HomeMy WebLinkAbout08/09/2017 Council minutes COUNCIL MEETING
AUGUST 9, 2017
The Council Meeting of the Council of the County of Kaua`i was called to order
by Council Chair Mel Rapozo at the Council Chambers, 4396 Rice Street, Suite 201,
Lihu`e, Kaua`i, on Wednesday, August 9, 2017 at 8:33 a.m., after which the following
Members answered the call of the roll:
Honorable Arthur Brun
Honorable Mason K. Chock
Honorable Ross Kagawa
Honorable Arryl Kaneshiro
Honorable Derek S.K. Kawakami
Honorable JoAnn A. Yukimura
Honorable Mel Rapozo
APPROVAL OF AGENDA.
Councilmember Yukimura moved for approval of the agenda as circulated,
seconded by Councilmember Chock, and unanimously carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: Motion carried. Next item, please.
MINUTES of the following meeting of the Council:
July 26, 2017 Public Hearing re: Bill No. 2658 and Bill No. 2659
Councilmember Chock moved to approve the Minutes as circulated, seconded
by Councilmember Yukimura.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve the Minutes as circulated was then put, and
unanimously carried.
COUNCIL MEETING 2 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Can we dispose of the Consent Calendar?
Then we will go into our first item.
CONSENT CALENDAR:
C 2017-173 Communication (06/21/2017) from the Mayor, transmitting for
Council consideration and confirmation, the following Mayoral appointees to the
Charter Review Commission:
• Virginia M. Kapali— Term ending 12/31/2018
• Galen T. Nakamura —Term ending 12/31/2018
C 2017-174 Communication (06/23/2017) from the Mayor, transmitting for
Council consideration and confirmation, Mayoral appointee Alfred Levinthol to the
Fire Commission — Partial Term ending 12/31/2017.
C 2017-175 Communication (07/20/2017) from the Director of Finance,
transmitting for Council information, the Period 12 Financial Reports — Detailed
Budget Report, Statement of Revenues (Estimated and Actual), Statement of
Expenditures and Encumbrances, and Revenue Report as of June 30, 2017, pursuant
to Section 21 of Ordinance No. B-2016-812, relating to the Operating Budget of the
County of Kaua`i for Fiscal Year 2016-2017.
C 2017-176 Communication (07/21/2017) from Councilmember Kawakami,
providing written disclosure of a possible conflict of interest and recusal regarding all
matters involving N.F. Kawakami Store, due to his familial and potential business
relationship with N.F. Kawakami Store.
Councilmember Kagawa moved to receive C 2017-173, C 2017-174, C 2017-175,
C 2017-176 for the record, seconded by Councilmember Yukimura.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve receive C 2017-173, C 2017-174, C 2017-175, C 2017-176
for the record was then put, and unanimously carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: With that, we will take our first item,
C 2017-177.
COUNCIL MEETING 3 AUGUST 9, 2017
There being no objections, C 2017-177 was taken out of order.
COMMUNICATIONS:
C 2017-177 Communication (07/13/2017) from the Mayor, requesting agenda
time for a briefing from Smith Dawson & Andrews, Inc., Washington, D.C.
consultants, to provide a recap of the services and activities they provided to the
County during the past year as part of their professional services contract.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you for being here. With that, I will
suspend the rules with no objection. Welcome back to Kaua`i.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
JIM SMITH, President of Smith Dawson & Andrews, Inc.: Aloha. Good
morning, Chairman and Members of the Council. It is a pleasure to be here today.
My name, for some of you who do not know, Councilmember Brun, who we have not
met before, I am Jim Smith, President and founder of Smith Dawson &Andrews, Inc.
We are a public affairs lobbying firm headquartered in Washington, D.C. I am joined
today by my colleague, the Managing Director of Smith Dawson & Andrews, Inc.,
Mary Cronin: First of all, let me just say that it is a real pleasure and honor to be
here today and it has been an honor to serve as the County's consultant in
Washington for the past five (5) years. Time flies. We think that it has been a very
productive five (5) years and we greatly value our relationship and our partnership
that we have built with the County and the collective successes that we have achieved
over the last five (5) years. We are very optimistic about the future. We think there
are a lot of good things in the pipeline, both here and in Washington, D.C. that will
match-up well for the County. We will be pursuing those in the months ahead.
I thought I would start off and just give an overview of where things stand in
D.C. today, both legislatively and with the budget. Mary will give you an update on
our activities and accomplishments over the last year and talk about a number of
grant opportunities that we will be pursuing with the County. My, how the year has
changed since we were here in August of 2016. Needless to say, there was quite a
shake-up in Washington as a result of the November election. A year ago today, we
were here talking about the former Administration's priorities, which were very
consistent and aligned well with the County's priorities. But that all changed in the
November election last fall, and with the inauguration of President Trump, we are
dealing with a much different administration than we have in the last two. The
President came into office in January and it was very much unclear and unknown
what his priorities were going to be, in terms of federal spending in federal programs,
but that quickly crystallized when he submitted his first budget to Congress in April
of this year. In April of this year, 2017, he presented a budget that frankly would
have been devastating to domestic discretionary programs and programs that were
COUNCIL MEETING 4 AUGUST 9, 2017
and are important to the County. The Administration's proposal would have
eliminated Community Development Block Grant (CDBG), it would have imposed
drastic cuts in Native Hawaiian programs, and eliminated the Transportation
Investment Generating Economic Recovery (TIGER) grant. Across the board, it was
just sort of cut/slash/burn. We organized and responded very quickly, working very
closely with the Hawai`i Congressional Delegation and put forward our thoughts and
positions on those programs and submitted a very comprehensive appropriations
request through the delegation. Fortunately, the Congress seemed to side with us
and really beat back most, all of those, proposals that the Administration had put
forward. So the bottom-line is that we finally got a budget for the current fiscal year,
which did start last October, but we did not get a budget until May of this year. For
the most part, all of those programs that we care so much about were protected and
even were fully-funded at the previous year's levels. So that is good. With that, now
we are starting to see a number of grant opportunities coming out of the federal
agencies that we have brought to the attention of the Office of the Mayor and to the
County departments and will be working with them to pursue some of these in the
months ahead.
The other thing I might just mention, too, speaking of the Trump
Administration and how things have changed is that the Trump Administration has
been slow to organize and to get their appointees in place, all across the
Administration, from one branch and agency to the next. I think that, and do not
hold me to this—I am just approximating—but I believe there are something like six
thousand five hundred (6,500) politically appointed positions at the power of the
President that require senate confirmation. To-date, I believe that there are only
about five hundred (500) of those positions full. The point is that we are dealing with
these vacancies all across the federal government. In a lot of agencies, other than the
cabinet's secretary, there is really just nobody at home. So that has had an effect, in
essence, freezing a lot of activity and decisions within the federal bureaucracy that
has held up a lot of programs and a lot of grant announcements. The Mayor, of course,
and the Chairman were in Washington in June and we had a number of meetings—
Mary will go through that in a little more detail—but a number of meetings with the
executive branch agencies and met with some of the new Trump appointees, where
they are in place. I think that was very productive. But you should know that there
are still a lot of empty offices around the federal government. Going forward, as I
mentioned, Congress did enact the Fiscal Year 2017 Budget, but here we are...it is
already almost the middle of August and the new Fiscal Year for 2018 starts
October 1st, the Congress has yet to enact an Fiscal Year 2018 budget resolution.
They have yet to enact any of the twelve (12) standing appropriations bills, which
provides funding for spending to the agencies for the new year, starting October 1st.
So there is still a certain amount of uncertainty going forward. Congress is currently
in recess. The House went out at the end of July; the Senate just recessed last week.
They will be back in session after Labor Day. Between Labor Day and October 1st,
the start of the new fiscal year, they have a lot of work to do. Of course, I mentioned
COUNCIL MEETING 5 AUGUST 9, 2017
that they have not done a budget resolution. They have not passed any of the
appropriations bills for Fiscal Year 2018. At the same time, the federal government
is running up against the federal debt ceiling, which I am sure you are all familiar
with, a statutory authority that allows the treasury to borrow to keep the government
operating and to pay our debts and obligations of the United States. That has always
been a very controversial measure in the past and it is certain to be again this year.
There are many members of congress particularly on the Republican side, and
especially among the Tea Party Caucus of the Republican Party in the Congress that
are adamantly opposed to increasing the debt ceiling. The net effect of not doing it is
that we default on our debt and obligations and the United States is not able to
borrow money to pay its bills. If that happens, you know just at your own
County-level what it is to be maintain a budget and to pay your debts. If you do not,
you are going to get a really negative credit rating, and that has happened to us once
before when Congress played around with this and was not responsible in doing it as
quickly as they should. The other effect of that is if you do not increase it, you do
default and you do get the negative rating, then when you go back to the markets,
you are just going to have pay that much more. The estimates more are going
forward, it could cost the federal treasury billions of dollars in additional federal
interest payments. So that is staring Congress right in the face when they come back
after Labor Day and there are only sixteen (16) legislative days between Labor Day
and October 1st. So to think that they could get a budget done and pass twelve (12)
appropriations bills at the same time they are dealing with the debt ceiling...and
incidentally, I should mention that one of the most adamant opponents of the debt
ceiling is a former member of Congress, Mick Mulvaney, who is now the Director of
the Office Management and Budget for the President. So it is going to be interesting
to see how that plays out. Of course, we have all of these other distractions, not to
mention the current crisis with North Korea and trade with China. There are a lot
of issues on the plate that Congress will be grappling with when they come back.
Just a couple more things, and then I will hand it over to Mary—going forward,
what do we see happening? Well, obviously, they have to deal with the debt,
spending, and the budget, and they will; it will not be pretty, but they will get there.
The President came into office with three (3) primary priorities: one was healthcare,
repeal and replace the Affordable Healthcare Act, and we all know what has
happened to that; the second is tax reform, which they continue to promote and
indicate that this will be the top priority for Congress after Labor Day; and the third
priority, of course, was infrastructure. To-date, there has been a lot of talk about
infrastructure, but there has been very few details and very few proposals put
forward. In terms of tax reform, they do intend to start hearings and to move that
process this fall. What does that mean for us? Two (2) things that we are keeping a
very close eye on that would impact the County are the continued deductibility of
interest for municipal bonds. That is something that is very important to state and
local governments that rely on municipal bonds for funding capital projects, and
without that deductibility, they lose their attractiveness. We are working very closely
COUNCIL MEETING 6 AUGUST 9, 2017
with the National Association of Counties (NACo) and the United States Conference
of Mayors to advocate for that continuation on behalf of the County. The second issue
that would impact state and local governments are eliminating the deductibility of
state and local income taxes; something that would really impact states with high
income taxes. These are big issues going forward with tax reform. Of course, the
objective with tax reform, what the President wants to do, is to lower rates, both
individual and corporate rates. That will cost a lot of revenue, and to do that, they
have to find ways to make up revenue and these are two (2) items that they have in
their target. We will be working closely with the delegation on that and keeping the
County and the Office of the Mayor informed as we move forward.
Finally on infrastructure, this is a big priority. It is a big priority for us. We
should want a new infrastructure program. We have major capital transportation
projects here in the County that we need to address and we have submitted those
priorities to the delegation. We have put the State of Hawai`i Department of
Transportation (HDOT) on notice and met with Secretary Ford. They know what our
transportation priorities are. As that initiative moves forward, we will make sure
that they address those items of interest to the County. With that, unless there are
any questions, and we can hold questions until the end, whatever you want to do
Chair, I will turn it over to Mary.
Council Chair Rapozo: We will go ahead and hear from Mary and
save all of the questions until the end.
MARY CRONIN, Managing Director of Smith Dawson & Andrews, Inc.:
As you know, the Mayor was in Washington in June and he was participating
in the annual "Hawai`i on the Hill," which is an opportunity for local area businesses
and entrepreneurs to showcase their products and to elevate their profile and present
their priorities to the Congressional Delegation. We also keep the Mayor very busy
during those trips. Any time he is in Washington, we line-up a number of meetings
with key administrators within the federal agencies and also with the Congressional
Delegation and key staff. So this year, we focused on six (6) federal agencies: we met
with the Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD) where we talked
about funding for low-income housing projects and also for homelessness funding; we
met with the Department of Health and Human Services, where we talked about the
need to preserve the Native Hawaiian language, specifically the Ni`ihau language
program, and there is a specific grant opportunity for that. We also learned about
some other new funding opportunities that we would like to consider pursuing in the
next year, including the Community Economic Development Program grant, which is
an eight hundred thousand dollar ($800,000) grant is that available to provide
construction or non-construction activities for low-income populations and there is a
tie there that they must create some jobs. That was a program that was opened this
summer and will probably be re-announced in 2018, maybe as early as January or
February.
COUNCIL MEETING 7 AUGUST 9, 2017
We met with the Economic Development Administration and we talked about
the Creative Technology Center and also some interest in providing support for local
businesses and entrepreneurs. There are a couple of great grant programs there, the
Regional Innovations Strategies Program and the i6 Program grant that would
support local area entrepreneurs and businesses, and maybe we can pursue that next
year, potentially even for just a feasibility study to see if there is something that we
could put in place in downtown Lihu`e that would help to support them.
We also met with the Department of Transportation, which was an excellent
meeting and a chance for us to go back in and say "thank you, again," first, for
awarding us the TIGER grant and also to thank them for awarding us the Federal
Transit Administration (FTA) Bus and Bus Facilities Grant. This year, we received
five hundred eighty thousand dollars ($580,000). We applied for one million six
hundred thousand dollars ($1,600,000) to provide for replacement of twelve (12)buses
and we were awarded five hundred eighty thousand dollars ($580,000) to replace
six (6) new buses. That was a big success and a big thank you and it was quite a
rewarding meeting. We were there with some of the new political appointees within
the Federal Highway Administration and within the Office of Intergovernmental
Affairs. We also had, in our presence, the person who was in-charge or is the program
administrator for the TIGER grant and also the FASTLANE grant. He is the one
that we worked with, his name is Robert Mariner, whom we worked with so closely
over the course of those two (2)years that we were working on applying for the TIGER
grant and he said that he wanted everyone in the room to know, especially the new
political appointees that the TIGER process that we went through and the way that
we presented our grant application was the model and should be the model for all
TIGER grants and all Department of Transportation grants across the nation. That
was very rewarding to hear to know that we had done it right and that they were
using that success story as a model for others.
We also met with the United States Postal Service (USPS) to talk about the
recent decisions to consolidate across the country. It is something that is happening
everywhere, not just proposed to happen here. We discussed our interest in having
them revisit their decision to close some locations and to consolidate here on Kaua`i.
What is interesting is that never in their history have they ever revisited a potential
closure, and in this case, they said that they were very interested in revisiting the
potential closure here on Kaua`i. They are going to do that and they are going to put
a new person in place to do that study and they will have some sort of a public hearing
in October; that was the latest that we heard.
We also met with the United States Fish and Wildlife Service. This was an
opportunity to meet some of the new political appointees that are high-up within that
agency, to introduce ourselves, to tell them our side of the story, and to let them know
that we are a willing and able partner in the future, moving forward, as we have been
COUNCIL MEETING 8 AUGUST 9, 2017
in the past, and only to work with them in Washington, but also continuing to work
with them in Portland and locally here in Hawai`i. They were very receptive. We
had a very warm welcome from them. They were appreciative that we had come in
to take the time to meet them and they are going to defer to the regional office of the
U.S. Fish and Wildlife and also here in Hawai`i. I think it is important that they
heard from us, they met us, and they know that we are here and that we are
continuing our good faith effort to work with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife and Division
of Forestry and Wildlife (DOFAW) here in Hawai`i.
In addition to meeting with the federal agencies, we also present, as we do
annually, our concise federal agenda to the Congressional Delegation. This is an
opportunity to tell them about the successes that we have had in some of the priorities
over the last five (5) or six (6) years to give them an update on where things stand
and where we are continuing to seek funding opportunities and where we would like
to see their support. We also spoke with them heavily about appropriations and the
focus on protecting the Native Hawaiian programs, in particular, which are
threatened. They are within three (3) federal agencies: Health and Human Services,
Housing and Urban Development, and the U.S. Department of Education. We are
going to be working with the Congressional Delegation to do everything that we can
to protect those programs. Right now, they are safe, but there is a threat and
hopefully we can work with the U.S. Conference of Mayors and some other
organizations that can garner support nationwide for those programs. They do not
only affect Native Hawaiians here in Hawaii, but they also affect other tribal
organizations throughout the United States.
When we were in Washington, we also met with Congresswoman Gabbard,
specifically about an opportunity that she had been alerted to. It was very short
notice and she said she had met with the U.S. Department of Agriculture and that
they were looking to know whether or not there were rural communities across the
country that might have priorities or projects, maybe "shovel-ready" projects, that
they could rededicate potentially some foreign agricultural service dollars. I have not
confirmed that it is foreign agricultural service dollars, but there is a large pot of
money that is available if there is interest for rural communities across the United
States of America, and potentially a significant chunk of that could go to Hawaii.
When we met with Congresswoman Gabbard, she had about twenty-four (24) hours
to get back to the US Department of Agriculture and alert them as to whether or not
there were some potential opportunities here. We did provide her with our federal
priorities and projects that we thought could be considered in the future for some
funding opportunities. There is no specific funding opportunity available yet, but
there may be and that was the purpose of going through that exercise with her. She
will have an update for us in September and let us know whether or not there are
some funding opportunities that might align with those priorities.
COUNCIL MEETING 9 AUGUST 9, 2017
Since we have been here on Kaua`i this week, we have also been meeting with
the department heads to talk with them about the Holo Holo 2020 projects and about
their priorities within their departments and continue to work with them to identify
federal grants that might align with those priorities. Each year, we have produced a
book of the grants that we have provided to the County, this is the most recent book.
This is all of the grant opportunities that we have presented to the County since
November 2016; therefore, within the fiscal year of 2017. We continue to align grant
opportunities with projects and try to think of creative ways that we could pursue
some of those grants, and a lot of them do require somewhat of a local match.
