reconstruction at this point. When they do have reconstruction plans, of course they will September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 4 of 24 have to be reviewed to meet all building, engineering, electrical, as well as zoning requirements that are including, but not limited to, parking requirements. But right now, as is before this body, is the demolition of a structure that is over 50 years old. So under Hawaii Revised Statutes (HRS) 6E, it does qualify as a historical structure. But... so that's what your review (is) essentially; is the demolition going to negatively impact this historical structure? And I think, obviously, it will affect the historical structure. But Alex's analysis has broken (it) down that while this is a historical structure under state law, it does not have the historical integrity of the Secretary of (the) Interior's Standards. So there is no historical integrity at this point in the eyes of the Department to preserve, but that is just our own analysis. This is the Kauai Historic Preservation Review Commission and, essentially, the applicant is here to see if you and your position with the (Kaua`i) Historic Preservation Review Commission agree with the Department's assessment, or disagree. And you have the ability and authority to disagree and find that there is significance or there are mitigating factors here, but that ultimately is what the review boils down to. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Commissioners? Ms. Summers: Having reviewed everything and been in the restaurant (business), I would agree with the Planning Department's assessment. And am happy to hear that you do plan to reestablish something in the location because the fear that I have is this kind of an empty tooth thing happening, you know. Mr. Alan Satta: Right, right. Ms. Summers: Building comes down and nothing else comes up. Mr. Satta: Yes. Ms. Summers: But that has nothing to do with the demolition permit, its just... Chair Pro Tern Schneider: So do we have — Ms. Summers: Thank you. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: —a motion in support of the demolition permit? Ms. Summers: I'll motion in support of it. Ms. Arinaga: I'll second that. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: All in favor? Mr. Hull: So then you definitely have to ask if there's any further discussion. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Any further discussion? (Hearing none) September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 5 of 24 Mr. Hull: And then also too, Chair, I think we also didn't check if there was any members of the public that hadn't... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Is there anyone from the public that would like to speak on this application? Seeing no one. Okay, any discussion? (Hearing none) All in favor? (Unanimous voice vote) Is anybody opposed? (Hearing none) Motion carried 6:0. Mr. Hull: The motion passes, Madame Chair. Mr. Satta: Thank you very much. I appreciate it. 2. Kaua`i Museum TMK (4) 3-6-005:005 4428 Rice Street, Lihu`e, Hawaii 96766 Proposed construction of a new bronze statue of King Kaumuali`i and Queen Deborah Kapule. a. Director's Report pertaining to this matter. Mr. Hull: And Alex, I think in the interest of time, because we have a lot of members of the public, if you can somewhat summarize the points, as well as ... we don't necessarily have to go over the Secretary of (the) Interior's Standards (and Guidelines), but maybe the bullet points of what we found to be in keeping or not in keeping. Mr. Wong: Alex Wong, for the record. Mr. Wong read portions of the Director's Report dated September 20, 2018, for the record. (Document on file) Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Thank you, Alex. Mr. Hull: So if I could say, somewhat in a nutshell, that, as Alex pointed out, there's no need to necessarily go over the Secretary of (the) Interior's Standards (and Guidelines) on it because it meets the Secretary of (the) Interior's Standards (and Guidelines). It's on both the State (Historic) and National Register, so we're not going to delve into whether or not it is a historically significant site (because) it is a significant site, (and) we're accepting that. Now, our departmental analysis of it as to whether or not the proposal is negatively impacting the historical significance, there's various levels that you look at as whether or not the new proposed structure has a massing impact, whether it has a silhouetting impact, whether it is in an architectural characteristic that is somewhat going to deter or detract from the historical significance of the structure. And our analysis and finding is essentially that in looking at all those, there is no massing effect considering the size of the statue, there is no silhouetting that could negatively impact, and the proposed design of the statue, in our analysis, will not detract or deter from the integrity of the site or structure, which is why we're ultimately recommending September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 6 of 24 support for the proposal. But before we go into the applicant's presentation or responses, I just want to see if there were any questions that the Commission had for the staff of the Department at this time. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Has it been cast already? Mr. Hull: Did you have anything for Alex — after giving that report? Chair Pro Tem Schneider: And the applicants. Ms. Maryanne Kusaka: Aloha. Okay, thank you, mahalo. That's about all I know. I know a little bit more. Madame Vice Chair and members of this Honorable Commission, good afternoon and thank you for having us here and for considering our application to do this project. As many of you know, especially if you've been to the museum of late, our museum is moving along with leaps and bounds. And just a short six, seven years ago, we had considered closing part of the week because we just couldn't afford to keep it open. I am so ... I am Maryanne Kusaka. I am the President of the Board of Trustees and I am so proud to say that we have found grants and big support in the community, and community members, and even those outside of the community to help us contribute to programs we have been doing that are, of course, all historical in nature. And what we have tried to do ... Chucky has come on board a year and nine months ago to the