Sometimes, it is in-kind, as you know. We have focused our discussions in the last
couple of days around the "Our Town Program" grant, which is a grant through the
National Endowment for the Arts that can be used for cultural and arts types of
programs and that could be something that the County could apply to for the moku
signage and education program. That is what I call "low-hanging fruit." It requires
maybe an in-kind match and that program would offer up to maybe two hundred
twenty-five thousand dollars ($225,000).
Another grant that we are considering applying to next year is the Language
Preservation grant for the Ni`ihau language. That is something that we want to make
sure that program is protected, but also I think that we have a good chance of getting
awarded some funding through that program next year.
When we met with the Department of Parks and Recreation, we talked about
a new opportunity—it is called the "Land and Water Outdoor Recreation Legacy
Parks" (ORLP) program, also known as the Land and Water Conservation Fund
(LWCF) Urban Parks grant. That program had not been funded, but was funded in
Fiscal Year 2016 for about fifteen million dollars ($15,000,000) and they awarded
twenty-two (22) communities across the country with funding up to seven hundred
fifty thousand dollars ($750,000) for park development, park land acquisition, or
construction of outdoor play areas for low-income residents to encourage them to get
outside and play and also to offer them outdoor recreational opportunities. I think
that grant program is something that we should consider pursuing if there are a need
for parks in Anahola or in other communities where it may be beneficial for the
children and families that live there.
We also discussed the National Civilian Community Core program, which is
an AmeriCorps program and it is through the corporation for National and
Community Service. We have had some success with some of other clients around
the country that have applied for this grant. It actually would give the opportunity
for eight (8) to twelve (12) people to come to Kaua`i to work for the County. The
requirement is that the County would house them, so you will have to provide
something as simple as a yurt, like the hygiene station, and the training and the
equipment that they would need in order to provide whatever service they are being
asked to provide. It is a volunteer program, it is a very popular program and it would
COUNCIL MEETING 10 AUGUST 9, 2017
be an incredible return on investment. If we had a location where we could have some
cots and could house people, they can work for eight (8) to twelve (12) weeks. They
could do hard labor, they could provide programming for kids for afterschool
programs, and they could slap paint on the walls of some important community
centers. There are some good opportunities there that I think we could consider
pursuing in the future. Like I said, that would not require any local match dollars.
Right now, there is a Bus and Bus Facilities grant available and open until
September. If we do not apply for that now, we can maybe consider applying for that
again in the future, because we have been successful, but we would really like more
funding to replace more buses. That is a critical need across the country. It is a great
discretionary grant program and we should continue to consider applying for that
program now or in the future.
Also, there is a Low or No Emission Vehicle and Facility grant program that
was open in April and will be open again maybe sooner than April of 2018. That is
another grant opportunity where we could apply for vehicles or bus vehicle facility
upgrades where there is low or no emissions, so potentially hybrid-types of bus
programs.
I am meeting with the Housing Agency and talking with some of the
homelessness service providers here on Kaua`i. There is a grant that is open right
now through the Department of Housing and Urban Development and it is for
ten (10) awards across the country that would have communities that would have
programs for reducing homelessness. It is called the "Continuum of Care" grant and
it is open right now. I think it is something that the County could consider applying
for. If not now, then definitely in the future.
Finally, we talked about some of the transportation opportunities and we have
prepared a list of transportation priorities, which we have presented to the State and
the Congressional Delegation since last November when we prepared the priorities
and in anticipation of an infrastructure proposal. Now, it did not come out as
advertised by the Trump Administration, but nevertheless, we did prepare this
important priority list. On that list includes the Kapa'a Multimodal Transportation
Solution priority to address congestion and roadway expansion. It may be that we
could apply for the Infrastructure For Rebuilding America (INFRA) Grant, which it
is formally known as the "FASTLANE" grant, it is was National Freight Highway
program prior to that. It is not "INFRA," which stands for "Infrastructure For
Rebuilding America." The INFRA grant is open right now through November 2nd, so
we could submit applications until November 2nd. The federal government can
provide up to eighty percent (80%) of the funds through this program. You do have
to be in a National Freight Highway or a National Scenic Area, so we may have to
extend our project up to the scenic overlook in Hanalei. This program would be to
reduce congestion to improve freight movement. It would include the ports and it
COUNCIL MEETING 11 AUGUST 9, 2017
could be a significant amount of money. They just modified the program a bit from
when it was called "FASTLANE," and they are now requiring twenty-five
percent (25%) of the funds be used for rural areas, so we qualify for that program.
That is a lot of money. There is eight hundred fifty million dollars ($850,000,000)
that was provided or authorized in fiscal year 2017 for that program. So if twenty-five
percent (25%) of the funds are available for rural communities—that is big. It would
require that the local community come up with the twenty percent (20%) match, but
potentially less in a rural community. We have to confirm that, but that is an option
and it is something that the State would need to be behind, the County obviously be
behind, and we think that the Federal Highways Administration potentially may
have trouble finding enough rural communities across the country to apply for this
particular grant program. I think that because of the success that we had with
TIGER and the fact that we were able to sign the full-funding grant agreement in
June, whereas there are a number of communities that cannot make it to that point;
even when they are awarded the grant, they do not actually get to the point where
they are guaranteed the funding. We did sign the full-funding grant agreement, so
given the relationship that we have established with the Federal Highways
Administration and the U.S. Department of Transportation, I think that it would
behoove us to leverage additional federal funding dollars through this INFRA grant
program for roadway congestion and expansion efforts.
The Deputy Assistant Secretary for Intergovernmental Affairs at the
Department of Transportation is an appointed official by the Trump Administration,
so he is new. He has been in place, I believe, since May or June, and he is interested
in coming out to Hawai`i and will be visiting Kaua`i on that trip so that he can come
and have a tour of the TIGER project and also to look at some of the other
transportation needs across the County. That would be a really good opportunity to
also showcase the congestion and roadway expansion needs. I think that we should
have more conversations with the State about applying for the INFRA grant and I
just strongly encourage us to go for it, because I really think if we could put the same
model together that we applied for TIGER, put that team together and work on that
through November 2nd, that we would have a really good chance of getting that grant
and having it be competitive. That is really all I had on all of the grant opportunities
and any questions you may have on any of those, feel free to ask or even to follow-up
with us afterwards about them.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Let me just start with your last
grant, the INFRA grant. It is ironic that you bring that up today. Councilmember
Brun and I went to the North Shore Community meeting last night regarding the
refuge and you talked about you having to extend the grant to the scenic lookout in
Hanalei. Well, as-of last night, the State's plan is to close that lookout. So you might
want to get in-touch with Larry Dill and whoever else in the State. It is against the
wishes of the community, but it does not sound like they are going to budge. They
are claiming a safety issue, but it is not a safety issue. I am not sure what their plan
COUNCIL MEETING 12 AUGUST 9, 2017
is, but as-of last night, it was quite clear that their plan is to shut that scenic overlook,
which would really make this project ineligible. I think that is only scenic...
Ms. Cronin: Scenic area on Kaua`i...we have not
investigated whether or not we would still be considered part of the National Freight
Highway network, just given the uniqueness of Kaua`i. I am not sure how they would
incorporate us into that larger system, but there may still be eligibility opportunities
aside from going up to National Scenic Overlook, but I think that could be a good tie
or a good connection to say this is really important and this is part of this program,
too.
Mr. Smith: I think that, and combined with the
twenty-five percent (25%) set-aside for rural areas is an opportunity for Kauai, so we
will work with the State and hopefully be able to put together a project.
Council Chair Rapozo: Or explain to them that it is important—it is
important to the community and it is important to transportation.
Ms. Cronin: Yes, and there has already been an incredible
amount of federal investment in that scenic overlook.
Council Chair Rapozo: Someone brought up last night that it is also
a historical landmark, so I am not even sure they can do that, but that is the plan
and I was very disappointed last night.
Ms. Cronin: Right.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Councilmember
Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you for the presentation. We really
look forward to working with you closely, which leads to my question: what is the
procedure when we are prioritizing our County initiatives when we are approaching
Washington, D.C.? Is it administration-driven or do you come back to Council for any
kind of feedback? This is the first time I am working with you hands-on. Previous to
this, we were working with Roger Gwinn from the Ferguson Group, so I am trying to
figure out what the tempo is and what type of procedures we would go through to
getting some input on our legislative priorities up in Congress?
Ms. Cronin: Well, we do work directly with the Office of
the Mayor, so we do work with the Mayor on identifying priorities that would align
with the congressional priorities, as well as the Administration's priorities. So the
effort really is initially casting a wide net to say, "Okay, here are the funding
opportunities and here are the legislative priorities or the initiatives that Congress
COUNCIL MEETING 13 AUGUST 9, 2017
is interested in," and then we say, "Okay, where does the County align with those
priorities? How can we create a concise federal agenda that would make sense for
the congressional delegation that would make sense for the federal agencies to find
ways to support?"
Mr. Smith: I mentioned that the priorities align obviously
with Holo Holo 2020 and I believe that is the plan that the Council has.
Council Chair Rapozo: No, that is the plan that the Mayor sets.
Ms. Cronin: It is the Mayor's plan.
Council Chair Rapozo: We discuss every year you come down that we
would like some, and I am sorry, Councilmember Kawakami, but we discuss this
every year that the Council does not get any input and I thought we agreed going
forward that when you meet with the department heads that we might grab the
committee chair. We do not, it is the Mayor's priorities, it is the Administration's
priorities, and then we find out after-the-fact. I am just addressing this for
Councilmember Kawakami's edification.
Mr. Smith: No, I understood that. I just meant that the
Holo Holo 2020 plan is out there and one is...
Council Chair Rapozo: Again, I want to make it clear that
Holo Holo 2020 is the Mayor's projects and it is not something that the Council has
collaborated with or something that the Council had approved or adopted.
Mr. Smith: In response to the Councilmember's question,
the priorities that we pursue are in conjunction with Holoholo 2020.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. Thank you.
Ms. Cronin: Also, I would just add to that, that the
contract that we have is with the Office of the Mayor and I think the contract that we
had with our predecessor was the Office of the Mayor and the Council. We provide
the Council with regular, weekly, and/or monthly updates of all of the things that are
happening in Washington and all of the grant priorities or announcements that are
being made in Washington. We encourage the Council to communicate with us and
we rarely hear from the Council. But there is not any reason that you could not work
with us and come up with some priorities for the Council that we can also be pursuing.
That is something that we encourage and we are very open to communicating with
you about that. If you have ideas, please reach out to us. It is not as-if we are not
willing and able to do that, it is that we want to hear from you what you would like
to see us working on.
COUNCIL MEETING 14 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you; that is very promising. As the
Committee Chair of Economic Development & Intergovernmental Relations, we will
definitely reach out and be more engaged. But while we have you here, I figure we
relay some concerns that have come up from our constituents, if you do not mind.
Ms. Cronin: Sure.
Councilmember Kawakami: It kind of has a nexus with this scenic
overlook for Hanalei Valley. I am confused if the closure is for the existing, because
we were approached by U.S. Fish and Wildlife that they did have appropriations and
it was a carryover from Senator Inouye's time that they wanted to start dispersing
towards a new scenic overlook, which I believe they are going out and doing some
outreach as we speak. So I am not sure if they are talking about the closure of the
existing and the rebuilding of one, but I can tell you that for the taro farmers that are
below that valley, they have some concerns. In 2008, they went from a ten-year
revocable permit to a year-to-year, with the understanding that the U.S. Fish and
Wildlife had to complete a comprehensive conservation plan, and the date they were
given was 2012. So these farmers have been on a year-to-year, and as you may know,
a year-to-year lease makes it impossible for a farmer to invest in their operations and
it makes it impossible for a taro farmer to go out and get loans to go out and invest in
their operation. Just for the public's knowledge, and they all pretty much know this,
but that Hanalei is the bread basket for kalo, which is a sacred food in Hawai`i. We
supply the State with a majority of our kalo for the various products, majority of
which is poi. These farmers have reached out and they want to be engaged with the
U.S. Fish and Wildlife while they go through these planning purposes. There are
concerns with the increased amount of traffic and the increased amount of
trespassing, believe it or not, because it draws some curiosity. So they brought this
to our attention, so I figure while we have you here, it would be a great time to start
speaking upon some of these topics that have recently come up. Of course, they
continue to try to coexist with U.S. Fish and Wildlife, because that is sometimes the
missions between taro farmers and U.S. Fish and Wildlife do not actually coincide, so
they are trying to find some way to collaborate and coexist way out there in Hanalei.
That would be one thing that I would like to have some dialogue on or maybe when
you go back and you speak with U.S. Fish and Wildlife, these type of topics can come
up. The other thing that I was wondering about was the fact that we have an issue
with storm water runoff and I know that the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA)
has a National Pollutant Discharge Elimination System (NPDES) and I was
wondering if there were any grant or federal funding opportunities that tie into our
funding when we have highway improvements to sort of incorporate any kind of storm
water runoff into the construction or retrofitting of these new highways. We recently
went out to Oregon, and as you know, Oregon is a very wet place, and they have
managed to incorporate storm water runoff into almost every aspect of their built
environment, where they are capturing about eighty-five percent (85%) of that storm
COUNCIL MEETING 15 AUGUST 9, 2017
water runoff and it is in things that you would not even think about: it is their median
strips, it is the way that they angle their roads, and it is their landscaping, and I was
wondering if there were any grant opportunities or federal funding opportunities for
Hawai`i. It would be a top priority, I would think, just because of our limited land
space and the fact that everything runs mauka to makai, into the ocean. That would
be the two (2) topics that come to the top of my head. If there was some kind of way
to go back and research those for myself, that would be awesome.
Ms. Cronin: There is a program that is a federal program
in which the money flows through the State, which is the Clean Water and Drinking
Water State Revolving Loan Fund programs and that is one way that Oregon and
other states and communities across the country are funding projects related to storm
water runoff. There is not a lot of money in that program, so it does not go very far,
but that is one area. The other is through the Army Corps of Engineers. It sounds
like if you are talking about a highway construction project and there is a waterway
that runs underneath that is a navigable waterway that might involve restoration or
construction, anything that would be in that waterway, then that would involve the
Army Corps of Engineers, and there is, of course, the new rules under the Water
Resources Reform and Development Act 2014 requirement that the Army Corps
submit its recommended projects to Congress for consideration authorization in the
next Water Resources Development Act, which will be likely, possibly next year.
There is currently right now an effort by the Army Corps of Engineers to solicit
projects or proposals by non-federal sponsors, I should say, to submit a request for a
feasibility study or a modification of a study or for a construction project related to
what you are describing. So that is something that we would want to probably take
up under the rules or consideration for the Water Resources Development Act in the
next year. You would want talk to your regional Army Corps division about this. If
it is one location or several locations, it might be premature if there is not a
construction project going to be underway over those navigable waterways, but that
would be another opportunity. I think that occasionally, the EPA has had some grant
programs that could be potentially applicable to that. Also, potentially the
Department of Transportation occasionally has something available. I do not know
of anything off of the top of my head that would be applicable other than what I
already mentioned, so I would have to do a little research and get back to you.
Mr. Smith: Mary mentioned the State and Local
Revolving Loan Fund and that is a source of funding, but I think the key here would
be to identify a project and to see if we could not put that forward through the Army
Corps of Engineers, because generally, that is where the biggest money comes from.
They reauthorize this program every two (2) years and they specifically authorize
projects in the legislation. Maybe we could follow-up with you and follow-up with the
County and see if we could begin to identify a specific project.
COUNCIL MEETING 16 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kawakami: The State every year...we appropriate money
for highway improvements—I wonder if that would be a window of opportunity when
we start receiving federal highway funds for our highway improvements, if we would
be able to draw that nexus between these types of grant opportunities. As you can
see, our State highways are slowly going towards concrete and they are becoming
much more multimodal in nature with sidewalks and bike lanes and also median
strips. That might be identifiable projects if we work with our state delegation to see
what their Capital Improvement Projects (CIP) priorities are going to be as far as
highway improvements.
Ms. Cronin: You are right, because when you have a
highway program or a highway project that does involve the federal government, then
you do need to do your National Environmental Policy Act (NEPA) analysis. The
NEPA, Section 408, or the categorical exclusion—to do an Environmental Impact
Study (EIS) of whatever that project might entail and how it would affect the natural
habitats or the water quality within that jurisdiction. So that is an area that you
would be able to pursue if you know you have a project and it does involve federal
highways funds. You more than likely need to talk to the Army Corps of Engineers
about what their jurisdiction might be over that and whether or not you would need
to submit a request for a feasibility study through them.
Councilmember Kawakami: So these grant opportunities that you speak
about, one of the things was that the funding for this type of project is very limited in
nature—is that something that we should approach our senior senator who has a seat
on the appropriations as far as tying to see if we could get more funding, or what
would be the strategy to increase funding so that we can start participating?
Ms. Cronin: It is very difficult in this environment, this
political environment, this fiscal environment, to get increases for any of these
programs, in particularly the Clean Water and Drinking Water State Revolving Loan
Fund programs. We actually do put in appropriations requests through the
programmatic process every year, as we have for the last five (5) years that we have
been working with the County, specifically requesting full funding for the Clean
Water and Drinking Water State Revolving Loan Fund programs. So we are already
working with the Congressional Delegation in saying that these programs are
extremely important to us and we want to see these programs funded at the highest
level we can get, which right now, if we could get full funding based on what we have
in the previous fiscal year, we are doing really well. We just want to keep reminding
them why those programs are important. It is better to tell them what we are doing
with the funds and why the funds are important, than to ask for more funding on top
of what we are getting in the current fiscal year, because that would be an unrealistic
expectation.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
COUNCIL MEETING 17 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock has a follow-up, but
when Councilmember Kawakami was talking about one of the farmers, one of the
things that is really important in the time of the lease...he brought up some very
important critical issues, one is that the crop cycle of the plant is fourteen (14) to
eighteen (18) months. I will have more comments later, after Councilmember Chock
has his follow-up, but I think that is real critical, where you are offering a lease to a
farmer for a year where the crop cannot be grown in the lease period—like
Councilmember Kawakami said, "What bank is going to lend you money if you do not
know if you are going to have the farm to harvest?" It is insane. Councilmember
Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mary and
Jim. Your work is so important and thank you for your report. Just to follow-up on
Councilmember Kawakami's request, I think the roads are important in terms of
storm water runoff issues. Certainly, I think it can be applied even on a smaller scale
when we talk about projects in the direction of housing. We have Lima Ola and we
have other projects, and to the Housing Agency, I really encourage us to look into that
in terms of drainage and natural filtration as opportunities. I think I was equally as
impressed in some of what we saw in Oregon and Seattle. The other area in terms of
infrastructure that...I am sorry...Chair, I am going into another subject.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Chock: If there are any funds that are focused on our
issue that we have with the siting of the landfill and building that landfill, this is
something that we really need to take a look at and have a big hill to climb on, and I
have not heard any substantial indication that there is funding available from you
folks.
Ms. Cronin: Well, we have been around the block in
Washington in trying to seek funding for siting the landfill. We went after the EPA,
we went to the Department of Energy, we went to Housing and Urban Development,
and also the Department of Transportation. There really are limited dollars for
something like that. There is a technical assistance and training program through
the USDA...or it might be the EPA...I may be wrong...that technical assistance and
training program is for Solid Waste Management, and when we have looked at that
grant, we have looked at it for several years now and the timing really has not been
quite right and we did have the feasibility study underway, which is now complete,
so that may be something that we could look to again this fall...it usually comes out
in the fall. That is really the only grant...there have been...well, in the previous
administration, there were some new opportunities through the Department of
Energy around renewable energy components that could be added to the project, but
I think it may be a little too far ahead to look to, because we have not gone to
COUNCIL MEETING 18 AUGUST 9, 2017
construction or anything. Just in terms of siting it, the feasibility study is done and
the TAT grant is the only one I can think of to potentially maybe utilize.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: Following-up on that trip to Oregon that we
went, I guess something that I got out of that is when we talk about these complete
streets and stuff...the circles, I can deal with, but I hope we are not pushing too much
for these bike lanes because we just do not have enough people riding bikes around
the island. It is not going to work here on the island. There is just not too much
people doing that. You talk about homeless grants—are you folks pushing to apply
for the grant to help with the homeless and stuff?
Ms. Cronin: We are encouraging the County to look at the
grant and consider whether or not there may be a program or an initiative that could
use some additional funding resources. If there is a program or initiative underway
to fight homelessness or reduce homelessness, and it is working, maybe it is
innovative, creative, and unique enough that we could apply for this particular grant,
the Continuum of Care grant, and obviously that would bring in some significant
dollars. If we do not have a program, but we do want to pursue some sort of a program
that might meet the criteria of this particular Continuum of Care grant, then we need
to give that some consideration and also work with some of the homelessness service
providers. Whether they are here on Kaua`i, whether they are in Hawaii, or whether
they are somewhere else in the country, it is something to consider. We know that
homelessness is a big issue and there has been considerable funding for veterans
homelessness through the Veteran Affairs (VA), and there is very little funding, but
there is some funding through HUD for reducing homelessness. This one particular
grant is the best grant to consider. All I can say is that we are encouraging
consideration of that grant opportunity and if we do not meet the criteria to be able
to apply for it this year, maybe we can apply for it in the future.
Councilmember Brun: Did you have those talks with them already?
Are they willing to do it? When I met with them, they were like, "We are going to do
it," and then I have been hearing in the community that, "We do not have time for it
right now." There are a lot of church groups on the west side that are willing to take
on a project and willing to do what they can to get these homeless people somewhere
and do something. When I met with the Administration, yes, it was a top priority,
but I am hearing from the church groups that it is not. I was just wondering if you
folks had any leeway with the Administration on if we are going to do it or not.
Ms. Cronin: We are going to discuss it on Friday morning.
Councilmember Brun: Okay. Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 19 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Chairman. I had a few more
questions. Do you work exclusively for the County of Kaua`i when we are speaking
of the various counties on our island chain?
Ms. Cronin: Yes.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you. That is great for us. We would
not want you folks lobbying for any other county, not to be greedy.
Ms. Cronin: Kaua`i County is the best county.
Councilmember Kawakami: I agree. You are hired again. Anyway, as far
as a formal policy position letters, the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA)
privatization, CDBG funding, Lihu`e Post Office—can you speak a little on the...for
the CDBG funding, I have to assume that you folks are just lobbying to keep it in tact.
It is a huge tool that Kaua`i County utilizes in every aspect that we possibly can. But
FAA privatization and the Lihu`e Post Office, which headlines on our little Garden
Island; can you speak to those two (2) specifically, the FAA privatization and the
Lihu`e Post Office, as far as your consulting efforts up in D.C.?
Mr. Smith: As far as the FAA is concerned, as you
probably know, there has been a proposal initiated by Congressman Schuster, the
Chairman of the House Transportation and Infrastructure Committee, to privatize
the FAA Air Traffic Control (ATC) System. This is very controversial. I understand
that it is a common practice in a lot of other countries around the world, particularly
in Canada, which has privatized its ATC. But it has not advanced yet in this congress
and I do not want to make any predictions, but I would be surprised if it does.
Chairman Schuster has not even developed a majority support within his committee
for it, and the Senate, Senate Commerce Committee, which our own Senator is a
member of the, Senator Schatz, has opposed it and not even considered it. The Trump
Administration did get behind it at the request of Chairman Schuster, but to-date, it
has not developed enough support to see it enacted. That could change, but as of
today, I do not think that is going to happen.
Councilmember Kawakami: Which is good news in my opinion,just for the
fact that we are an island economy driven by tourism and everything comes in via air
flight.
Mr. Smith: Right.
Councilmember Kawakami: For the Lihu`e Post Office, can you give us an
update on that?
COUNCIL MEETING 20 AUGUST 9, 2017
Ms. Cronin: Yes, so we met with the manager of all of the
properties for the Postal Service when we were in Washington in June with the Mayor
and they had a very good conversation and the Mayor gave the Postal Service our
side of the story, and what she told us what that they were actually not happy with
the outcome of the study that had been done by the person that was in charge on
managing that study within the last year, whenever that study was completed, and
they made it a termination to consolidate. The issue is that the postal service is
running out of money and it has to do with the fact that people just are not sending
mail and not buying stamps, and that we have other resources like Federal Ex
(FedEx), E-mail, and Amazon. People are not just sending mail anymore, so the
Postal Service just does not have any money and they are interested in consolidating
operations because a lot of their facilities are just too big and they are not being
utilized at capacity. In the case here on Kaua`i, they have a large facility at the
airport that they feel it can accommodate more and their initial study did not take
into consideration necessarily as much as it could have what the community input
was regarding the consolidation effort. The Postal Service just really looked at it as
an opportunity to consolidate and save money, so now they are going to go back and
restudy the facilities on Kaua`i and come back with another report, and it will be a
different person who will do this study, as compared to the person who did the
previous study. There will be a public hearing...I do not know if"public hearing" is
the right word...maybe "community meeting" about it in October. That was my latest
update. Again, this is happening all over the country and it is not something that is
unique to this island or any of the islands in Hawai`i. This is not an issue that is
going to go away. They would like to be able to sell off some of the federal property
that they own and they want to sell it for fair market value and that, that money
would go back into the Postal Service to be able to continue their operation. If you
want to see the Postal Service continue and see these post offices continue in
operation, I would encourage you to go back to snail mail and buying stamps. That
is what the Postal Service would like to see, but I think you are fortunate that you
have an opportunity to revisit their consolidation discussion.
Councilmember Kawakami: As far as the U.S. Postal Service, what is
standing in the way for them being more innovative as far as leasing out space so
that they can maybe operate sort of like landlords to get more eateries into some of
these historic places that have tremendous value? It is almost our State Library
system when you think about it. Our Border's Bookstore became a glorified coffee
shop and library where people would come in, buy their coffee, pick a book off the
shelf, read their book, and return it. Then we question when the State libraries comes
why or what type of legislation do we need to have a coffee shop in each one of our
libraries so that we can generate revenue? What is the holdup with the U.S. Postal
Service being more innovative and entrepreneurial? It is something that needs to
pass through congress? It is something that they can enact through rules? Is it just
a discussion that is not happening where they want to just sell off properties and then
COUNCIL MEETING 21 AUGUST 9, 2017
be done with it? That is the concern. That is why little towns like us nationwide are
fighting for their post offices and they are wondering why they cannot see the
opportunity. What is the hold-up?
Mr. Smith: To be honest with you, Sir, I cannot tell you.
I know that the Postal Service has been under duress for many years. It has been
controversial. I think you make an excellent point. Whether they see themselves
essentially as just a postal service or something bigger and more entrepreneurial,
which might enhance funding for their operations; that is a very good question.
Ms. Cronin: They are a separate entity, even though they
are the Federal Postal Service. I do not believe that they fall under the jurisdiction
or the authorization of congress, so they are essentially a self-sufficient federal
agency. They are not receiving funding from congress. Therefore, they are like a big
business that has to find ways that they can generate revenue. Right now, the easiest
way for them is to consolidate in order to generate that revenue. It is pretty much
that simple. There are efforts to go to congress and to say to them, "This is why this
post office is so important to us, it is an historical property, and it is right in our
downtown. We just got this TIGER grant and we are revitalizing our downtown and
this post office is part of that." The efforts that we put forth to try to encourage them
to relook at the consolidation is working. Every community across the country maybe
has to do that in order to get them to reconsider. The effort to say to our members of
congress, even though the Postal Service is not getting funding from congress, they
still do listen. In this case, we were successful in getting them to listen. Other
communities maybe are not putting forth that much effort or their Congressional
Delegation is not working as hard as ours to try to keep that postal building open. I
do not have the intricacies or the knowledge of what goes on in the minds of the
powers that be at the Postal Service to know what their plans are for being more
innovative, unique, and creative, but I would say that if we could think of ways to be
more innovative and creative with the space that the postal service is using, maybe
we could find other opportunities where we would take up that space or that space
that they are leasing or that we could be leasing from them is generating some
revenue or they are not able to utilize that space to consolidate operations. If that
space is being used by something else, like a commercial kitchen for example, then
they are not going to have that space available to consolidate to. Maybe we need to
think of ways that we can prevent them from doing that.
Councilmember Kawakami: So there is really no known restrictions that
we know of that stops them? Because I see them moving towards being more
retail-like. I see them starting to sell greeting cards and they are trying, so we do not
know if there are any real restrictions that ties their hands behind their back.
Mr. Smith: Well, what I do not know, and you are right—
they have been more aggressive on the retail front and overnight mail and trying to
COUNCIL MEETING 22 AUGUST 9, 2017
keep up with the private couriers. What I do not know is how it operates with respect
to real property. Mary is correct in that they are somewhat a separate, independent
agency of the federal government, but yet the Postal Service is authorized by the
federal government. When it comes to property, I am not sure if those facilities are
actually owned by the Postal Service or if they are considered federal property under
the domain of the General Services Administration (GSA). So there may be some
limitations that the Postal Service may have in terms of leasing their facilities or
using them for other purposes. That may run-up against the GSA...I do not know,
but I would be happy to look into that and get some information for you.
Councilmember Kawakami: But if they are looking at selling the
properties then we could assume that they have some kind of control over these
properties that they are operating on, but I guess it is piecemeal from
location-to-location as to who actually owns.
Mr. Smith: Right, but even with respect to the federal
government, all federal buildings, whether it is the Department of Transportation or
whomever, are under the domain of General Service Administration. GSA is
essentially the "property owner." I just do not know the intricacies of the Postal
Service, but we will be happy to look into that for you.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: I just have a real quick question with regards
to the property, because we were told that the only way they can dispose of that
building is to sell it at fair market value. There was no opportunity to donate it, lease
it, or have it for cheap rent. The only option that they had was to sell it at full market
value, fair market value. Can you check on that for us?
Mr. Smith: Yes, I will check on that.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Kagawa.
Ms. Cronin: We did hear that as well.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you.
Councilmember Kagawa: I just had a follow-up question on the post
office. My understanding is that if I were to drop mail off at the Lihu`e Post Office
and I wanted to mail it to Kaua`i Island Utility Cooperative (KIUC), which is right in
Lihu`e; that piece of mail would go to Honolulu, to the mainland, back to Honolulu,
and back to Kaua`i when that place is right on Kaua`i. Has anybody asked the
question if the system is in need of repair, which could save expenses? If you multiply
that inefficiency by thousands and millions and billions of mail, maybe perhaps that
COUNCIL MEETING 23 AUGUST 9, 2017
would be the solution and they would not be in such financial trouble. It just seems
highly inefficient. Mail from half a mile away goes from Lihu`e, to Honolulu, to the
mainland; back to Honolulu, back to Kauai, and then gets delivered.
Ms. Cronin: You are right. It sounds very inefficient. I
would say that would be something that should be brought up at the public comment
or hearing opportunity in October.
Councilmember Kagawa: You have never heard anybody mention to the
post office that maybe their system is inefficient? Has that ever been brought up?
Ms. Cronin: Definitely.
Councilmember Kagawa: It has been brought up?
Ms. Cronin: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: Okay. Thank you.
Mr. Smith: Nobody has ever accused the post office of
being efficient.
Councilmember Kagawa: It is efficient in a way that it is amazing that
most mail do not get lost by going that far away and back. In that way, in not losing
mail, they are pretty efficient, I would say. You would think that there has to be a
better way, especially for Kaua`i mail. I do not believe that Kaua`i mail should ever
leave the island. Thank you.
Mr. Smith: We will look into that and to the question
concerning property as well.
Council Chair Rapozo: It is amazing how the airlines takes your bag
from the counter, to the plane, to the next airport, and they lose bags all of the time.
For the mail, even as inefficient as it may sound, going all over the world, they
manage to deliver it. So inefficient or not, they get it done. Councilmember
Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I have a follow-up on the postal question.
Thank you so much for your work on our behalf. First of all, I think the function of
mail is something we would like to keep on Rice Street, because it is a gathering place
and it is a place where people go to; everybody needs mail. It is true that a lot is done
now by E-mail, but even Amazon has to have their boxes delivered. Even with the
purchasing through E-mail, you still have the deliveries that have to be made and
you would hope that the Postal Service would be competitive in getting that business.
COUNCIL MEETING 24 AUGUST 9, 2017
So assuming that we want to keep the mail function on Rice Street, do you have any
advice to us as we approach the October hearing, in terms of what our approach
should be or what preparation we should do? I do think that the information being
requested here, if you can help us find some answers, would be good to know as we
go into the public meeting and into the next cycle. Do you have any other thoughts?
Ms. Cronin: I think we could prepare a bulleted list of
arguments that you could consider to present to them in October. I think that would
be helpful.
Councilmember Yukimura: I am sorry, we should consider what?
Ms. Cronin: We will prepare a bulleted list of arguments
or statements and things that you could use at that public hearing that might help
your cause.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you.
Ms. Cronin: I will tell you that when we met with them in
June, they discussed the idea of consolidating and utilizing a large space that is
available at the airport. So they currently have some operations there at the airport
and they are talking about the fact that, that space is large enough to accommodate
everything that they have here at the Rice Street postal building. If you can find a
way to say that, "Well, the airport is expanding," and there are other companies or
businesses that are interested in using that space that the postal service is talking
about, or if there is another way to say that there is no room or there is the likelihood
of that space being available for long-term is not very great. If you can build that
argument and say that consolidation space that they are planning to move to at the
airport is not going to be efficient or sufficient, then I would say that you would need
to build your argument around that. So we can work on some bullet points for you,
but that is their plan...that was the initial plan. Now they are going back and
revisiting that initial plan.
Councilmember Yukimura: Well, apparently their decision to build that
huge building, which is now not really being used to its optimum, was part of their
planning process, which they may not have been very thoughtful about and now they
are having to minimize their costs, right? What I am hearing you say is rather than
talk about leasing this space here, think about leasing that space. I have a feeling
they need some of that space for postal business, so to lease the whole thing might
not be realistic, but some other uses of that space might be. I hear what you are
saying on that. It could hurt them to move there because nobody can get there except
by car to the airport space. These private mailbox services are springing up now that
may serve the needs of our elderly, who do not have a way to get to that large facility
COUNCIL MEETING 25 AUGUST 9, 2017
by the airport and they may be losing business in the long-run, too, if we are not
serving that localized need.
Mr. Smith: Right. I would not underestimate the
community benefits associated with having the post office downtown, so I would
emphasize that and I would also engage the community; make sure that the
community turns out and responds and makes their preferences and views known as
well.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes. Thank you.
Ms. Cronin: One final point, Councilmember, is that we do
have significant federal investment in downtown Lihu`e on Rice Street from the
TIGER grant and I think they need to know what the TIGER grant entails and that
it is about ladders of opportunity and it is about connecting the elderly housing that
is right downtown with safer pedestrian access to the businesses and the services
that are right downtown. That was really the heart of our application; that is what
our application was about, right?
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Ms. Cronin: If you can emphasize that, "We are doing this
revitalization of our downtown for ladders of opportunity, for access to services,
education, and jobs, and that this is a big part of that and that the federal government
invested thirteen million eight hundred thousand dollars ($13,800,000) towards that
effort, so we would hate to see the postal building be closed and that service not be
available for that purpose."
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions?
Councilmember Yukimura: I have other questions on other subjects.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Yukimura: I just want to say that it really has been a
good five (5) years with your firm and we really appreciate the work that you have
done and the results that you have helped us to produce. Jim, I want to thank you
for the overview. It is very helpful and informative to know the federal context, even
though in this day of instant communication, we should know. We do not get all of
the information in an organized form, so it is very helpful, and it partly explains on
another issue that is on the agenda today—we have been very late in getting CDBG
guidelines for the rental rates for the year and your explanation of the delay in
COUNCIL MEETING 26 AUGUST 9, 2017
congress for passing those moneys kind of helps explain why the agencies work is
pushed back, too.