museum. We have moved right ahead because Chucky's a very visionary person. What we want to do now is to ... we always have focused on Kauai and Niihau history and now in the main gallery, we are totally focusing on King Kaumuali`i. I invite you to come and see our beautiful cape. The designer of the exhibit space is sitting here today and he will help us work on the statue pro bono. So we are already raising funds for the grant that will support this effort and I'll like to introduce to you our Executive Director Chucky Boy Chock. And he will hopefully introduce the members of the community that have come to support this effort and also our artisan. Mr. Chucky Boy Chock: Aloha mai kakou. A pau Chucky Boy keia a luna o hale Hawaii keiki a Kauai a me Niihau, aloha. It is a great honor to be here. It is with great privilege that we represent Kauai Museum, as we are called to tell the story of Kauai and Niihau as Aunty said. I think our main objective is to educate our keiki here first before we move beyond and further beyond, and I think it's working. We've been sending out historians to the schools and my last count — we just reached 4,000 kids since last year, not counting the schools and summer programs that come to the museum; that's just the outreach. Our goal is to reach 9,000 kids and it's going to be their kuleana to teach their parents, and their aunts, and tutu, you know. So now days, what takes place now ... when they first came last summer, we asked, "who's the last King of Kauai and Niihau?" and they said, "Kamehameha." And now you ask them and they'll say, "Kaumuali`i." So it's working, and we're grateful for our teachers here and even our charter schools. It is beautiful to have our charter schools come to the museum because it gives our visitors that Hawaiian experience. They get to witness that; to see the kids do the protocols of Oli Kahea, permission to come in, as we Oli Komo, and welcome them. So the visitors are a part of this and it's like, they're always asking, "what is this?" and they go, "it's so beautiful." But to September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 7 of 24 see the kids, that is important. Within the last three months, now the kids come as young as preschool to see what we have. They don't understand, but they get to see what our Ali`i wore or what everyday life on Kauai and Niihau (was like); just to see. And so at one time we were only reaching the third and fourth graders and up. Now it's right down to our preschoolers and it's been working and we're grateful. Thank you for this time, allowing us to be here. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: I was looking, myself, to have a one-man show at the museum in 2005, so I really appreciate the museum. Mr. Chock: Okay, we (will) talk about the statue really quick (and) put it in a nutshell. To find out who (King) Kaumuali`i (was) or what did he look like, there was a challenge. So we went with an expert in that field and we called Honolulu and he was a graphic artist for the Honolulu Police Department for over 30 years, prior to the computer or the techy age. So he was the guy ... you gave him a bone and he would tell you what the arm looked like or the skull, he would tell you what the face looks like; that's what he did. So we called him for advice; how do we get (King) Kaumuali`i... a depiction of him? So this is a depiction of what we ... this is what he said, "Chucky, you have to cross-reference all the stories from (David) Malo, from (Samuel Manaiakalani) Kamakau, and even Jolsten, and just cross-reference; go back and forth and you'll come up with what they describe him to look like." Then he said, "Look at his children," and a description was very fair and more romanus-like, not so Hawaiian with an `upepe nose, that big brown face, you know, that typical Hawaiian; was more slightly different from the normal Hawaiian look. And so he said, "Look at his children, who has that look?" And then so we have renditions of the children, of the two sons. The eldest is (George "Prince" Kaumuali`i) Humehume and the second is Keali`iahonui. Keali`iahonui is the one that looks very Hawaiian, whereas Humehume has a more sharp face, and so we went with that. So the graphic artist, Joe (Aragon), did a rendition and we had our artist here do a rendition and we came together. This took a while to come to the conclusion. So we used his eldest son to get what we believe he may have looked like; that's how we got the face. Now, the important part of this statue, this bronze statue, is we get to use this to educate our kids. Now we're not saying this is what he looked like; we're saying this is a depiction. It parallels Kamakahelei, his mama. Her statue is in front of (Chiefess) Kamakahelei (Middle) School (and) that was a depiction, but they get to tell the story (of) who was this woman? Who was this lady and how great and wonderful she was; that's (King) Kaumuali`i's mama. We're doing the same thing; it's a depiction of him and his favorite wife, Kekaiha`akulou. And for those of you who don't know, that's her birth name. When she became a Christian, she took on the name Kapule and is otherwise known as (Queen) Deborah Kapule. And that was his favorite wife, so that's why we chose her. And I don't know what else to say. Okay, now real quick. I am just helping (to) see this through because the visionary of this project is from Anahola. And I am just going say "Aloha" to Uncle Billy Lemn over here — Billy and his wife, Aunty Luella. They came to the museum one day and said, "We'd like to do a statue at the County building." And then fast forward a week later or two weeks later, he said, "Oh, my daughter said we should go to the museum because they're telling the story." That's when they came to see us and it makes sense because we're already telling that story to our kids and beyond. And it's just the frosting on the cake; that's what it is. So what the statue will do September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 8 of 24 (is) it's going to create patter, its going to be recognized beyond, but most of all, its educational and that is the key component. Okay, so we got the artist, who we thank the lord because he fell into the museum. Anyway, so ... and his name is (Mr.) Chris O'Connor and we've been sharing his resume to people because it's on video. He's done ... okay if you've ever went to (Las) Vegas and if you ever went and saw that big ... hey what's that name of the statue, the one that moves? Caesar's Palace. If you've ever seen Caesar, that's his creation, amongst other things. He's done dinosaurs and stuff like that, but he's here for good. He's here to live for the rest of his life, so it's a great partnership. He is the guy that's creating the bronze (statue). Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Any questions for the applicant? Mr. Chucky Boy Chock: Did I talk too much? You can throw tomatoes, you know. Ms. Wichman: Thank you very much, Chucky Boy and Mayor Kusaka. I really appreciate what you're doing, especially with the educational component. I know there are other statues being built, so I think it's going to be a nice compliment (to) what you've been doing, going into the schools ahead of time and just asking the kids "Who is Kaumuali`i?" And I've been working with kids a long time and when you ask, "Who's Kaumuali`i?" they're going, "What do you mean `who'?" you know, "It's a highway," you know. Mr. Chucky Boy Chock: Very true. Ms. Wichman: Yes, or the fort, Pd'ula`ula. Mr. Chock: `Ae. Ms. Wichman: What they call the Russian Fort. When I had kids there, they would say, or I would ask them (to) tell me about Kaumuali`i, tell me about this place. "Oh, no it's just a place to party and go bathroom, right." Mr. Chock: You're right. Ms. Wichman: And you know I had to tell them, no, this is (King) Kaumuali`i's place, and they're like, "Well we don't know who he is." Didn't you learn it in school (at) Waimea High? "No." So I explained who they were and who he was and I believe that fort, it's actually a super Heiau. It's actually a Heiau. Mr. Chock: `Ae. Ms. Wichman: The Russians... anyway that's another story, but I really appreciate what you're doing. I think this is really, really — Mr. Chock: Thank you. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 9 of 24 Ms. Wichman: —admirable. Mr. Chock: Thank you. Ms. Wichman: Thank you for promoting the story of (King) Kaumuali`i. Mr. Chock: Thank you very much. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Any questions? Can we have a motion in support of this application? Mr. Hull: I am going to interject real quickly here. Before we go into the motion and further discussion, I advise that you ask if there's any member of the public that has any testimony. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Is there anyone from the public that would like to speak on this application? Mr. Hull: Aunty Maryanne and Chucky Boy, if you guys could take a seat while the members testify. Ms. Kealoha Takahashi: My name is Kealoha Takahashi. I am from the west side, born and raised in Kekaha. I graduated from Waimea High School. I felt it really important for me to ask for your support. I grew up, like you mentioned, not knowing much about King Kaumuali`i and I think that's a really sad, sad, sad, sad story. The only thing that I grew up remembering was King Kamehameha. I went to Kekaha School and the only course that I took of the Ali`i was in sixth grade and, even at that time, nothing was mentioned about King Kaumuali`i. So can you imagine growing up all these years (knowing only) about King Kamehameha until finally, a couple of years ago, I realized that Kauai had a King Kaumuali`i. And I think that's really important, not only for us as adults — I am a kupuna now — but we need to have reminders about King Kaumuali`i and who he was, and what he did for our `aina, and the sacrifices that he made for us. So it's pretty important that our children know who he is so they not like me, a dummy, not knowing that we had an awesome king who ruled Kauai. So I ask for your support on this endeavor, and thank you. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Thank you. Is there anybody else from the public that would like to speak? Ms. Luella Hasegawa Lemn: Aloha, to all of you and thank you for considering our proposal. And I just wanted to say that for years my husband would pass the County building and there was nothing Hawaiian and he would always say things to me. Then finally one day, very late in our marriage life, I said to him, "I am tired of hearing this. Why don't you do something?" And so he scribbled. You know, he loves to doodle and draw. So he drew this sketch and then his vision was this was going to go on the county lawn. And after family discussion, it came to the point where, you know, my daughter decided, you know, she didn't want just a statue and neither did I. I wanted someplace that this statue would mean something, that you would have an opportunity to tell a story and what better place than the (Kaua`i) Museum because they have a staff. It's not like it's going to be sitting out there where people pass and not know what is this September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 10 of 24 statue? You know, but they would go in (to the Museum) and there would be people to tell the story of this great king and also always that (King) Kaumuali`i was never conquered, you know, in the regular way that (King) Kamehameha conquered the other islands. So for me, I always see this opportunity that the (Kaua`i) Museum has offered to take on this project and I know that it will be here forever, for generations to come. The thing about it is, you know, I am not from Kauai, you know; I come from another island. So my attachment to (King) Kaumuali`i was not as great as my husband, and the fact that I went to Kamehameha (Schools), (King) Kamehameha meant a lot to me as a ruler, and he didn't have the same feeling. So for him to want to do something that people would know that this island was special, and he always would say that to me; that Kauai is special, you know, it's not just another island. You know there was something significant. And you know that we found in our quest to get people to support us that that was one of the things they said, that people would ask you know about our island. And one of the things that they would always mention is that Kauai was an island that had a king who loved his people so much that he was willing, you know, to let (King) Kamehameha rule this island so that his people would not perish. And I think that this (is a) story that we have to share with other people, especially in today's climate as to all of the activisms that we see going on, I think that one of the things we need to try to promote is not