Mr. Smith: Yes, everything is delayed.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes. Thank you for that. On some specific
questions, as the Public Safety & Transportation Committee Chair, I am always
interested in the moneys available for the Kaua`i Bus and thank you for the recent
appropriation that we got for our buses to add more buses. We have in our
Multimodal Land Transportation Plan highlighted the need for additional bus
baseyard space, because without it, we cannot actually increase the frequency of our
regular weekday routes because it means that we need not just replacement, but we
need additional buses if we are going to increase the frequency of our weekday
schedule. So it is actually a limiting factor, we cannot increase our daily frequency,
even though part of our plan is to increase weekly ridership by one thousand percent
(1,000%) in twenty (20) years as part of the congestion management plan. So I am
hoping that the Administration is looking for that baseyard of moneys, because we
cannot expand bus services without it. Have you looked at funding for that?
Mr. Smith: Yes. Well, there is the existing Bus and Bus
Facilities program under the Federal Transit Administration (FTA) and that is where
we got the money for the six (6) new buses this year.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Mr. Smith: That program continues to be authorized and
funded and it is an available source to us and I expect that we will be pursuing
additional funding for additional buses through that program. I should mention
though that does go through the State, so we have to apply through HDOT for that
money and HDOT has to take into consideration the needs of other small community
providers around the State, so it is not necessarily "all ours." The other thing I would
just mention is that transit has been terribly underfunded for the last several years
at the federal-level and this goes back to the fact that we have not increased the
federal gasoline tax since 1992. If we had only indexed the tax to inflation in 1992,
the last time we increased it, today it would be almost thirty cents ($0.30) a gallon as
opposed to eighteen cents ($0.18) a gallon. That is a controversial issue, any time you
talk about increasing taxes. But the backlog of transportation and maintenance
needs is building all around this country. It is just becoming overwhelming. To get
just public transportation back to a state of good repair is something like we need
eighty billion dollars ($80,000,000,000) of additional funding over the next ten (10)
years. So my hope and expectation is that if congress does get around to authorizing
a new infrastructure program in 2018—again, keep in mind that this has been one of
President Trump's highest priorities—that we will address the backlog of needs for
public transportation providers, either through an increase in the federal gas tax or
COUNCIL MEETING 27 AUGUST 9, 2017
some other related revenue stream that is going to provide an ongoing sustainable
source for these programs and projects for the foreseeable future. There have been a
lot of ideas tossed out there; I am sure you are familiar with them. One is to tax
based on vehicle miles traveled (VMT). That is actually being tested and
demonstrated right now in the state of Oregon. There may be some evidence that
would support a vehicle miles traveled financing vehicle when we finally get around
to this next infrastructure bill. We hear your concern loud and clear. We are fully
aware of it. We will work with the Administration and with HDOT to see that our
needs are addressed.
Councilmember Yukimura: So under the Trump Administration, is there
an understanding of the importance of transit; or in the infrastructure bill, will it all
be focused on road expansion?
Mr. Smith: That is a very good question. We would like
to think that this President, who comes from New York City, which is the largest
public transportation provider in the country, and who built real estate projects in
New York that are highly dependent upon the New York City subway system
operating on a daily basis, would recognize the importance of public transportation.
We have not been led to believe otherwise and we expect that transit will be a full
partner and have a seat at the table when this infrastructure bill is finally addressed.
We will be working and we do work very closely with the American Public
Transportation Association to make sure that those issues are addressed and succeed.
Councilmember Yukimura: So this Bus and Bus Facilities grant program
that is available, will it cover a bus baseyard?
Mr. Smith: Yes. It covers both buses and facilities.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay.
Mr. Smith: There is a formula program and there is also,
as a result of the last authorization bill, a new discretionary program for Bus and Bus
Facilities.
Ms. Cronin: It was the discretionary program that we
received the five hundred eighty thousand dollars ($580,000). But adding to that, the
Bus and Bus Facilities grants program funds capital projects for bus facilities,
including replacing, rehabilitating, purchasing, or leasing buses or related
equipment; and rehabbing, purchasing, constructing, or leasing bus-related facilities.
That grant is open now and it closes on August 25th.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you. I have some other
questions, Chair, but I think there is some follow-up on this bus issue.
COUNCIL MEETING 28 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Brun: I have follow-up.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Brun: So we are looking at expanding the bus and
doing all of that—can we apply for funds to help fund the bus?
Mr. Cronin: To fund the bus...
Mr. Smith: Yes.
Mr. Cronin: You are getting formula funds now...you are
receiving formula funds through the federal FTA now for operating the bus, but then
you would be looking at a "small starts" project for bus expansion.
Mr. Smith: Most of the money is for capital. There is not
a separate operating assistance program. Was that your question?
Councilmember Brun: Yes. Right now, we can go out and get more
capital, but we do not have the money; the County does not have money to pour more
into expanding the bus service for the daily operating costs. Can you get grants to
help us with that?
Mr. Smith: Under the program, there is a formula that
allows for federal funds to be used for operating assistance, but it is capped.
Councilmember Brun: Okay.
Mr. Smith: Generally, speaking, the federal government
got out of the operating business, because they used to be able to use your federal
transit money for operating assistance, but it has been several years ago that they
eliminated that, and they expect local transit operators to be able to fund their own
operations, either through the farebox or some other local revenue source. In many
cases, there are local or regional sales taxes that fund the operations.
Councilmember Brun: I just think that we need to look at the whole,
big picture. Yes, we want to expand the bus, but how are we going to pay for it?
Mr. Smith: Yes.
Councilmember Brun: We are broke.
COUNCIL MEETING 29 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Smith: I think that is something that we could look
at in the next infrastructure bill and certainly in the next reauthorization bill,
particularly for small systems that do not have the revenue availability or revenue
options that the larger cities do.
Councilmember Brun: I just think that we have a plan right now that
is finally going into place...we are not efficient with the bus and everybody knows it.
I just think we need to have this plan go through and work it out, and then we worry
about expanding a little more. Right now, we just do not have the money to fund the
daily operations. We are capped at where we are at right now.
Mr. Smith: I understand.
Councilmember Brun: If we could get federal moneys to do that then
I would be supporting, but we do not have money at the County to do it right now.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Go ahead.
Councilmember Yukimura: Mary, you mentioned the concise federal
priorities agenda...I guess that is for the County of Kaua`i...I do not know if we have
ever seen it. Could we get a copy of that?
Ms. Cronin: The Office of the Mayor has a copy of that.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Actually, as a matter of practice, once
it is put together and it becomes the document that you are using to present to
congress, could we just automatically get a copy of that? Cyndi is back there. That
would be really helpful for us to just track what the program is for the year, because
that sort of defines it, right?
Ms. Cronin: Sure, yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. You mentioned that the Kaua`i
Multimodal plan that might be eligible for the 80/20 funding...that is...
Ms. Cronin: The INFRA grant, yes. I referred to it as the
"Kapa`a Multimodal Transportation Solutions."
Councilmember Yukimura: My understanding of the Kapa'a
Transportation Solutions plan that the Department of Transportation worked with
the County on is that it was not multimodal. Of course, I wanted it to be multimodal.
So if there is a multimodal program, I would like to see that, because I am not aware
that it is.
COUNCIL MEETING 30 AUGUST 9, 2017
Ms. Cronin: I do not know the answer to that, but the goal
of the INFRA grant is to rebuild that infrastructure. Really, the grant program is for
congestion, mitigation, and roadway expansion opportunities to better enable freight
movement, and obviously included in that is making roadways safer. Maybe we
should not categorize the grant application as being for Kapa'a Multimodal
Transportation Solutions. I guess I would say that I would take that back and say
that if we have an opportunity to do some congestion, mitigation, and roadway
expansion and safety improvements of Kuhio Highway from the port in Lihu`e, all the
way up to Hanalei and incorporating all of the priorities between the two (2) locations
related to those areas then that would be what we would want to include in our
INFRA grant application.
Councilmember Yukimura: I support that. To your question as to
whether it could qualify, I think we have an interstate highway system in the State
and that is what pulls it up into the federal highway system, so we should not have
trouble qualifying that way with that aspect. I do believe that the County is
developing a plan for Kapa`a-Wailua transit and they call it a "shuttle system." Once
that is integrated into the expansion plans that the State DOT is working on, the
four (4) lanes in front of Coco Palms and the additional south to north lane that would
be added to the bypass, all of that, then it becomes a multimodal plan. I have never
seen it put together and if this is an opportunity to put it together, I think the shuttle
study for the Wailua-Kapa'a is just coming back to the Council with recommendations
and a plan in the fall. If there is a way to put it together, I think it would really
impress the feds by being truly a multimodal plan and it would include the capacity
expansion, the road expansion, as well as the bus expansion system, through
addressing the short trips within the town that will clear the main highway or could
help to clear the main highway. If that can be done, I think it is an opportunity to
make our grant application look even better.
Mr. Smith: I think you are right; I think it is an
opportunity. Keep in mind that this is a new program. This was just created in the
last transportation authorization bill and it was really designed to facilitate the
movement of goods that are impaired by multimodal congestion. It is to tie ports and
maritime traffic in with vehicular traffic and to bring multimodal solutions that are
going to ease congestion and facilitate movement. That is why I think Mary said
earlier that this may present an opportunity to relook and repackage this project.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Mr. Smith: The other thing is that obviously we have a
unique environment here on Kaua`i as an island, and because twenty-five
percent (25%) of this program must be spent on rural areas, I think it provides
additional advantages for us to pursue it.
COUNCIL MEETING 31 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Mr. Smith: As Mary said, the Deputy Assistant Secretary
of Transportation plans to visit here in October, so this would be an opportunity, not
only to show them the TIGER project, but to showcase this need as well.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, thank you. Chair, I have one more
question on another subject.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Yukimura: Before I go to that question, I just want to
endorse or second Councilmember Kawakami's raising of the issue about the taro
farmers in Hanalei, because it is unreasonable to expect them to survive and thrive
on a one-year lease. That really needs to be addressed. I am really grateful that he
brought that up. I do not think there is a lot of money for landfills at the federal-level
because that is not viewed as a real innovative or environmentally sound solution.
My question is what about moneys for recycling, reuse, and reducing solid waste in
the area of materials management?
Council Chair Rapozo: Or alternative technologies as well.
Ms. Cronin: Right.
Council Chair Rapozo: Just something other than landfills.
Ms. Cronin: Yes, there are some grants for reuse and
establishing facilities to...I guess the word is to "disintegrate" or "burn" products. In
the Pacific Northwest where they have a lot of extra mulch or wood, they end up
filling a lot of the areas where they have done timber harvest and they do have a
program for capturing energy from the burning of those types of products. There are
not a lot of discretionary dollars for those types of services. There are a number of
companies that are available and willing to work with you to develop new
technologies and there may be some resources available through them, public-private
partnership types of programs.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. The Chair added to my question and
that is fine, but I am not interested in incineration, because all analyses in the
County, done twice now, show that it is not feasible economically and it is not sound
environmentally. I was really asking about the "reduce, reuse, and recycle," and I am
hearing your answer to that is that there is not really a lot of discretionary moneys.
Ms. Cronin: Unless it is biomass.
COUNCIL MEETING 32 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: I do not mind you answering the question
about incineration, but I just...we have kind of gone over that issue over and over
again and it has not been feasible for a small community like this.
Mr. Smith: I was going to say that I know that EPA has
put out some grant funding in the past, particularly for recycling electronics.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Mr. Smith: But I am not aware of an ongoing sustainable
program, but we will look into that.
Councilmember Yukimura: I think the ultimate solution may come in
what is called "producer solutions," where the manufacturer of the products are
responsible for the waste that is produced by the product. That is why some
companies are welcoming back electronics, for example. If we ever get to a federal
government that is innovative and looking forward, that might come up. I do not
know about now. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Let me wrap up. First
of all, you work for the County. Your contract is with the County; the Office of the
Mayor manages the contract. At the end of the day, you do not work for
Councilmember Brun, Councilmember Yukimura, Councilmember Rapozo, or any
one of us, so I appreciate the questions. Just because Councilmember Yukimura said
that she does not support something does not mean that it is not a valid question. I
have to listen about the bus expansion every Wednesday and every issue ties back,
and it is okay. That is what this is for. It amazes me that today we have congestion
up the "ying-yang," we have a solid waste issue, we have homelessness, and we have
all of these affordable housing issues, and today, the majority of the time was spent
being talked about transit. We touched on a little bit on the other stuff, but there
was very little discussion on homelessness. I heard you talk about some available
grants, which I think we have to really focus on. I just heard today that our provider
of transitional or emergency shelter beds are being reduced. I think we are going to
hear from the community about that, because I see the woman in the audience. Last
night, as I was at the Fish and Wildlife Service public meeting, and Councilmember
Brun was there as well, it is scary what the federal government is trying to do. There
is no doubt in my mind that they are...they said it last night that they are a recovery
agency and their job is to recover the endangered species at any cost. They are trying
to kick those farmers out of the valley, even though the farmers were there much
before Fish and Wildlife was there. One of the farmers there last night said that the
birds are responsible for forty-four thousand (44,000)pounds of taro a year. Yet, what
is the federal government doing to...I say the endangered species we need to be
worried about is the farmer, the taro farmer. It is not bananas and papayas where
you can just go pick up and go find another farm. They are in a location that has been
COUNCIL MEETING 33 AUGUST 9, 2017
there. I was very disappointed and frustrated. As you start looking into these
highway grants that will impact, or that lookout could, in fact, help us with getting
those funds. I would really take into account what is their...honestly, I am going to
be doing a resolution and it is going to go to President Trump. As much as people do
not like President Trump, the one thing he talks about was reducing some of the
regulatory issues that are punishing our farmers and our businesses, so maybe we
will get some juice there. I do not know...these people last night were not interested
in listening to the community. They made it very clear that their job is about the
recovery of endangered species, not protecting what made Kaua`i and Hawai`i, which
is our taro farmers. It was very frustrating. I do not know where that is going to go,
but whatever help we can get in that realm, as we work on the grant that you are
talking about. Also, of course the homeless grants—I do not know...it is a problem
everywhere, especially here in Hawaii. Honolulu is a mess and Kaua`i is getting
there. There are a lot of families right now that are living in bushes, and we do not
see them. People think that it is only minor and that there are only a few, but it is
not a few; it is hundreds and hundreds. I personally know of grandparents that are
taking care of their grandchildren in a tent on a beach because the parents are
druggies. Grandma and grandpa is living in their tent with their grandchildren, kids.
We talk about these other fluffy projects, but let us try to focus on other issues,
because one day we are going to wake up, like Honolulu did, and say, "You know
what, we should have done something back then." That is where I am really
concerned, that we have to put some of our emphasis in priorities where we have to
take care of these people. If not, we are going to be like Honolulu. Then, what do we
do? Do you know what Honolulu is doing? They are making it illegal for these people
to live and sleep on sidewalks. That is their answer. Is that what humans do? No,
we take care of them. We are not supposed to be arresting them, but we do not know
where to go. I am encouraging that we take a look at the homeless grants and really
look at things that can work on this island to get these homeless people in homes or
in shelters. Finally, as far as solid waste, I do not know what the Administration
tells you, but we are in a crisis right now and whatever technology...I am just
suggesting that whatever is available, we need to explore that. I agree or I believe in
one technology...at the end of the day...this is where we have to figure out a process,
because the Mayor obviously manages the contract. The Council has its own
priorities, but we have to come up with a way, much like how we do our legislative
packages where we come together and we figure out...you work for the County... you
may think you work for the Mayor, but you work for the County of Kaua`i. In fact,
there was a time...not yours, but the lobbying money was removed from the Office of
the Mayor and the Council put it back in, because we knew the importance and the
need and I think every one of us appreciates what you folks do. There has to be a
better process, where we all come together and come up with a package for the County
of Kaua`i; not the Mayor, not the Council, not Councilmember Rapozo or anybody else,
but for the County. That is what your marching orders would be. I think that is the
process...I think that was my process...anyway, that was the intent I thought we
would be following. In closing, and it is more for Jim...I will tell you about Mary-
COUNCIL MEETING 34 AUGUST 9, 2017
she is like a chaperone in Washington, D.C. She is on us like "white on rice" to make
sure that the appointments are met and that every single available time is occupied
in this mission to secure some federal assistance and federal grants. I just wanted to
take this time to thank Mary, because I got to see her in action and I do not know
how long I can last with that woman...that was less than one (1) week, but anything
longer, I would probably have a heart attack. She does her job well and I just wanted
to publically thank her and let you know, Jim, that she is great. We appreciate what
you folks do.
Mr. Smith: I thank you and I certainly recognize that.
That is why we always say that when you come back to D.C. for an official visit, do
not think it is vacation.
Council Chair Rapozo: I will make sure I do not let her know I am
there. Thank you very much.
Ms. Cronin: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: I know we have some public testimony, so
please hang around if you do not mind. I am not sure what the public has to say.
Mr. Smith: Again, thank you very much. As I said at the
outset, it has been an honor and a pleasure to be your consultant in Washington and
we very much appreciate the partnership and the opportunity that you have given
us, and we look forward to more success in the months ahead.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you.
JADE K. FOUNTAIN-TANIGAWA, County Clerk: Chair, the first registered
speaker is Anne Punohu.
ANNE PUNOHU: Aloha Council. Anne Punohu, for the record.
I would like to thank the lobbyists for coming today. I have some questions, have
made some observations, and have some concerns. Thank you, Chair—yes, I am the
lady in the audience. My priority down here was housing equity, low-income housing,
shelters, housing first, quality of life for Kaua`i's people, protection of the
environment, quality jobs, and protection of the host culture. As a former taro farmer
and also someone who worked in guava that was undercut originally when I worked
on that plantation by South America, I think another issue that is huge for the taro
farmers are the influx of Asian taro coming into the market, which is causing a huge
problem for taro farmers in Hanalei. Let us just be logical. It takes nine (9) to
twelve (12) months for the crop to be ready, so if you are just going to give a one-year
lease then that is ridiculous. I think that needs to be relooked at. One of my main
concerns, as I was listening to the lobbyists speak and speaking about the current
COUNCIL MEETING 35 AUGUST 9, 2017
administration which I am no fan of, whether the contingency plans...this is a
question for the lobbyists...what are the contingency plans for 2018 funding if it does
not materialize? What are the exact priorities that the lobbyists will go after if
important funding, such as impacts of health, safety, and welfare immediately of
Kaua`i's people will be affected—what are the priorities? What will be the first thing
that they will go after in a bulldog manner to try to safeguard and protect? Another
one of my concerns was immigration. Now on Kaua`i, which we did not have in the
past, we do now have an extremely large Marshallese and Micronesian contingency
here. We also have a lot of immigration from the Philippines. One of my concerns is
that Hawai`i has stated that it is a sanctuary city, so one of my concerns when
listening to what is going on nationally is that there may be funding pulled for things
like police protection and things like that. That is going on in Washington, so that is
another one of my concerns. My third concern is EPA. What is going on with the
EPA? What will happen to the future to the EPA? How will we be protected if EPA
protections are pulled for Kaua`i's people? That is specifically targeted for me to the
Center for Disease Control (CDC), which would be sanitation, disease, protection for
the people, infectious disease funding, and enforcement for violations in health and
sanitation conditions, particularly in the ocean and on working farms.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anne, hold on. Is there anyone else wishing
to testify today? Seeing none, you can proceed with your second round of three (3)
minutes.
Ms. Punohu: Thank you. I did not see the red light. Sorry.
I just have to so much to say. On the north shore, a north shore high school, which
we have been fighting for over thirty (30) to forty (40) years now—we need that. We
need upgrading of our libraries in poor areas. We have a lovely library in Princeville,
but libraries in other areas are decrepit and need help. On housing and the homeless,
yes, I have a lot to say. I just heard recently that there may be some bed reductions
this month in our only shelter for the general public. There are shelters scattered
throughout the community for a specific niche types of people, but we need more
shelters in more communities where people are working and have their families, such
as Kapa'a and Waimea. We need that low-income housing, but everything has to
work together. I guess that is all I am going to say right now. I have a lot more to
say, but those are just the things that really strike me, is my big concerns are what
will happen in 2018 if we have the worst-case scenario. What is their game plan? I
would like to know it. Mahalo.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you, Anne. With that, I will call the
meeting back to other. I need a motion to receive this item.
Councilmember Kaneshiro moved to receive C 2017-177 for the record,
seconded by Councilmember Kagawa.
COUNCIL MEETING 36 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Any further discussion? Councilmember
Yukimura.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded
as follows:
Councilmember Yukimura: I really want to express my appreciation to
the Smith Dawson & Andrews firm, in particular, Jim and Mary, for their excellent
support of Kaua`i County in the arena of federal grants and federal legislation. I also
want to say that in some of these areas, I did not ask questions about funding, because
funding is not the critical piece until we have a good plan in place. First of all, it is
hard to get money without a good plan. If we should, by chance, get money without
a good plan, then we stand to often not use it in the most optimal way. There is no
comprehensive plan for addressing homelessness, to my knowledge, and that is why
it is hard to ask for money. We did have a homeless summit, but I have not seen any
follow-up. I do not know what plan there is for the program. We have piecemeal
projects here and there, but what we really need is a comprehensive long-range plan
for addressing this problem. That is primarily the responsibility of the
Administration. I hope that we will get such a plan soon, because then it is much
easier to get money for the plan and the implementation thereof. I think we saw the
concern at this table when the Holo Holo 2020 plan was mentioned because it is a
unilateral plan on the part of the Mayor, and it was at budget time that I spoke about
how much more powerful and effective we can be in our budget and in our work if we
could have a joint "Mayor-Council priority setting" for the County, where we were all
onboard on the same page. I think that is true...I think we have done well with what
we have, but we could do even better if we did have this congruence of Administration
and Council, and I really feel that the Mayor has the responsibility to include and
invite the Council in setting priorities. I might mention, because we have talked
about a county manager system, that if we did have a county manager system, it
would be the Council that sets the priority, and one of the things about that
government system is that it brings the Administration and the Council together.
You do not actually have the separation of powers. The Council sets the priorities
and the county manager would implement the priorities, so you would have this
congruence of goal-setting and action, I believe. We do not need the county manager
system if we have really good partnership between the Administration and the
Council and I think that is some area that we need to work on.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I really would like
to thank you so much for the wonderful presentation. I think we, as a state and as a
county, have been blessed to have had Senator Inouye while we did, and I can tell you
that people gave or may have had their own opinions on earmarks, but I would like
to remind people that the Pacific Missile Range Facility (PMRF) was an earmark, our
COUNCIL MEETING 37 AUGUST 9, 2017
beloved Kilauea Lighthouse, who was named after the late Senator, was an earmark
project; saving Hanalei Bridge from being double-lane was the work of Senator
Inouye. A lot of his fingerprints are still out there on our community, and even still
until this day, his actions still resonate through our community. There are still
projects on his books that are coming in front of our community. Now that the reality
is that we do not have Senator Inouye, we really rely on the relationships that
organizations and the public affairs company that you are bring to our table, and I
can tell you that a lot of people may think that the trips that we take to D.C. have no
result, but I can tell you that the results that come back as far as TIGER grants,
being able to maintain CDBG funding, being able to maintain any kind of HUD
program, are all of the works and collaboration between this County and folks like
you, so thank you very much. I do not think we need to have a county manager
system. I think what we just need to do is collaborate. I am not sure if there has ever
been any effort to reach out to the Administration and say, "Hey, we would like to sit
down and collaborate on priorities and present this legislative package or a list of
federal priorities." So that being said, I plan on, as the Economic Development &
Intragovernmental Relations Committee Chair, having that conversation to sit down
with the Office of the Mayor, sit down with the Administration, and bring some of our
top priorities to the table so that we have some voice when we are formulating this
type of plan. I just wanted to say once again, thank you so much. It is very obvious
that you are very in-touch with what is going on in Washington, D.C. and thank you
for all of your hard work. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else? If not, thank you
again for being here today. We did have some goal-setting sessions in the past and I
think it worked to some extent, as best as it can. You are always going to have the
differences. You have seven (7) independent people or individuals on this side and
you have the grand the "Grand Poobah" on that side and it is very hard at times. I
thought our efforts went as good as I think it has ever. Of course, there is always
room for improvement. It is just that it is hard because of the individuality of this
side of the aisle. We can always work to make that process better. We appreciate
what you folks do in D.C. It is hard work, frustrating work. I know this is an
especially difficult time with the transition of administrations. Whether good or bad
or whether you agree or disagree, at the end of the day, that is the administration
that we have to work with and we appreciate your continued efforts. Thank you very
much. How long are you folks here for by the way?
Mr. Smith: Until Friday.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Smith: Not long enough.
COUNCIL MEETING 38 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Members, you have until Friday, so set up
your meetings with them before they go home.
The motion to receive C 2017-177 for the record was then put, and unanimously
carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: Let us take a caption break for ten (10)
minutes.
There being no objections, the meeting recessed at 10:29 p.m.
The meeting reconvened at 10:43 a.m., and proceeded as follows:
Council Chair Rapozo: Can we have the next item, please?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Chair, this is on page number 2, C 2017-168.
C 2017-168 Communication (07/12/2017) from the Director of Economic
Development, requesting Council approval to apply for, receive, and expend funds
from the Hawai`i Community Foundation, in the amount of $50,000.00, and from
Partners for Places, in the amount of$50,000.00, for a total amount of $100,000.00,
for the development of a Climate Action Plan (CAP) for the County of Kaua`i:
Councilmember Kagawa moved to receive C 2017-168 for the record, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion? Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: I have a question for George.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. I will suspend the rules with no
objection. Mr. Costa.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
GEORGE K. COSTA, Director of Economic Development: Good morning,
Council Chair Rapozo and Honorable Councilmembers. For the record, George Costa,
Director of the Office of Economic Development.
Councilmember Kagawa: My question is, is the matching side from
Partners for Places for fifty thousand dollars ($50,000) still not available because it
reached a deadline?
COUNCIL MEETING 39 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Costa: That is correct. The deadline passed, but we
have another opportunity coming up in January. At this point, we intend to apply for
that again and come back to this body well before that to present a plan.
Councilmember Kagawa: The next time you come back, are you going to
disclose what the deadline is if there is a deadline? The last time, I think you
withheld that information, and then it went to Committee and the deadline came
upon us. I am okay with criticism, but if it is criticism and we do not know what the
deadline is, then to me, it is unfair criticism, because the normal process for any
approval or any rush for approval...normally, it comes to the Council and if we have
a lengthy discussion or debate on the issue, it goes to the Committee where we wait
for the Committee's approval. For that one, there were unanswered questions and
the Council wanted it go to Committee so that your leader in that effort, Ben, could
be there and answer the questions. But to hear that there was a deadline is kind of
disappointing.
Mr. Costa: In the future, I will absolutely be sure to
disclose the deadline because I know that takes precedent over anything else with
regards to approval.
Councilmember Kagawa: Yes, especially when it is one hundred
percent (100%) matching. I think Sandra Herndon mentioned something like us
being crazy, denying one hundred percent (100%) matching for something that is
important, and yes, it does sound crazy, but it would be nice for the legislative side to
know what the deadline is because I think we all look stupid, on both sides.
Mr. Costa: I agree. Even though there needed to be a lot
more information with regards to the grant, I think now knowing that there is a
deadline, that takes precedent over information and I am assuming that the body
would approve, and then come back later with the information just to make the
deadline.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other discussion? Councilmember
Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: George, is there a commitment on your
agency's part to give the Council all essential information?
Mr. Costa: Absolutely, yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: And hopefully a week prior to the item on the
agenda, because that would really help.
COUNCIL MEETING 40 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Costa: As I mentioned, this grant came at the last
minute, similar to the Transportation Alternatives Program (TAP) grant that came
at the last-minute. I know I went back to the transcripts to make sure what I said
on the floor was correct. There were concern about these last-minute grants. I now
know and realize that it does not matter if it is a last-minute grant. That should be
disclosed and I think the approval or the opportunity to apply would take precedent
and hopefully at some point we can come back with more information if it is a
last-minute request.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you. It was a last-minute funding
opportunity, but the plan to do a Climate Action Plan has been before the Council
three (3) times before in the budget sessions, so what went into a Climate Action Plan
and how it would be done with the community involvement. Those kinds of things
were not new, right?
Mr. Costa: That is correct. We presented that in 2016,
and 2017...
Councilmember Yukimura: So to put together a one-pager or to have it
available when the agenda item comes up was not something prohibited by the
last-minute nature of this particular grant, right?
Mr. Costa: No, there was an assumption on our part that
because we had come before this body several times in great detail, an assumption
that the body knew what we were asking for, but that was a poor assumption on our
part.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you. The one thing I have
learned from lobbying is to really watch your assumptions, because I have been
caught making assumptions that are not true, and then you lose the opportunity.
Mr. Costa: Absolutely.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you very much.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: I just wanted to comment that I do not think
that the deadline is more important than the information. This was the fourth time
we saw it and it got killed every single time. I voted no on it every single time because
I did not have the information. I just wanted to know what a Climate Action Plan
was, what some of the tangibles are that is going to come out of it, and maybe an
example of what we will see in the plan and we never ever got that. This was the
COUNCIL MEETING 41 AUGUST 9, 2017
fourth time. Then the only time we get it, it has already passed the deadline. If the
Administration is going to push a Climate Action Plan, then they should be prepared
to answer what is a Climate Action Plan and I do not think that is unreasonable on
our part. We have been getting lots of"hate mail" for not passing a plan when the
Administration could not even tell us what a Climate Action Plan was. I think that
is pretty unfair and pretty frustrating. If future grants come up, please provide us
with the information on what is the plan, what is the Climate Action Plan, or what is
any other plan you folks present up here, because we need to know what the plan is
to vote on it. I do not care when the deadline is. I am not going to vote on something
and not know what it is, and then say, "Oh, the deadline is here, so I am going to vote
on it, and then give me the information later." No, I want to know the information
and the deadline and all of the information we can possibly have at the time of our
decision to make the proper decision. That is just my comments.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: For me, I am just going to "beat the dead
horse." It is the same thing for me; all we asked basically was for a plan and that is
why we deferred it. We are still getting "hate mail" on it. I actually had a person
come up to me a couple of days ago and tell me that me that that was the best decision
we ever made by denying those moneys. So there are two (2) sides to that. For us,
an E-mail was sent out and it was unfair for us. We just wanted a plan, so I just want
to go on record saying that all we wanted was a plan. We did not know the deadline
was there. It expired by the time we got back. To me, it is unfair for all of that "hate
mail" we are getting on it. I also made a mistake...I thought these were funds that
were taxpayers' money, which I made a mistake; this was actually privately funded,
so I want to go on record saying that I misunderstood it. I thought we were getting
state or federal funds. Thank you.
Mr. Costa: Just for clarification, it was unfortunate that
Ben Sullivan, our Sustainability Energy Coordinator, was not able to attend. I tried
to present the information as best as I could. Looking back at some of the information
I did provide, it was not in the fashion that you received when you received Ben's
written notice. Again, a lot of the points were presented, but obviously I did not
communicate as well as Ben's written communication. So that is duly noted that we
probably could have helped the situation by bringing either a PowerPoint or
something in writing. That way, the thoughts that I had presented would be in
writing and maybe would have been more easily understood. To Councilmember
Kaneshiro's point, he was requesting for more information and I thought I was
presenting most of that, but it became apparent to me that there needed to be more
information and it was wrong on my part to assume that this is not going anywhere
and so the deadline, to me, did not matter, because the deadline...this was
Wednesday and the deadline was Monday. From that standpoint, I did not think it
was going to matter, but now I know and it is duly noted.
COUNCIL MEETING 42 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you, Chair. George, why was Ben not
available on that day?
Mr. Costa: What is that?
Councilmember Chock: Why was Ben not available?
Mr. Costa: He had a personal situation, so I was asked to
come and present.
Councilmember Chock: Okay. Did you meet with all Councilmembers
on this item in the last three (3) budgets and discuss the action plan and what it
meant or at least the contents of it?
Mr. Costa: I know I met with some of the
Councilmembers, but I am not sure if I met with everyone. I know Councilmember
Kawakami was not on the Council at the time, but I know we did meet with some
Councilmembers.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: I think the one thing that was clear was
because it had been presented in prior meetings and prior budgets and the fact that
it did not pass should have been an indicator to Mr. Sullivan that he needed to bring
some data, some facts. If it did not pass, obviously, it was not sufficient for the
Council to support. So to think that that would have changed without any
explanation, I think that was probably a mistake, but we live and we learn. George,
I do not put this on you at all because you are the Director of Economic Development
and your office basically is the placeholder for a lot of grant funds that come through,
and to expect you to be able to explain every single grant application in that office is
not possible. So please do not take it as a failure on your part. I think you did your
best to explain the best you could, but I think people want to hear it from the person
who is going to make it happen, in any case. I think that was the frustration. The
Administration wants this money—whether it is the Department of Public Works,
Department of Parks & Recreation or whoever—they should be here on a Wednesday.
If a personal situation comes up, then noting can be done about that. I think at that
point, the deadline probably should have been explained so that everybody would be
on the same page. I think what Councilmember Brun and Councilmember Kaneshiro
was talking about...had that been defined, the action may have been different...I do
COUNCIL MEETING 43 AUGUST 9, 2017
not know. It would have prevented a lot of stress. People took a lot of time to write
some very hurtful E-mails and Councilmembers had to sit back and read some of
those E-mails and all of that could have been avoided if, in fact, we took a different
course. That is why we are here; we are here to take those kinds of criticism. But in
all fairness, no one deserves that kind of criticism. Thank you. Anymore questions
for Mr. Costa? Go ahead.
Councilmember Kagawa: I would just like to add that it attracted so
much attention that I even had five (5) minutes of criticism from Robert Kekaula on
KITV4 News on that, and not having heard there was a deadline, to me, that would
have changed my vote and I would not even had made the news. Let us just get the
information, especially a deadline on free money. That should be the first sentence
of your presentation that there is a deadline, what the deadline is, and the
information on it. We left out the number one, main thing on that one, because it was
all free money. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anymore questions?
Mr. Costa: Can I just add to that? The first time we came
before this body on the Climate Action Plan, it was a one hundred eighty thousand
dollar ($180,000) request of County funds. We thought, one, because we were trying
to reduce the budget, so that was denied and maybe some of the information was not
provided. So the thought was to get a partner with some moneys to supplement the
County's ask. So we came back last year with the Hawai`i Community Foundation
and they stepped up to the plate with seventy-five thousand dollars ($75,000) and our
ask went from one hundred eighty thousand dollars ($180,000) to thirty thousand
dollars ($30,000), and that was denied, so we thought, "Okay, maybe if we can come
with funding completely from a non-County source, then that would have made it
better." We have come before this body to meet on other grant requests, other
projects, and it has not always been consistent. But the lesson was learned from this
process that no matter how big or small, it is always good to communicate with this
body, just to make sure that we are all on the same page. Even though we are under
time constraints, again, at least make the effort to reach out to the Council, even if it
is last minute. Thank you very much for understanding.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. It would not hurt, when you send
over the communication requesting the agenda time, that that should probably have
the grant application, as well as the expiration or the application deadline so that our
staff is aware so that they can inform us. Anyway, we will move on from this.
Mr. Costa: Okay.
COUNCIL MEETING 44 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone in the audience wishing to testify?
We will call the meeting back to order. Any further discussion? Councilmember
Yukimura.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded
as follows:
Councilmember Yukimura: I think we have learned a lot of things from
this particular agenda item and I would like to see if perhaps we can develop a format
for the Administration whenever there is a request for money. At least there should
be a clear statement about what is the goal to achieve with the money and how the
Administration is going to use the money to achieve that goal. That would be really
useful. I am even looking at today's agenda item and I hope that the information will
be provided for the Bryan Baptiste Sports Complex improvements, two million five
hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) and for the Captain Cook Memorial Park
improvements, one million dollars ($1,000,000). I would have loved to have a sheet
attached to this agenda explaining what it is going to be used for and how that money
is going to be used. Anyway, it might improve the process if we can make that clear
to the Administration what our expectations are. I just want to address this issue of
"hate mail." I know we received about fifty (50) E-mails and most of them really spoke
about the need for a Climate Action Plan and why it is important and I do not see
that it is "hate mail." There were some, what I consider inappropriate, remarks but
we have that on a lot of different items and I hope that overtime as a community that
we can learn that those are not really appropriate, that we want to talk about the
action, not about Councilmembers personally. I also think that if we had followed
proper parliamentary procedure, we would not have had the problem at all, because
we would not have voted on the main motion. We would have just referred it to
Committee and it would still be alive and we would not have had this action of voting
it down, and then referring it to the Committee, which I believe was not proper
parliamentary procedure. If we had followed it, then we would not have had the issue
at all.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? I try to be as civil as I can, but
there is always the little "push button" that really forces me to respond. Number one,
the "hate mail" was "hate mail." I do not care what Councilmember Yukimura says.