only for our children and for generations to come, but people who come to visit our island, you know. It isn't just this lush green island; there's a history, a beautiful story to tell about the people who live here. And I think if they have (an) understanding of our culture and how we are as a people, perhaps they would not take us for granted because we are part of the United States, you know. It has to do with Hawaiian values, you know — Ha'aha'a. When you're prideful, you have humility, and sometimes, you know, we're not very happy with how our people may react, but perhaps if we understood how they came to this point, then maybe we would be more tolerant, you know, of each other. But mahalo for listening to us. Thank you. Commission Support Clerk Sandra Muragin: Can you please state your name for the record? Ms. Lemn: My name is Luella Hasegawa Lemn and even though I have a Japanese name, my mother is full Hawaiian, so I am half Hawaiian and half Japanese. Thank you. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Is there anybody else who would like to speak on this? (Seeing none) Commissioners, do we have a motion? Ms. Arinaga: I will. Based on the recommendations and testimonies, I would like to move that we, the Commission, support the proposed construction of the bronze statue, provided that they meet whatever is necessary. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Do we have a second? Mr. Chaffin: Second. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Any discussion? (Hearing none) All in favor? (Unanimous voice vote) Anybody opposed? (Hearing none) Motion carried 6:0. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 11 of 24 Mr. Hull: Motion passes, Madame Chair. 3. 3 Palms, LLC (Douglas Baldwin Beach House) TMK (4) 5-5-002:107 5242 Weke Road, Hanalei, Hawaii 96714 Proposed conversion of an existing historic dwelling unit into an accessory structure, addition of new decking, and removal of the existing kitchen facilities. Proposed demolition of existing garage associated with existing historic residence. (SMA permit?) a. Director's Report pertaining to this matter. Mr. Wong: Aloha, Alex Wong for the record. In the interest of time, I will also encapsulate this review the Director's Report. Mr. Wong read portions of the Director's Report dated September 20, 2018, for the record. (Document on file) Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I see the applicant is here. Ian? (Inaudible) Mr. Ian Jung: Ian Jung and Marc Ventura, the architect of record on behalf of 3 Palms, LLC. Good afternoon, Chairwoman Schneider and members of the Commission. So just by way of project background, I think we're in a unique situation here where we're trying to materialize a preservationist type effort but also allowing for a new use on the subject property. So in my task of trying to find an entitlement path to get here, one of the things I started researching is how we can look at adaptive reuse for this property. The property is on the Registry, the State (Historic) Registry. So in our approach we have to figure out a way to deal with the existing structures that were noted in the registration. So on coming up with a path ... you know I remember as I used to sit and advise this Commission years ago, how can we do this? And one of the interesting briefs I found was through the Historic Hawaii Foundation where they kind of focused on how we can use adaptive reuse to still keep and maintain a historic structure from an architectural visual standpoint, but allow the use to change and be adaptive to a new use so my client can be able to materialize a new residence on this structure. And just to put a little context into why we're going down this path is this particular property is in what we call the Open District, from a zoning standpoint. And because it's only an acre and a quarter, we can only get one dwelling unit allocated to this particular property. So in going forward, we thought well, what can we do to try and maintain the historic character of this structure as the (Douglas Baldwin) Beach House and we came up with the idea of going and doing a conversion to an accessory structure (and) use it as sort of this creative space, but still maintaining the historic characters of the structure. So if you look, and Mark will touch on this, but if you look at the structure now as it exists - and that's the pane, the bottom left pane that's on the board there. There were what is recounted in the Historic American Buildings Survey (HABS) report we prepared for this, as well as the Historic Registration documents, there was two big remodels that occurred; one in what is perceived as 1935, and then one in the `60's. Unfortunately, we went to the Kauai Historical Society and so did our consultant Glenn September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 12 of 24 Mason Architects trying to figure out if there was any pictures from years past in the early `20's and `30's when the structure was in its heyday, but we couldn't find any photo so we only have modern pictures of what exists today. What you see there at the bottom, there's some decking there that is actually Trex® deck which is this modern composite material, it's not actually wood. There with this little, what you would call a gazebo type, one eye over deck. So when we tried to figure out how we could do this because of our constraint for land coverage, we thought well, we would remove the deck, (since) that was an altered feature to the historic structure and take that away. (That would) create a new more plantation style - which is of the time and place when the structure was originally built - to create a new deck entry to it. So our approach to try and deal with this is creating what's on the right down there which is bringing it back to its original... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: So that's not the new structure? That's the renovated... Mr. Jung: That's the proposed renovated structure. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Do we have any pictures of the new structure? Mr. Jung: Of the main residence? Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Yes. Mr. Jung: The main residence - if you look on the top pane, left hand side - that's going to be the actual new residence that's going to be up there, set back behind the... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: But that's just the plot plan. Mr. Jung: That's just the plot plan. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: We don't have a drawing. Mr. Jung: No, we don't have a drawing with it but we can certainly have it provided. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Yes, before the Commission takes any action on this I really would like to see... Mr. Jung: Okay. Let me see if I got one in my file. Ms. Summers: Is that relevant to making a determination on this particular... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Sure, if the new structure is not compatible with the existing structure that's on the (State Historic) Register, because the site is on the (State Historic) Register. Ms. Summers: Okay. Sorry, the site... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: The site is on the (State Historic) Register. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 13 of 24 Mr. Jung: I do have the exhibit in my packet, which I'll pass around. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Is that the new house or... Mr. Jung: That is the new residence that will be going up onto the property. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Is there a reason why it wasn't included? Mr. Jung: When we evaluate how we're going to approach this and the context of how we're going to go with (the) State Historic Preservation Division (SHPD), we actually have conditions we've proposed to negotiate with SHPD in terms of trying to create the likeness of the old structure. But our focus was more on trying to rehab or rehabilitate the existing historic structure that's in the quote, unquote, "curtilage" of the... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Right. The new structure needs to be evaluated in conjunction, as far as this Commission is concerned. Mr. Jung: Okay. What? That's news to me. You know I've sat on the Commission in the past where new structures were evaluated on their own, because they're new. But how we're going to rehabilitate or restore or potentially demo old structures, the focus was on the actual structure... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Right. Mr. Jung: On the Registry. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: But the site is on the (State Historic) Register as well. So... Ms. Summers: But if the site is on the Registry then it's the site. That doesn't mean its dictating the new architecture has to look historic. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: No, it doesn't have to but it has to be compatible. We'd like to see it before we give an okay. Ms. Summers: Okay. And compatible is subjective to each one of us. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: In relation, the roofing... Mr. Jung: I can tell the Commission right now that it's not compatible with the more ... from a plantation style standpoint because it is a new structure, although the property is on the Registry. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Right and... Mr. Jung: It's the structures that were the focus of the nomination. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Do you think it would still be on the (State Historic) Register if you put the new building on it? September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 14 of 24 Mr. Jung: It would be, yes, because it's the structure that's within there that we're trying to rehabilitate. That is the focus of the Registration. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: You don't think putting a brand new mansion on it would change the way the site looks? Mr. Jung: I don't think it'll change because it's not the landscape. I think if you looked at a designation of a historic place where there's a landscape component, then that's one thing. But here, the focus of the nomination was Criteria C., which the architecture at the time was... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Vernacular architecture... Mr. Jung: Vernacular, which is your standard. And just for a little more context, if you're familiar with some of the other houses that are on the Registry out in Hanalei, you have the Faye residence, the Sanborn residence, and the Wilcox residence, which they're all ... this is relatively modest compared to those residences with their two story, very beautiful elaborate craftsman style, plantation style homes. So this one was more of a Vernacular approach from an architecture standpoint, with its use as one of like the first vacation type rentals out in Hanalei for... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I am very familiar. My store is in Hanalei. I've lived in Hanalei 30 years ago, so I am familiar with the site. Mr. Jung: Okay. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Commissioners, any questions? Have we done any archeology? Mr. Jung: Well that's going to be the next step when we go through — this is the first step as we go through navigating the process. We have to allow — because it's a single residence, you know, we have to allow for the conversion first to be able to go and fill it. And once we go through the Class II Permit process we've specifically conditioned our Class, I am sorry our Class I Zoning Permit to say we got to meet the SHPD requirements, because we're going in for the Class I first to allow for the conversion, followed by the Building Permit approval which, during the course of the Class I Zoning Permit condition prior to Building Permit approval, we have to get SHPD concurrence to it and then we'll jump into doing archaeology. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: And is there a current shoreline setback? Mr. Jung: There's a current shoreline certification that was done. So we had that done and that was approved, I think in December, sorry January, which than we had our shoreline setback application just get approved and notified to the Commission on the last commission meeting. Ms. Summers: And Alex (Wong) referenced that in his... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I saw that, but I would wonder if that changed since the flood in April. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 15 of 24 Mr. Jung: Yes, no, the flood was a mauka event so it doesn't — storms are excluded from the certified shoreline process. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Just knowing what happened in Hanalei. Mr. Jung: Yes. Just to answer that question if you - and I can show a pane to show that, but in this area the flood zone actually is right outside. And if you look closely on the map, it's noted about a 100 feet before where the new structure is sited on the flood plain. So it's actually not in the flood district and that property did not flood during the historic rain ' 18 event. Mr. Hull: I'll just interject a little bit. I think you know where I am coming from Chair, is we can guide the discussion. I don't think that the shoreline setback issues are not relevant or germane to the issue at hand, but if you can guide the discussion on how the shoreline setback may be particularly germane to historic aspects of it. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Yes, I just was concerned having been flooded out in Hanalei. Ms. Summers: Well, I just would like to say that I appreciate the efforts to bring the structure back to a more or less elaborate or ... I don't know, I was not very fond of that Trex® deck and that would be what we see from the street, right? We're going to be seeing this building, not the new structure. So when we're on ... when the public is passing by, they're going to see something that is historic. Mr. Jung: That's correct. Yes, the historic structure is along Weki Road, right there. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: But the new structure would be certainly visible from the beach. Mr. Jung: We have ... where if you look on the plan set, we're actually using some existing landscape to mitigate the impact, the visual impact of the structure, not just looking from the beach but also back from the roadway, as well. Ms. Summers: And what is it, over 200 feet from the property line? The beach front property line? Mr. Jung: The shoreline setback is at a 100 foot, but the property is in or the proposed structure is pushed further back another... Ms. Summers: With landscaping between. Mr. Jung: Right. And if you — one of things, you know I've studied this out in Hanalei, and one of the cool things I thought, I think from a historic standpoint, is when they designed a lot of these larger lots, there was no shoreline setback back then when they started building a lot of these residences, particularly with the Faye residence, (and) Sanborn residence. But they allowed for this great front yard with this nice grass expanse before you get to the beach, which I think was telling of the time, not just from coastal hazard standpoint, but also from a visual September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 16 of 24 standpoint where you have this nice lawn in front you, versus pushing the structure right up onto the front... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Up to the beach, yes. Mr. Jung: So in keeping with that approach, if you look on the site plan you can kind of see how it's in line with that existing residence on the adjacent lot. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I just have concerns. Mr. Jung: Sure. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Commissioners? Ms. Nakea: Yes, I appreciate the design of the restoration and getting that gazebo thing and the false wood, and I don't think that... Mr. Hull: Sorry Commissioner the... Ms. Nakea: Oh okay. Yes, I appreciate the new design and the removing of the gazebo, and the false wood deck. I also think that that picture is a structure that is not ostentatious at all in anyway and it looks attractive, and it doesn't seem to have too much contrast to the historic structure that we're looking at. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: That's the... Ms. Nakea: No, yes, but the picture that went around. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Passed around. Ms. Nakea: Yes. That's the one I am referring to. So I have no problems with these plans. Mr. Jung: Is there a microphone that Mark can use up top there? Mr. Marc Ventura: Good afternoon. My name is Marc Ventura. I am an architect on Kauai (and) fourth generation Kauai resident from Wailua. (I have) been practicing architecture on Kauai since about 1995, I think. And I'd like to say thank you to Chair Schneider and the Commission for letting us come and present this today. Wait, hold on, oh okay, never mind. I'll go over this briefly and I'll just sort of give an overview of the parcel, the lots here. The existing — here's Weke Road, there's the property frontage. So our setback, our 100 foot shoreline, is right here. This is a reflection of the certified shoreline that we recently got approved that Ian had mentioned. So that's about 100 feet. We're probably — the front of the new proposed structure is about 250 feet off of the vegetation and property line. And it does align — I apologize for the imagery because it's pretty light, the print, it's the best we could do on island. So, this is the adjacent property, so you know, Ian mentioned the line, so that's a fairly substantial setback for the newly proposed structure. The existing historic structure sits right here, back on Weke September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 17 of 24 Road. So that is what you will see back there. This image here shows a blow up of the existing structure. Again, it's hard to see, but very lightly here shows the interior layout of the existing structure and the proposed new structure. As was mentioned, I am going to jump down to this image here, that's the existing building. And what we're trying to do is really kind of bring this structure, anyway, back as Ian had discussed, into kind of what I think the intent of the original certified plantation design was. This is an aluminum and I think kind of a clear plexiglass gazebo, the Treks® deck and the lanais. The renovations — the original structure was built in the `20's, there was a 1935 substantial renovation where they enclosed a lanai here. The other substantial improvement was done in the `60's. Although over the years there were, apparently there were some other smaller additions that happened. So what we're — as we looked at this, I think the big overview is on the inside is to create basically a large space. There's a bathroom, existing bathroom structure that we're maintaining and then we're really just going to open up the space. But again, the exterior, we're going to try to bring back what was there. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Marc, do we have a picture of that guest house? Mr. Ventura: Well, this is a picture, a view of the exterior here so... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: No, but you have a guest house that you're showing on the plot plan. Mr. Ventura: No, that's a new guest house structure. I don't know if that's in the ... I don't know if that's in the package that Ian sent around... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: No, we... Mr. Ventura: But I don't think we do have that. Anyway, that's a 500 square foot guest house along the lines of the — from a design standpoint - of the new proposed main residence there. So I think, really, the intent for us bringing this back I think we're going to do some reroof, we want to match the corrugated roofing. The windows — the window fenestration although you can't see it all because there's a gate here, but we're basically leaving what's there now. And it appears that these are all the original windows, window frames, I think from the original construction of the `20's. The fenestration over here at this deck area was done later and it differs. So all of it, you know there's kind of a variety of things happening there. There's a slider here now that came in the `60's renovation from what I gather from the reports, so they did open up a sliding window and probably modified the sill condition here, so that was new. When the deck comes off, those windows will probably just be replaced. But again our intent is to match the fenestration and the trim around these windows and replace the windows and then repaint the building. And I think just to touch back on the new design, you know it was really, it's more of a kind of minimalist, I think, interpretation. It's about 2,500 square foot, the foot print. We're fairly limited because of the lot — the Open Zoning requirements. So it's not really a huge house, it's 20 feet to the top of the second story which is really, really low because the roof is flat. But, the intent is really to have it open with glass. It almost won't — I mean the idea was just to kind of let it, kind of... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: So we have this photo rendering, no drawings. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 18 of 24 Ms. Nakea: Is it this one right here? Mr. Ventura: That is this building from the entry side. Ms. Nakea: Oh, okay. Mr. Ventura: It was on the cover that he passed around. But it's almost 20 feet high to the top, so it's really a low lying structure. It's glass, it's linear, but it's mostly glass, actually, so it's transparent (and) that was kind of the idea of it, to be contemporary. And the color scheme, kind of coming along this, but I do think it'll blend in kind of a contemporary sort of way and it being set back with the palms. And if you look again at that initial image, I really don't — I really don't think that it would be that noticeable from the ocean. I mean I think if you stop and look, you'll see it, but I think you're going to really sense more of the lawn and the landscaping around it. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I have some concerns. I would love to have the full Commission and possibly defer this until we have the full Commission to review it, if possible. Mr. Hull: I think yes, that's up to the Commission. Ms. Summers: I feel that we're introducing elements that are not germane to the topic. Concerns that are not germane to the approval of this particular application. Mr. Hull: It's... Ms. Summers: Because I would move to approve it as it is. Mr. Hull: Yes, I think there is argument for both sides quite honestly if I could take my department hat and put it on. I believe that there is argument for the proposal that Mr. Jung stated, that given that it's based on Criteria C. in its architectural elements, that there is a position to be stated that regardless of where your site of your new structure, it's not going to impact the architectural features. Which I think would be to your point Commissioner Summers. But to also the Chair's point, there are some in historic preservation that would look and also say that while it is Criteria C., the citing of a structure next to a historically recognized structure may impact it, and I think the Department is supportive of what the proposal is, but I can also see to where Commissioner Schneider is going and saying that, "I can't physically see"... seems like you would like to see a photo rendering of some things like the guest house... Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Yes, and I'd like to see the full Commission, Gerald and Jim, also have some considerations. Ms. Summers: Is that putting a monetary onus on the owner to provide that kind of rendering? Mr. Hull: It is, and ultimately the analysis the Department generally goes for and speaks to is if there are some Commissioners that don't feel they have enough information for them to provide a valid analysis of it ... from not having what you as a Commissioner may discern as adequate information, would you therefore vote in the affirmative or in the negative. And it's essentially September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 19 of 24 up to you on how you as a Commissioner may vote absent that information. So ultimately, if there's a Commissioner saying, "I don't have adequate enough information, I'd like this deferred for the applicants to be able to provide me that information," it's ultimately the applicant's prerogative on whether or not they want to provide that information. The Department has deemed this application acceptable and it's here before this body, but at the end of the day you each sit in your roles of review and your position to take a vote, and as that vote is best obtained from your own analysis and review of the project. So... Mr. Jung: And just if I could chime in here, Chairwoman. You know one of the things - we do have sort of this long road ahead of us where we're staggered on an entitlement path. And one of the things is we're going to have to go through SHPD anyways as we go through this process. So the applicant's preference is to, you know, move this through this body if the body is adequate with what our approach is, to try and ... rather than just demo the structure, come up with an adaptive reuse approach to maintain and rehabilitate this structure. So the applicant would prefer to get some kind of approval today, if possible, so we can move on to the next step as we have various steps to go forward. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Personally, I have no problem with the existing structure and the adaptive. I have problems relating to the new structure, I just don't see it at the moment. But if the other Commissioners want to make a motion that's... Ms. Summers: Well, I would make a motion to approve as presented based on the fact that the new is not in front of the older building. It will be separated by over 100 feet with vegetation in between and that it will be very minimally viewable from the beach as well because of the vegetation and height of the new building and distance from the beach. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Is there a second? Ms. Nakea: I second it. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Any discussion? Ms. Wichman: I just have a little concern because if this is on the National Register then... Mr. Hull: Just a quick correction... it sits on the State, but not the National. Ms. Wichman: The State but not the National. Mr. Hull: Yes. Ms. Wichman: I don't know if I would call this a rehabilitation. What you're doing, it looks to me as a total restoration. A total knock down, rebuild, yes. Mr. Jung: We're actually not knocking down anything. We're removing the Treks® decking which was an unhistoric alteration and then trying to rehabilitate it to what it was in the past. So September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 20 of 24 the remaining... the framing, the siding, everything will remain. But it will be reroofed just to get the roof back up to the par, but the reroofing will match like materials that was in the past. Ms. Wichman: So if someone were to look at this today would it be able to, would it qualify still to be on the State (Historic) Register with all the modifications? Mr. Jung: My opinion would be yes, because it maintains the historic quality of what it was when it was launched. It was launched on to the (State Historic) Register under this appearance on the left hand side in 1987, but if we rehabilitate it to what it was when it was built in the 1920's, then it actually furthers the project back to what it originally was, which actually bolsters more of the architecture of its time and place. Not necessarily use, because the use is converting but of the time and place, it's that Vernacular type of architecture from a plantation style beach house cabin kind of look. Ms. Wichman: Thank you. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Is there anyone else? Ms. Summers: Well, I would much rather look at the house on the right than the one on the left as I'm going down Weke Road. So I applaud that. Deputy County Attorney Mark Ishmael: You have a motion, second, than a discussion. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Do you want to vote on it? All in favor? Ms. Arinaga: Is there a second? Ms. Nakea: I seconded. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I am nay. I am opposed. Mr. Chaffin: No, I am opposed to it. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Does it pass or what? Mr. Wong: Ka`aina would usually do a roll call vote on this one. Deputy County Attorney Mark Ishmael: Okay, let's do a roll call. Okay we'll take a roll call vote. Althea Arinaga. Ms. Arinaga: For. Mr. Ishmael: Lawrence Chaffin. Mr. Chaffin: Negative. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 21 of 24 Mr. Ishmael: Deatri Nakea. Ms. Nakea: Aye. Mr. Ishmael: Anne Schneider. Chair Pro Tem. Schneider: Nay. Mr. Ishmael: Victoria Wichman. Ms. Wichman: Aye. Mr. Ishmael: Aubrey Summers. Ms. Summers: Aye. Mr. Ishmael: Four Aye's and two Nay's. I believe that passes, made quorum. Mr. Jung: Okay, thank you Commissioners. Just to interrupt, I think I delivered my exhibit packet around, not sure who has it? Mr. Ishmael: There were six votes. Takes five members to do any action. Okay so the motion fails. Mr. Jung: Oh, is it a nine member commission? So just ... I'll give you my sense on what I would advise if the motion fails, than there can be another motion for another action if the Commission wants to take action on. Chair Pro Tem. Schneider: Could we have a motion to defer action to the next meeting to represent? Mr. Jung: You have to ask your Counsel on that. Mr. Ishmael: I know you have to have a second. You can raise the motion again, but it has to be a different session, so there's really no need to create a motion to take it to another session; you can't. Once a motion has been voted on, it can't be raised again in the same session. Mr. Jung: So by default it defers? Chair Pro Tem Schneider: It kind of went out the door. So we'll be... Mr. Ishmael: I would look up if it defers automatically. But it could be placed back on the agenda by year end. Chair Pro Tem. Schneider: I am sorry. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 22 of 24 Mr. Ishmael: So you're on to (Agenda) Item J. COMMISSION EDUCATION COMMITTEE Chair Pro Tern Schneider: I don't think we have any reports from them. KAUA'I HISTORIC RESOURCE INVENTORY UPDATE COMMITTEE No updates. HISTORIC PRESERVATION PUBLICITY COMMITTEE No updates. HANAPEPE BRIDGE REPLACEMENT PROJECT COMMITTEE No updates. UNFINISHED BUSINESS 1. Discussion on the status of the Certified Local Government. Chair Pro Tern Schneider: Certified Local Government but Ka`aina has disappeared. Thank you Ian. SELECTION OF NEXT MEETING DATE AND AGENDA TOPICS (October 18, 2018) ADJOURNMENT Chair Pro Tern Schneider: I guess we can adjourn ... since Ka`aina never came back. Ms. Wichman: I am confused about our whole last — I guess we're not supposed to talk. Ms. Arinaga: I thought we're supposed to be (inaudible). We have nothing to discuss? Chair Pro Tern Schneider: The Certified Local Government, but Ka`aina went away. Mr. Ishmael: Are there any other Agenda items? Chair Pro Tern Schneider: No. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 23 of 24 Mr. Ishmael: You have to move to adjourn. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: I move that we adjourn, 4:30 p.m. Ms. Wichman: I move to adjourn. Ms. Arinaga: Second. Mr. Ishmael: Okay second. Chair Pro Tem Schneider: Thank you. Chair Pro Tem Schneider adjourned the meeting at 4:25 p.m. Respectfully Submitted, Sandra M. Muragin Commission Support Clerk () Approved as circulated. () Approved with amendments. See minutes of meeting. September 20, 2018 KHPRC Meeting Minutes Page 24 of 24