Remember that some of them reply to "all Councilmembers," which is what she sees.
Some of them were personally sent to Councilmembers. So you cannot speak for the
personal E-mail, one that calls you a "stupid beep"—I cannot even repeat it because
we are on camera. Why did they send these E-mails? It was because of an E-mail
that was sent out by Councilmember Yukimura. The focus of the E-mail was that
"four (4) Councilmembers voted down this action." That is what she put. I guess it
went to Civil Beat, Apollo Kaua`i, and everywhere, with a callout to contact these
four (4). So we got contacted. Some of us got contacted, and you can shake your head
all you want, because the E-mail is available if you want to see it. The reality is
COUNCIL MEETING 45 AUGUST 9, 2017
whether or not she thinks that parliamentary procedure was followed, I called our
parliamentarian, who is certified; we sent him to school and he got certified. I have
been doing this for fourteen (14) years and I kind of know the rule. The motion on
the floor was to approve; Councilmember Kagawa made the motion to approve.
Everything was going to go through. Councilmember Kagawa, in fact, suffered the
biggest brunt of this because he got television time with Robert Kekaula, calling him
basically a person that likes global warming or whatever, but anyway, it was
seconded, and Councilmember Kaneshiro had one question: "What are the
deliverables?" That question really was not answered to the satisfaction of many of
the members on the Council. So more and more questions ensued and it was very
clear at that point that some of the questions were not going to be answered. The
Council did not know that the deadline was coming up in a couple of days; no one told
the Council. The discussion started to move towards a referral to the Committee,
where we could have Ben Sullivan here with the answers. Everybody was fine with
that. Even at that point, no one told us, "Hey, you cannot do that because Monday is
the deadline and Wednesday is after Monday." So we had the discussion. I decided,
as the Chair, to take the vote on the motion to approve for one reason: in the event-
Councilmember Yukimura, stop shaking your head because that is very
disrespectful—I concluded or I decided that we are going to take the vote on the
motion to approve, in the event the four (4) votes were there to pass, because I did
not want to waste our staff's time on a referral to the Committee, which would put
our staff having to do all of the minutes for one more meeting...actually, two (2)
because then it would have to go to the full Council, like it is today. So I wanted to
try to vote first. If the motion to approve failed, which it did, then someone could
entertain or make a motion to refer to the Committee. That was what we did and
that is the Chair's prerogative. The motion to approve did fail and the subsequent
motion to refer to the Committee was passed and it ended up in the Committee, only
to find out that the Administration had requested that we receive it because the
deadline had passed. That is what happened. Now, the E-mail does not say any of
that. The E-mail from Councilmember Yukimura just says, "Four (4) people voted it
down and you need to remind them that this is important," Civil Beat got ahold of
that and Civil Beat, of course, printed that we voted down, which simply is not the
case. Simply, it was a procedural thing to get to the motion. If it passed, we would
not be here today. I do not know how people are going to vote. I think it was unfair.
I think when a Councilmember sends out an E-mail like that to encourage the public
to go after specific Councilmembers, then I think that is not cool either. But you have
the freedom to do that. I responded...I did not respond to all of them. Some of them
honestly were not deserving of a response, they were so nasty. But the ones that I
felt were respectful, I did respond, and I explained to them what I just explained to
all of you and they responded and said, "Thank you for the clarification." Some of
them honestly, why waste my ink on my computer? Mine does have ink.
Councilmember Chock.
COUNCIL MEETING 46 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Chock: Chair, I just feel inclined why I should express
why I did vote for it, because there are a lot of reasons being said of why it was not.
I did have a chance to meet in previous budgets with the team of George and Ben and
we have spent some significant time together on what is this Climate Action Plan, so
I did feel more comfortable, I guess, at that point to support it with some of the details.
I would agree that it was not well represented at this Council and for this Council,
along with other mistakes that occurred in this process for it. There are a lot of
lessons to be learned, in terms of the date and the clarity. I think that having it in
writing also made a bigger difference and I would encourage that that occurs next
time. I will caution, as I have in the last meeting though, that if people are not here,
and this seems not to be the case with Ben Sullivan in this case, but if they are not
showing here because they are not the right people to represent it for this body, then
that is an issue and I would discourage that kind of activity to occur in the future.
Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: In the E-mail that I sent out, all I said is that
the majority of the Council voted against this private funding of the Climate Action
Plan. I also said that the Administration did a poor job of presenting the plan and I
also said that by a parliamentary quirk, the matter was nonetheless referred to
Committee. All of that, I believe, was accurate. I included a link to the Council
Meeting so that people could actually see what happened. I do not think my E-mail
was inaccurate in any way. I did say that because it was in the Committee, there was
a chance to tell the Council if you thought the Climate Action Plan was important, so
please show up at Committee. I do not think I said that they should attack four (4)
Councilmembers, and I condemn any personal attacks on Councilmembers. I do not
believe it is respectful and I believe the Council deserves respect. I also do not think
it is effective, because nobody is going to listen to you if you are disrespectful. I also
want to say that I was the one who made a motion to refer to Committee after hearing
the Chair recommend that it be moved to Committee, and Councilmember Brun
expressed an interest in making that motion, and so did the Vice Chair. But the
Chair insisted on taking a vote first on the main motion. If we had followed
parliamentary procedure and referred the matter to Committee before the main vote
was taken on the main motion, which was, I believe wrong, parliamentary, then we
would not have everyone talking about the Council voting against funding for a
Climate Action Plan. If we had followed parliamentary procedure, there would have
been no talk about the Council being against a Climate Action Plan, which shows the
value of parliamentary procedure that it sets motions in order so that you take care
of first things first and you get information. That is why we referred it to Committee.
One thing that none of us knew was that the deadline would be passed by the time
we sent it to Committee, and all of us did not know that until the following meeting,
and that could have changed the vote, but that was not due to any action by any
Councilmember on the Council.
COUNCIL MEETING 47 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: Getting back to parliamentary procedure, it
did not matter, even if we followed procedure, because it still expired on Monday, so
when it went to Committee, it still expired and we still would not have gotten it. So
it does not matter about the parliamentary procedure. In the E-mail, it did not say
"majority of the Council"—it said, "Brun, Kagawa, Kaneshiro, and Rapozo." It
basically said our names that we voted against it.
Councilmember Yukimura: That was the fact.
Councilmember Brun: I think you had your twenty (20) minutes
already, I think you are good.
Council Chair Rapozo: Stop. Go ahead, Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: I just suggested to the Administration,
because I know we get it from Planning and we get it from Housing...anytime they
come up here and ask for money or they are asking for something, we always meet
with them first and they brief us on it so that we know what is going on and we are
not coming here, like we did that week, where we had no clue. For me, I have been
here only for six (6) months...eight (8) months, now with Councilmember Kawakami,
so we never met about this and I had no clue what the plan was. People were talking
about that they have been here for four (4) years and it still does not have a plan, so
it would have helped to meet first. I know you tried yesterday, but I know it already
came and went on the funds, but just a suggestion to all Administration to meet with
us first, talk story, and then when you come here, we can get most of our questions
out of the way. We are not in a match the whole day. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you. I think the silver lining in all of
this is that it really reemphasizes the need for effective communication. Let us face
it—ninety-nine percent (99%) of conflicts out there are because of a lack of
communication. I figure since we are all rehashing the issue, I would like to just
reemphasize why I supported this Climate Action Plan. I know Director Costa came
up and said that we had not met on it, but that does not mean that I do not know or
understand the importance of addressing climate change on multi levels. When I
first got my start at KIUC, I was the chairman of strategic planning where we had
taken coal off of the table that at one time wanted to introduce coal as a fuel source
for Kaua`i. At the time, Chairman Esaki, myself, and a few other directors felt that
it was not in-line with our strategic plan, which we set the goal above and beyond
what the State was asking for, for fifty percent (50%) renewable. I tip my hats off to
COUNCIL MEETING 48 AUGUST 9, 2017
KIUC because they are actually doing it. At the end of the day, we all make decisions
and we are elected to be the lightning rod for our constituents, whether they are
happy or they are angry. This is the beauty of democracy and the freedom of speech.
People have fought and died for our country to be able to explain and express. Even
though I do not agree with it and I do not agree with the lack of civility, it is still a
silver line to say that in this great country, people can express themselves freely
without the fear of retaliation. For that, although I do not agree, I still think that it
is one of the reasons why I am very proud to be an American. At the end of the day,
I think that we have January, we have a second whack at this thing. There is not
much opportunities where we get offered "free money." In this case, it is unique
because half of that money, or specifically two (2) donors, that had specifically said,
"We want the County of Kaua`i to take this money for these purposes." With that
being said, Mr. Chair, I think that we have learned a lot. It will make us stronger as
a Council and as an Administration, as far as being able to communicate and as far
as being able to show up to the meeting to say that this is a top priority. We have a
lot of time to get some of those unanswered questions answered, so we should move
forward and start gearing up for that second round. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Council Chair Rapozo: The other thing I failed to mention, and I did
last week, was that these granting authorities...they asked the Honolulu City Council
and their Administration the dilemma they are in with their granting authorities
with the federal government on rail—if you cannot do what you say you are going to
do then you run into problems. Maybe people think this is small money, but it is not;
not for our County. Hawai`i Community Foundation was sitting right in the audience,
and as I said that, we do not want to destroy that relationship with them because
they are a very generous organization that can help us going forward, and the last
thing you want is to commit to funding and not be able to comply with the needs of
the grant. That is another concern.
The motion to receive C 2017-168 for the record was then put, and unanimously
carried.
C 2017-178 Communication (07/14/2017) from the Director of Finance,
requesting Council approval to accept and expend appropriations of $3,500,000.00
which has been provided to the County of Kaua`i in the Supplemental Appropriations
Act of 2017 – Act 49, Session Laws of Hawai`i 2017 from the State of Hawai`i, for
Appropriation Warrant No. 223 for the following projects:
• Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex Improvements -
$2,500,000.00; and
• Captain Cook Memorial Park Improvements - $1,000,000.00.
COUNCIL MEETING 49 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kagawa moved to approve C 2017-178, seconded by
Councilmember Kawakami.
Council Chair Rapozo: I will suspend the rules for the
Administration.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Councilmember Kagawa: I am familiar with these projects and I thank
our Kaua`i delegation for putting these into their budget and I hope that the Governor
will release these funds, especially for the Waimea High School park, which is called
the "Captain Cook Memorial Park." The grandstand is a safety hazard and is ready
to fall and somebody will get hurt if we do not clear it up soon. Hopefully Lenny can
provide some clarification on this free money for County-owned facilities and I do not
see why we would have any hesitation in supporting this approval. Go ahead, Lenny.
Please give us a brief overview.
LEONARD A. RAPOZO, JR., Director of Parks and Recreation: Good
morning, Council. For the record, Director of Parks and Recreation, Lenny Rapozo.
As Councilmember Kagawa has already alluded to, the appropriations are for two (2)
projects, one is at the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex, to enhance the spectator
experience at the stadium. Through feedback from the Kaua`i Interscholastic
Federation (KIF) users, they feel that we need to improve the spectator experience
there. So what we are in contract with AECOME is in the planning and development
of raising the bleachers, moving the bleachers back, and putting in a new announcer
score booth Public Address (PA) system and additional Americans with Disabilities
Act (ADA) walkways as part of it, and we expect to expend close to two million five
hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) for these improvements. This would enhance
the spectators, in that currently if you were to attend a high school football game,
spectators are at the ground level and players and coaches are there, so they cannot
really see. This would move it up and bring it back to be as close, minimum as what
you have at Hanapepe Stadium. That is one project. The Waimea High School
baseball field, as Councilmember Kagawa has said, the baseball field is in need of
repair. The grandstand in the back of it should be condemned and removed, put in
bathrooms, and a comfort station. Really, if you go to home plate and you look
towards the backstop, I think it is off to one side, for those of you who have played
there and umpired there. All of these improvements would be made and we expect
the plans to be about two hundred thousand dollars ($200,000) and construction to
be about eight hundred thousand dollars ($800,000) for there.
Councilmember Kagawa: Lenny, for the baseball stadium, I think the
Kaua`i delegation is willing to appropriate more funds, should it need be, in the
second phase.
COUNCIL MEETING 50 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: We are going to totally redo the whole field,
not just the baseball section, right? We are looking at possibly improving the whole
field.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: They use it for football practice and it is in
need of severe upgrading.
Mr. Rapozo: Correct. Hopefully when Waimea does have
their baseball tournament, that could be an option for them to use as a playing field.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: So is the baseball field grandstand not
historic?
Mr. Rapozo: It is historic, but it is also a safety issue.
Councilmember Brun: So you would be able to break it down?
Mr. Rapozo: We would have to, yes.
Councilmember Brun: Yes, it is a hazard. For Kapa`a, you are going
to put in a bigger announcer's booth?
Mr. Rapozo: Yes, so we are looking to do exactly what we
did at Hanapepe.
Councilmember Brun: Perfect.
Mr. Rapozo: Initially, the intent, when they redid the field,
had good intentions, but not real practical in terms of the user's preference of a
football experience.
Councilmember Brun: Yes, because it is really small and when we do
the livestream, we have to do it from the bleachers; we cannot even go into the
announcer's booth because there is no room up there.
Mr. Rapozo: Right.
COUNCIL MEETING 51 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Brun: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: But that is when Councilmember Brun goes
inside. When Councilmember Kagawa and I go in, we fit perfectly fine.
Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: The improvements sound very good. Do you
have a breakdown of the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex improvements?
Mr. Rapozo: Yes, I do.
Councilmember Yukimura: Do you have it here?
Mr. Rapozo: Sure.
Councilmember Yukimura: Can you just circulate that?
Mr. Rapozo: Sure.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura, right on the back
sheet of the communication, he has the...it looks like recycled paper because there is
the line across, but...
Councilmember Yukimura: Oh, I see. It breakdowns in terms of design
and construction, but you do not have per ADA improvements and how much that
would be.
Mr. Rapozo: I have it right here.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you.
Mr. Rapozo: It is approximate.
Councilmember Yukimura: This is what I was looking for. Thank you
very much. I have to confess that I was not clear—I thought that the Captain Cook
Memorial Park was the one that is in town...
Mr. Rapozo: I think we all did.
Councilmember Yukimura: In the state legislation, is the Waimea High
School baseball field also called the "Captain Cook Memorial Park?"
COUNCIL MEETING 52 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Rapozo: The Captain Cook Memorial Park is the
baseball field.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay.
Mr. Rapozo: That is the official name. Growing up, we
have all known it to be as Waimea High School athletic field or whatever, but it is
really the official name.
Councilmember Yukimura: Which is the Captain Cook Memorial Park.
What is the little triangular park downtown called?
Mr. Rapozo: Hofgard.
Councilmember Yukimura: Of course. Thank you for the clarification and
breakdown. Also, thank you to the state legislation, in particular, Representative
Morikawa, who I am sure was instrumental in this.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: Just one more question, Lenny. I realize that
like for Kapa'a High School, I think the ball field is under the State's jurisdiction, like
the Ron Martin field. At Kapa'a High School, we have a caretaker that has a
lawnmower, mows it, and maintains it. They do not ask for County help...it is owned
by the State and I get that, but at Waimea, I believe they said that they do not have
anybody to mow it. For me, I guess I have always been under the impression that
they have the authority to dictate the use. So they do maintain it. What is it going
to be going forward? Are we going to provide them with routine maintenance or are
we already doing that and we are just going to keep on doing that?
Mr. Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa, for years I thought
that was a State facility, but I always was curious because I know that the tennis
courts is a County facility. It was not only until recently that I found out it is a County
park, but for years, Waimea High School maintained it and they no longer have the
capabilities to maintain it. You know Waimea and the great pride that they have and
everything, so I talked to our caretakers at Waimea Canyon Middle School of what
would it take to take this thing on? Do we need more manpower or more equipment?
The caretaker said, "Boss, we have it." The current staff that takes care of Waimea
Canyon Middle School has committed to take on that responsibility as well. Once we
get it to the level to fix it up, like you said, take care of the holes, make it all leveled,
and get the grass to where we want it to be, then they will maintain it.
COUNCIL MEETING 53 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Councilmember
Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Chairman. So we are still going
to be awaiting, after our approval, the Governor's release on these funds?
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Kawakami: Yes. So we can all do our part by supporting
the project and perhaps getting some word to the Governor and his staff.
Mr. Rapozo: This allows us, once you approve that for our
parks, we can start our diligence to get it ready to do the work, that once it is released,
we can move to construct, or destruction in this case, as well as construct and improve
it and not wait for the release of money. In parks, we like to be much more proactive,
so as soon as we have the money in-hand, we can move to procure what we need to
do.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: Are we playing any games in Kapa'a this
year?
Mr. Rapozo: Not KIF. The KIF has felt that that facility
does not suit them; that is what part of the enhancements that we are doing. Pop
Warner Football, as well as Kaua`i Youth Football (KYF), continues to use the facility
and finds the facility good.
Councilmember Brun: So if we make all of these changes, will that
suit Kapa'a High School?
Mr. Rapozo: I have gotten assurances and our consultants
have met with Kapa'a High School and they have gotten the assurances that they
will have these games there.
Councilmember Brun: Okay. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Those were the exact same questions I was
going to ask because I know that the high schools do not play at that field because of
safety. I know we have had that discussion and it is a safety issue when you have
COUNCIL MEETING 54 AUGUST 9, 2017
those young men...the bleachers are right up to the field. It is not safe, especially in
the ADA area where they would put those wheelchairs. It is just very, very unsafe.
I heard you say that you are going to move everything back, so it is going to be the
same as Hanapepe Stadium.
Mr. Rapozo: Just about the same as Hanapepe.
Council Chair Rapozo: Just about?
Mr. Rapozo: On the north end, we are working with the
parking lot. We do not want to take away from the parking lot. So for that one
section, we will move it back as far as we can, but for the most part, everyplace else
is going to be about the same as what we have in Hanapepe.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Rapozo: Since we are on the subject, we have reached
out, we have commitments from the Department of Hawaiian Homelands (DHHL)
that they have committed to portions of the property across the street for additional
parking for football and graduation, which has the biggest crowds. At some point, we
will be back here in our Department of Parks and Recreation budget to ask for more
so that we can improve the parking across the street. DHHL has committed to us to
have a right-of-entry to use that. We are also working with the business over there,
which he has been very accommodating to wanting to see that, because he does have
a lease with DHHL.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. My last question is going to be vital
because it is going to determine how I vote on this, because I fully support this, but I
do not support spending two million five hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) at
the stadium, and then the high school is not going to play. We are doing these
improvements really for KIF.
Mr. Rapozo: Right.
Council Chair Rapozo: So I want your assurance that we go through
with this two million five hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) of improvements,
which I fully support, because I think that is where it belongs, that that is their only
option.
Mr. Rapozo: I have the verbal commitment, and you folks
know how I operate, my word is golden, and I take everybody else's word the same. I
have a verbal commitment because we have engaged them, Kapa'a High School, in
this whole process that they will play there if these improvements are made.
COUNCIL MEETING 55 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Right, but I guess what I am saying is that let
us say the improvements are made, they have a new athletic director and a new coach
and they say, "We are not playing there"—it is still under your direction to say yes or
no. In other words, you make that field available as their only field. This is a lot of
money that we are investing in.
Mr. Rapozo: I agree.
Council Chair Rapozo: I have heard, "Why are you folks spending so
much money on a park?" Well, because it is needed. I do not want to go through with
this and find out that we did nothing but improve the Pop Warner stadium; nothing
against Pop Warner, but two million five hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) is a
lot of money. I guess that is the commitment I am looking for from you, which is that
this field will be built and Kapa'a High School will be playing on that.
Mr. Rapozo: From myself and the Mayor, Kapa'a will be
playing there.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I concur with the Chair. I think all of us
would not want to see two million five hundred thousand dollars ($2,500,000) spent,
and then not have the KIF games there. Can you at least get it in writing?
Mr. Rapozo: I can ask.
Council Chair Rapozo: It is in writing right now, on the floor.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes, with the agenda.
Councilmember Yukimura: Well, this is not the entity that makes the
decision about playing those games there, so I think we need it from the KIF people
or whoever makes the decision that the games will be played there.
Mr. Rapozo: From the County, if you are looking for
leverage, we can say that they cannot play at Vidinha.
Councilmember Yukimura: Well, I do not think we are wanting to play
this warring game. I think we are wanting whatever is best for the kids and the
program. I think just getting something in writing will be helpful.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
COUNCIL MEETING 56 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you. When we first conceived of this
stadium expansion, which I think was a really great idea, and it is called "Bryan J.
Baptiste Sports Complex" because it was former Mayor Baptiste who really
spearheaded this—was it our intention to have KIF games played there?
Mr. Rapozo: My understanding is that it was former
Mayor Baptiste's intention, and when the stadium opened, although I was not
working for the County, but my role as a football official, that was a big factor in
there. Because of history of what had happened there, there was some question as to
whether or not we wanted to go back to that stadium. But it was former Mayor
Baptiste's intention to bring football back to Kapa'a at all levels.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes. I guess the question is when we actually
implemented it, why did we not make sure that it was safe for KIF games?
Mr. Rapozo: I would not have that answer. Like I said, at
the time, I was not part of the County. That happened maybe about five (5) years
prior to me working in the County.
Councilmember Yukimura: Right. I am not trying to criticize you or
anybody else; I am just talking about the process by which we embark on planning
and construction of fields. If that was our initial goal, then why did everything we
did in creating it not make sure that we would achieve our goal?
Mr. Rapozo: I do not have an answer for that question
because I was not involved in the process at that time.
Councilmember Yukimura: But in the plans that you are now responsible
for, I am taking it that you do make sure what the goal is to make sure that whatever
we are doing is going to meet the goal.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: Lenny, as I recall, the head coach that did not
want to play at the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex is no longer there at Kapa`a, so
possibly that has changed it...
Mr. Rapozo: Actually, Councilmember Kagawa, when I sat
on this chair, from day one that I walked on that field, I saw problems with that field.
I was not in a position to make a difference. I did bring it up to the people who were
COUNCIL MEETING 57 AUGUST 9, 2017
running the Department of Parks & Recreation or the Department of Public Works,
at that time, what I thought and it did not really change. So when I became the
Director, and the Mayor and I, of course, we love football and we love high school
sports and the kids and that is why we do what we outside of work, I saw the
opportunity to improve the field. I started the initiative or our department and this
administrator started the initiative of improving the field and it is unfortunate to me
that the coach at that time really took it and threw us under the bus...threw the
County under the bus or threw me under the bus, but we were in the process of
making those improvements, because for instance, you have forty (40) sprinkler
heads in the middle of that field—that is a great idea to irrigate the field, but you
cannot be running football players with sprinkler heads on the field, because what is
going to happen if they fall? They are going to get hurt. So we improved it, and with
your folks help. We have six (6) agricultural type of tie-ins along this thing where we
can irrigate the whole field, but safety improved. We put out a one percent (1%) crown
now that soccer can also play on, if they choose, but it works for both football and
soccer. So we made improvements to the locker room. That is the initiative that we
started because we could see the improvements. I would not want to say that it was
because of the coach, but I think we came here and we saw that we could improve the
experience. At least for the kids of Kapa`a, we wanted the same type of facility that
the kids of Lihu`e and the kids on the west side have in Hanapepe. That is our whole
thing. Then it has morphed into what we have today.
Councilmember Kagawa: I guess the second question is, what is our
plan with trying to increase the amount of night games? We talk about what stadium
would be better for Kapa'a to host their home games, I know that the lack of having
night football games for the last six (6) games of their season is the primary driver of
what kills the crowd and the attraction.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: We obviously have been there and saw that
when Kapa'a has night football games, the crowds are tremendous and obviously it is
much easier for Athletic Director Gonsalves to run his food booth closer to his home
of Kapa`a, rather than bringing all of his stuff to Vidinha. It is just a "win-win" for
the Kapa'a community and home games to host there, but I think the lack of night
football games, for them, it makes it seem like it does not matter where we play,
because if we play during the day, there is no crowd anyway, right?
Mr. Rapozo: Myself, with the County Attorney and our
policy team, have met and he had an important meeting last week Friday and they
are working on something this week to try to see what the possibilities of increasing
that for this season and the Mayor and I, as well as the rest of our staff, and I am
sure you folks will be fully supporting something like that, are working very hard and
COUNCIL MEETING 58 AUGUST 9, 2017
diligently, as quickly as possible, to make it happen and to at least try to start this
year if we can.
Councilmember Kagawa: So we are possibly looking at expanding more
than what we have had in the past.
Mr. Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you, Chair.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anymore questions for the
Director? If not, thank you. Any registered speakers?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Chair, we have one (1) registered speaker,
Anne Punohu.
Ms. Punohu: Aloha Council, Anne Punohu. I flagged this
right away when I got the agenda this morning, not because I do not agree with this,
it is great, but something that has not been brought up, which I was waiting to hear
if it got brought up and because it did not, I want to bring it up, but I used to live
right next door to the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex. He is a personal friend of
mine and I think that Bryan would have been really sad to see the amount of
vandalism that occurred in that park. It was truly oppressive, depressing, and just
awful. What I want to make sure happens this time around with three million five
hundred thousand dollars ($3,500,000) of funds being appropriated and spent for this
is that the type of materials and things we are going to have in place to prevent
vandalism of the improvements to both of the parks, especially to the bathrooms. I
know that in the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex, it was destruction on the fence
line and there was spray painting on the concrete. It was really, really bad. We have
to look at the fact that we have an increase in population and an increase in
vandalism on Kaua`i and I just harken back to when we had that beautiful bathroom
and facility at Lydgate, which got set on fire as soon as it got built and destroyed the
next day. So I think that is something that we should keep in mind with the
improvements is, what are we going do to prevent vandalism and also to prevent
neglect and make sure that upkeep stays appropriate? For me, it is a matter of
materials. What kind of materials is going to be used for the bathroom? Is there
going to be the kind of materials that would prevent people from inking things up
and being able to clean it off? Is the fence line going to be less destructible? You folks
get what I am saying. Thank you. I know that Lenny and the Mayor would never
not let KIF play there. These are big football folks. I trust Lenny and his word
because I would be scared to go against Lenny and go against my word to Lenny. I
would run under the desk, and you know me, I am tough. They will get the KIF folks
there. Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 59 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else from the public? If not, I will call
the meeting back to order. Just for Anne's information, there are no restrooms that
are going to be built. This is just removal of the bleachers and announcers' booth,
replacing that, and fixing the ADA walkways. I think Lenny heard you loud and
clear. This is happening all over the State; vandalism is a problem. Any further
discussion? Councilmember Kawakami.
There being no further testimony, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I would like to
thank the Department of Parks & Recreation and our Kaua`i delegation, like Senate
President Kouchi, Representative Morikawa, Representative Nakamura, and
Representative Tokioka, who are up there at the legislature looking for collaborative
ways to work with the County. I know that they get criticized time and time again,
but let me remind you that they have always seek partnerships with the County,
whether it is providing appropriations for our bus stops, our eight hundred (800)
megahertz Motorola radio upgrades for public safety, our Veteran's Cemetery and
now for the Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex and Captain Cook park. For Kapa'a
High School, they deserve a home field that they can play on. I cannot tell you, as a
former athlete, not as good as I would like to be, but just the advantage that you have
when you play in your own hometown. It is such an advantage. For these kids that
are out there playing, they deserve nothing less than what is appropriate for them to
play on, so I really would encourage that Kapa'a High School utilize this home field
to their advantage with the improvements. To our Kaua`i delegation, thank you very
much for the work for sending money to our counties. I know it is not easy. The
process to get money at the legislature is not easy. Every year, you have a certain
cap on appropriations and that cap can evaporate real quickly if you not up there
doing your job. So for the work that they have done to be able to send some extra
money our way, mahalo nui loa. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: I want to thank our delegation and thank you
to the Department of Parks and Recreation. This was really needed. For us sports
fans, this is good news to our ears these Bryan J. Baptiste Sports Complex
improvements. Also, I am a graduate of Waimea High School. I remember when I
was in high school that they had the Waimea High School tournament right there at
the park and we used to get let out of class early so that we could watch the baseball
games. We still have games there once in a while, but it is real dangerous. Nobody
can sit in the grandstand. I am really excited and really happy that we are working
on improving these parks. Thank you folks. Let us get it done and let us get more
night football. Thank you.
COUNCIL MEETING 60 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you, Chair. First of all, I would like to
thank Lenny and the Kaua`i delegation up at the legislature for working with us on
the Waimea School baseball field improvements and grandstand. I would like to
thank Guy Ishihara and Athletic Director Jon Kobayashi. They brought forth to me
the need to do it and in talking with Lenny, we decided that we are going to try and
work with the legislature and basically we are accomplishing this without using
County moneys. We have a second chance in the next session to have another one
million five hundred thousand dollars ($1,500,000). They want to redo the whole
field. It is in very bad shape. Again, I think it is only appropriate that the State does
fund it. They are the ones that primarily use it. They do not have their own stadium
or field like many other schools on the other neighbor islands. On Kaua`i, a lot of our
schools use our County facilities; that is the way it has been. It is really nice when
the State kicks in their share, especially when they are using it primarily. That is a
good partnership. As far as Kapa`a, we did a lot of improvements to the locker rooms.
They have beautiful locker rooms. When the high school did not use that field as we
had hoped, partly because I think I heard issues like they felt that the bleachers were
too close in proximity to the coaches and the players. I do not know if now adding
some height is going to provide some distance of relief, but I think the coaches did not
appreciate having the extra coaches in the stands talking to their players and
coaches. Hopefully, they can resolve some of those issues. I think the better way
would just be a little bit of communication, as Councilmember Kawakami said,
between parents and coaches to make sure that they police themselves. At the end
of the day, when we grew up playing, Lenny knows of all of the community parks we
had in Kekaha and Koloa that we played games. The fans were right here by the
players and we got along and we played some great football. It seems now that we
need to establish those lines between coaches and parents that during games, the
communication is a rule that should not be broken. Let the coaches coach. We have
to get back to that instead of trying to accommodate by moving things around. I think
we can work in better harmony that way. Surely, I would hope that Athletic Director
Gonzalves, once he sees how much effort we are putting in to improving this, that he
would make the overriding decision that letting his team and his spectators view
games in their hometown is going to be much better than having them use Vidinha
as their home field. I am confident that they will be using it once we make these
upgrades, because it would be really senseless to have that nice locker room and the
nice improvement and then they not use it. That would be totally be a waste of time
and effort. I think Representative Nakamura has put her efforts into it and Senator
Kouchi has put his backbone in it. Let us all work together to make sure that Kapa'a
High School does use it all of the time. Thank you, Chair.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
COUNCIL MEETING 61 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: From the discussion today, it appears that
these improvements are truly improvements to two (2) facilities that are really
important to both the players and the public. I am happy to support it and I do want
to thank the Kaua`i delegation, Senator Kouchi and Representatives Nakamura,
Tokioka, and Morikawa, and our Director of Parks and Recreation Lenny Rapozo. It
sounds like, Vice Chair, that we should also thank you for the Waimea High School
baseball improvements. I also want to thank the Director of Parks and Recreation
for consulting with the high school KIF entities. It seems to me that when we are
designing facilities with the intention that KIF would be the users that we would
consult with them and make sure that the field will meet their specifications. It
appears that we did not do that in the first round, but at least we are doing it here. I
am glad that we are setting such a precedent in terms of how we plan our projects so
that we consult with the users and design the facilities and ensure that the
construction of the facilities meet the needs of the users. Good work all around and
I look forward to seeing the improvements done. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other comments? If not, I will just close
by saying, thank you, Lenny, and your team, for doing this. I know that we have been
talking about this for a long time and I did want to say that back at the original
design, it was designed to the specs that we wanted at the time. It is like when you
go to the car dealership and they offer you a car with air condition or without air
condition and you cannot afford to run air condition, so you buy the one without, and
then six (6) months later, you want to trade it in because you want the air condition
back. It is kind of what happened, and it worked, until we had one (1) coach that
said, "Hey, this is not safe for my players." I agreed with that coach because it was
very close. It was not so much the people yapping from the audience, but it was really
when these kids come running...you know this, Lenny, you were on the field when
we saw an accident the other night with Brian. He was down for a while. So it is
dangerous when you have these big folks coming around the corner. Hopefully this
will alleviate that problem. Kapa'a had that reputation, because that one lady hit
the referee with an umbrella decades ago, and that stigma has stayed. As I sit at the
different fields, and Lenny, you know this more than anybody that they yell, swear,
and cuss out the officials and they cuss out their own coaches and they even yell at
the players. So Kapa'a has a stigma, but it happens at all three (3) stadiums. My
point goes to what Councilmember Kawakami was saying earlier, which is that every
school and every team has a right to play in their home field and we have to make
sure that the facilities are adequate. In this case, thank you to the State for making
this happen. Councilmember Kawakami was probably there when this process
started. I guess it did not happen this year...I am assuming this all started when
Councilmember Kawakami was still at the legislature, so thank him for that.
Remember that the KIF is State and not the County, so this partnership here is how
it is supposed to be, split the maintenance and we split the whole plan so that we can
allow our kids to play. It is a big part of our community, so thank you. I forgot to ask
you what the timeline is. I am hoping that we can get this done before next season.
COUNCIL MEETING 62 AUGUST 9, 2017
I am not going to bring you back up to ask you that, but I am hoping we can get this
done sooner than later. The motion is approve.
The motion to approve C 2017-178 was then put, and unanimously carried.
C 2017-179 Communication (07/17/2017) from the Prosecuting Attorney,
requesting Council approval to receive and expend State funds, in the amount of
$222,628.00, to be used towards funding one (1) Full-Time Equivalent (FTE) Deputy
Prosecuting Attorney and partial fringe benefits for the Career Criminal Prosecution
Unit, and to indemnify the State of Hawai`i Department of the Attorney General:
Councilmember Kagawa moved to approve C 2017-179, seconded by Councilmember
Yukimura.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve C 2017-179 was then put, and unanimously carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: Next item, please.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: On page number 3, C 2017-180.
C 2017-180 Communication (07/18/2017) from the Director of Economic
Development, requesting Council approval to apply for, receive, and expend State of
Hawai`i Department of Labor and Industrial Relations (DLIR) funds, in the amount
of $6,000.00, which will be used in addition to the original $30,000.00 that was
already approved by the Council to complete the work with the Department of
Education (DOE) — Natural Resources Pathway and Future Farmers of America
(FFA) programs at Kaua`i, Kapa`a, and Waimea High Schools, provide summer
internship programs for students to work on Kaua`i farms, ranches, and
agriculture-related businesses: Councilmember Kaneshiro moved to approve
C 2017-180, seconded by Councilmember Kagawa.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Chair, we have one (1) registered speaker.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. Do you want to hear from the
Administration first?
COUNCIL MEETING 63 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: I have one question.
Council Chair Rapozo: I am sorry? You have a question for George?
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. I will suspend the rules. Let us get
them first, and then we will open it up for public testimony. Do you have a question,
Councilmember Kaneshiro?
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Yes. I was just going to ask George...I know
we approved the money, but if you could just explain some of the successes of the
program. Obviously, we met on this already, so I know about the request, but maybe
if you could just highlight the success of the program and just describe the program
and how successful it was.
Mr. Costa: Thank you. Aloha, Council Chair Rapozo and
Honorable Councilmembers. For the record, George Costa, Director of the Office of
Economic Development. Basically, the request for the six thousand dollars ($6,000)
is because of the success of the program. When we first were planning for this early
on, the first year we entered into this program, we had two (2) students from Kaua`i
High School. Last year, I believe we had twelve (12) students. Our goal was to get
all three (3) high schools involved. At the time we started this, I did not realize that
only Kaua`i High School had a Future Farmers of America program. When I went to
high school, all of the high schools had a program. Since then, Principle Mahina
Anguay at Waimea and Daniel Hamada at Kapa'a have vowed to really try to build
up their programs again so that they can be certified for FFA. Along with that, the
Department of Labor and the State legislature wanted to get our students involved
with an internship program and experience working in various farms, ranches, and
agriculture-related. This past year, to his credit, Principal Hamada hired a graduate
right out of Oregon State University; she is originally from Maui, Kylie Hashizaki,
who alone recruited twenty-nine (29) freshman to join the program. It really shows
the interest out there, and not only by the students, because I have gotten a lot of
good E-mails and texts from parents whose students were involved. On top of that,
it really shows that our farmers, ranchers, and ag-related companies really look
forward to this program. They embrace the students and the students embrace them
and I really cannot describe how successful this program was. Obviously, we did not
have enough money, so the original program that was supposed to be six (6) weeks, I
had to reduce it to five (5) weeks because I really did not want to turn any of the
students that were interested away. So we reduced it to five (5) weeks and we still
needed more money, so I asked the State Department of Labor if they did have money.
So verbally, they have committed. Now, I just approval to apply for those funds. The
students go through each of their high school's payroll, so basically the money that
the Department of Labor provides the County, we in-turn grant it back to each high
COUNCIL MEETING 64 AUGUST 9, 2017
school for the students that are participating in the program. Again, it is a great
program. What I presented to you today is just a real snippet of the final report that
I am putting together and I cannot say enough. It is providing the State
legislature...I was asked two (2) weeks ago to join them on a tour on O`ahu. They
went to Leilehua High School and we visited some other agriculture-related
companies in Kunia, and then I was asked to do a short presentation on the
agricultural internship program, which they really, really liked and they would like
to see this replicated on the other counties. I have to thank the Mayor and the Council
for supporting, because your funds help provide transportation, which is key. I have
also included,just for your benefit, the schedule this past summer. It is a combination
of the schedule of where the students live, because that is how we had to coordinate
the buses, the timing of the bus pick-up, the farms that they worked at each of the
five (5) weeks, and the schools that were represented in all the three (3) high schools.
This kind of gives you a little idea for this five-week program, how much was involved
and all those that participated. Again, I just wanted to thank you for the support
that you provided and hopefully we have an approval for the six thousand dollars
($6,000). Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you, George. This is an exciting
program and it is wonderful to see the growing interest. Do you do a review each
year, an evaluation of the program, and look at what worked and what did not work
and how you could improve it the following year?
Mr. Costa: Yes. In fact, what we are going to do is
probably in September/October bring the farmers and ranchers together, along with
the Department of Education, because the Department of Education, prior to setting
up the program, has requirements of each farmer and rancher, expectations of what
they would like the students to experience and to be taught. So that is documented,
so that will be all part of the final report and final review. Then we will use that
information to meet and to make the program even better and present it also to the
State legislature, which is interested in expanding the program, but they want to
make sure that besides the experience in the farms and ranches, that one day, out of
the five (5) that the students are working in these farms and ranches that they go
through the business aspect of each of these farms and ranches, learning the
accounting side of things, learning the marketing side of things. Granted, some of
the farmers are one-man operations, but it is important to see that side of how a
one-man operation compared to Kaua`i Nursery and Landscaping, what they do. It
is a comprehensive commitment from everyone.
Councilmember Yukimura: Do you do surveys of the students and of the
farmers at the end of each one?
COUNCIL MEETING 65 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Costa: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Is there a written report evaluation after
that?
Mr. Costa: We have a five-question survey for each one of
the students to see what they thought of the evaluation, and the same thing with the
farmer or rancher. `
Councilmember Yukimura: Is there a report afterwards compiling,
analyzing, and setting forth recommendations for the next program?
Mr. Costa: Right.
Councilmember Yukimura: So you have done that?
Mr. Costa: We are in the process of compiling all of that
information.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. When you are done, can you forward
that to us?
Mr. Costa: Yes, I will probably submit a request to come
back before this Council and present that information.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay, but please have something in writing.
Mr. Costa: Absolutely.
Councilmember Yukimura: Great. Thank you. I have one more question.
Do you have a system or plans for tracking these students to see where they end up
and how many of them actually end up in agriculture?
Mr. Costa: That was something that the State legislature
brought up and we were hoping to do that. The first two (2) students from Kaua`i
High School—one (1) has gone on to Colorado State University in Agriculture, and
last year's program, I believe two (2) other students have gone on to Agriculture, but
the Department of Labor and the State legislature would like to track, especially the
goal. That is why Ms. Hashizaki from Kapa'a recruited freshman, because she would
like them go to through this program and hopefully they will continue all four (4)
years. One of the ideas that the Department of Labor and the Department of
Education would like to do is see if they can have this program year-round where
students could work at farms and ranches afterschool and also provide credit for their
education. Again, this program is building momentum and I am hoping to work with
COUNCIL MEETING 66 AUGUST 9, 2017
the Department of Education to transition this program over to the Department of
Education and their Future Farmers of American and Natural Pathways program.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes. That sounds very, very good. I am just
thinking that as long as it is in the County as a County program, whether you might
not be able, as a requirement of the program, to request that the students send a
letter every year, giving their address where they can be contacted, even just a
paragraph about what they are doing as related to agriculture for the next ten (10)
years and just keep getting that input so that you can track where it is going.
Mr. Costa: That is quite a bit to ask for, but it will
certainly be noted.
Councilmember Yukimura: It is related to your goal, which is to have
young people go into agriculture.
Mr. Costa: Right.
Councilmember Yukimura: I know it sounds like much, but there is a
Children of Kaua`i study that was started when kids were born and they are forty (40)
years later tracking these kids and getting a lot of information from that. I think if
it is not a burdensome requirement, just reporting back their current address and a
one-paragraph statement about where they are. That might be something
worthwhile in terms of feedback for your program.
Mr. Costa: Okay.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kawakami.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you,
Director Costa. My only question is, and you may have answered...I think I heard
some of the answer in your presentation, but you have the Department of Labor
Industrial Relations, the Department of Education, and we have a Department of
Agriculture, which are all State departments, and I really applaud you for taking the
lead on this. Why can they not work state-to-state, government-to-government? Why
do they need the County to take these funds and kind of disperse? Is it because this
is a summer program and the Department of Education does not have a summer
program? How does this work? Why are we the middle men?
Mr. Costa: As I mentioned, it started three (3) years ago.
From what I was told, funds like this did go to the Department of Education, but for
whatever reason, never found its way into an internship program. So the gentlemen
COUNCIL MEETING 67 AUGUST 9, 2017
that met me suggested to the Department of Labor, since we have workforce
development, to basically challenge me and asked me if I could do it, so I volunteered
and the rest is history.
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: It is great to hear that three (3) students are
continuing their education in agriculture. Farming is not an easy thing to do. Are
you trying to reach out to the agricultural companies on the west side to see if they
would be willing to pour some money into this?
Mr. Costa: No, I have not reached out to them. I know
they have their own internship programs. We just focused on the funds that were
made available by the legislature and the County, but we can do that in the coming
years.
Councilmember Brun: I know for the last three (3) years, we brought
in six (6) high school interns per year, plus two (2) college interns. So they are real
high on this and I know we were working with Waimea High School to bring back the
FFA program, so maybe it would be in your interest to reach out to some of those
companies out there to see if we get some money in there to help out, too.
Mr. Costa: Absolutely.
Councilmember Brun: It is a great program and I like where it is
going, so wherever we can help, let us do it.
Mr. Costa: Yes. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you, Chair. Just in terms of the
interagency partnership, I was wondering if the students also engage with the
Department of Education and go to through the ADC proposal process and
understand what it takes.
Mr. Costa: No, right now, the Department of Agriculture
has not been involved. Like I said, it mainly started from the Department of Labor
because of workforce development, and then State Representative Mark Nakashima,
I guess through the Department of Labor, formed an agricultural committee in the
legislature. So the idea of funding this internship program through the Department
of Labor is how I became involved. Then obviously, once they asked to work with the
COUNCIL MEETING 68 AUGUST 9, 2017
high schools, initially I was asked to work with FFA, so again, I assumed that all
three (3)high schools had an FFA program, and only to find out that Herbert Keamoai
was the only one that had an FFA program at Kaua`i High School. So I worked with
him literally three (3) days before he retired, and then started the program, and then
later learned from Principal Anguay that she wants to start it and so does Principal
Hamada. That is how the impetus with the Department of Education started, so now
there are multi-agencies.
Councilmember Chock: I really like the direction and what we are
doing with this and the expansion of it. I know that we have to walk before we run,
but I do see, in terms of some of the comments that came up, is tracking. To me, the
proper way to track it is to kind of give them more opportunities, like you said, a
second and third year where we can help guide them through the actual processes
that are necessary to get them into farming. I think that is really where the key
success lies, is that when we can actually create these farmers from start to end so
that they are getting all of the tools necessary in the process. I appreciate your effort.
Mr. Costa: Right. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: It is really encouraging, because it is not just
the growth in students, but the growth in programs, because it has gone from one (1)
high school to three (3) now.
Mr. Costa: Right.
Councilmember Yukimura: Taking off of what Councilmember Brun said
in terms of the internships that are offered at the seed companies, I think one of the
design issues is whether you would take students from operation-to-operation or
whether they would stay with one operation and work all summer. There is a lot of
emphasis put on project-based learning, which happened with Kaneshiro's hog farm,
where two (2) students stayed throughout the five (5) weeks.
Mr. Costa: Correct.
Councilmember Yukimura: I think that is one of the design factors that
you should continuously be evaluating, if you would, whether it is more productive
and enhances more learning if they stay in one place and work on certain projects.
Mr. Costa: Right. To Valerie Kaneshiro's credit, one,
because of biosecurity, she did not want a whole lot of students coming every week;
two, because I give her, her husband, and their family credit because that is a lot of
work. She is able to work with two (2) students, as opposed to the average size. We
COUNCIL MEETING 69 AUGUST 9, 2017
had five (5) groups this year and the average size of the group was eight (8) students.
For her, that program worked better to have two (2) students work with her five (5)
weeks. I was surprised because the two (2) young women that chose to work with her
never worked in a farm before and I was really skeptical that once they got to that
farm and smelt the pig farm that they would not go the second day, but they loved it
and they really enjoyed it. In fact, both moms contacted me and said that this is a
great program and they really appreciated seeing their daughters come home, really
enthused and want to get into the program. Again, "plant the seed; light the fire."
Hopefully goes from there.
Councilmember Yukimura: That is why that model of summer program
one farm where they really learn all of the aspects of it and learn how much hard
work. It is not like you are there just for one (1) week, but you are working week after
week and really getting to know the business. Maybe the best model, and I know that
would take a lot more or research or convincing of other farms to take on people like
that.
Mr. Costa: Right.
Councilmember Yukimura: On the other hand, that model might serve
the other farmers better, too, to have somebody that really learns.
Mr. Costa: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Anyway, I am just hoping that you will look
at that as you design it.
Mr. Costa: Yes, that is one of the things we were
considering and that is why we are going to meet in September/October with the
farmers and ranchers and really critique the whole program.
Councilmember Yukimura: Great.
Mr. Costa: It is a great program, but man it takes a lot of
coordination.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, it does. Thank you very much, George.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Any other questions? If not,
thank you, George.
Mr. Costa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any registered speakers?
COUNCIL MEETING 70 AUGUST 9, 2017
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Anne Punohu.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anne, you may come up.
Ms. Punohu: Anne Punohu, for the record. This is the last
time you will see me today. I had a concern, but George already addressed it. As he
was talking and as I was listening to everything, I just want to get up and say that
once you put your hand in the soil, ridden a horse, or chased a cow, it is in your brain
forever on Kaua`i. I have been lucky to do that. My youngest daughter was able to
go to a program that taught her how to be a "paniolo" and rope cows. I went to watch
her ride a horse and rope stuff and I was a really proud mother when I saw that. My
other oldest daughter had the opportunity to work as an intern at the National
Tropical Botanical Garden (NTBG). I put my youngest daughter in a tin in a taro
patch before she could walk. I took my kids with me. I always talk about my glory
days on the plantations, so I just think that agriculture is so important and we can
really, really give our kids a leg up. I like the idea of the economic side of it, because
we have a lot of people coming here from the mainland who are landing here, getting
lands, starting farms, and making lots of money. I would like to see our people be
able to have that and say, "Hey, you know what, you can do this, too. You can get out
there and do this and you can learn how to do it economically and make a good living
for yourself," and it would keep our kids here. It is all good, I am all for it, and
congratulations. Let us hope it gets bigger every year and I really have faith in our
kids. They are the "future farmers" of America. Let us make more. Mahalo. Thank
you to everybody involved and I am really looking forward to seeing what these kids
end up doing in their futures. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else? Seeing none, I will
call the meeting back to order. Any further discussion? Councilmember Kawakami.
There being no further testimony, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Councilmember Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you once
again this opportunity. I fully support this. This natural resources pathway is part
of six (6) pathways offered by the Department of Education. It is the Department of
Education's innovative approach to taking these kids and giving them career
exploration. The days of just sitting behind the desk and listening to a teacher are
now moving towards more functionality, and when you ask employers what they are
looking for, they are not necessarily looking for a degree; they are looking for some
kind of practical experience. So these kids come into the high school—I have to really
give credit to Principal Hamada at Kapa'a High School because he really was the
spark plug that helped move this thing around—but you come into high school, and
as a kid, they try to figure out what you are interested in. So you have six (6) sectors:
COUNCIL MEETING 71 AUGUST 9, 2017
arts and communication pathway, business pathway, health services, industrial and
engineering technology, which includes automotive technology, and I have to give my
commendations to Mr. (inaudible) at Kapa'a High School, because I have sat in his
classroom when he is teaching automotive technology and he is incorporating
everything into there. Then you have natural resources, which this is focused on and
then public and human resources. When you take a look into it, all of it has a nexus
into our comprehensive economic development strategy, the one plan where we say
we want to diversify our economy and focus on certain sectors and this lines up
perfectly with what we are trying to achieve. I think it is money well-spent and I
think it is what we have been asking for our Department of Education to do, to be
more innovative and to give more practical hands-on experience. George, thank you
so much. For the ranchers and farmers that are willing to assume this kind of
liability and to have high school kids come into their operation, it is a risk that they
are willing to take and just their ability to open it up for these kids is commendable
as well. To everybody out there that is actually participating in the program, thank
you so much. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else? Councilmember
Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: I just want to say what a great program it is,
providing high school students the opportunity to intern at a farm. It provides
hands-on experience and I also enjoy that they also get to know the business side of
working on a farm and business side of agriculture. I just want to add that I know
that Bill Bukoski's daughters were heavily involved in 4-H, and two (2) of his
daughters were involved in this program and one of them, (inaudible-BillyAnn), I
think she is a freshman in college now and is going to veterinarian school, so that
does provide them with the opportunity to know what they want to do. Everybody
can have a dream of knowing what they want to do, but until they experience it
firsthand, I think you do not really know what you are getting yourself into and this
provides a great opportunity for kids to learn early on what they want to do and what
the opportunities are, and maybe like me, what I do not want to do. I just think it is
a great opportunity and anytime we can offer real-world work experience, I think it
is great for kids. They learn how to be punctual and they learn the demands of
working an eight-hour day or however long they have to be there. I think it is just a
good experience that they are going to remember for the rest their lives, and maybe
like (inaudible-BillyAnn) they are going to take it on and take it to school and pursue
a career in it.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: I am intimately involved in this career
development with the Department of Education, so I just really appreciate this kind
of programming. I think our employers are looking for self-directed and complex
COUNCIL MEETING 72 AUGUST 9, 2017
problem-solvers in our community for the future and the hands-on approach really
offers that for them. I am actually pleased to see some of my students/leaders
involved in these programs. I think our job as leaders is to spark that sense of
purpose for them, but also to help foster that flame as they grow. So I am looking for
opportunities, as these interests arise, to give them the tools necessary, so I see great
potential in the future and hopefully the Department of Education will come to
embrace it further and integrate it into the mainstream practice. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I think this program is a very important and
critical way to grow agriculture and I want to commend George and the Department
of Education for playing a role in piloting this program and in making the connections
that need to be made, in order to show the value of this program. I think it is a good
use of the thirty thousand dollars ($30,000) in County moneys and I also feel like they
are exciting possibilities when you start talking about year-round programs or more
developed careers paths and something that gives hands-on experience. This is just
a very positive program and the Office of Economic Development and Director Costa
deserve a real commendation for it.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anything else? Seeing none, the
motion is to approve.
The motion to approve C 2017- 180 was then put, and unanimously carried.
C 2017-181 Communication (07/26/2017) from the Executive on Aging,
requesting Council approval to receive and expend Federal funds, in the amount of
$551,641.00 for Fiscal Year 2018, to be used by the County of Kaua`i, Agency on
Elderly Affairs for the provision of Title III services of the Older Americans Act, which
includes information and referral, outreach, legal assistance, in-home fall
prevention, congregate meals, home delivered meals, evidence based programs like
EnhanceFitness or Better Choices, Better Health, and caregiver support services, and
to indemnify the State Executive Office on Aging: Councilmember Yukimura moved
to approve C 2017-181, seconded by Councilmember Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion? Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: I just have a quick question for Kealoha, who
has been patiently waiting.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. I will suspend the rules.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
COUNCIL MEETING 73 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kagawa: Is this just expanding what we have or is it
just keeping what we have and continuing?
LUDVINA "KEALOHA" TAKAHASHI, Executive on the Agency of Elderly
Affairs: Kealoha Takahashi with the Agency on
Elderly Affairs. These are federal funding to maintain what we currently have.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you and thank you for your work.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I just want to thank you, Kealoha, for the
evaluation of the legal assistance program that you sent to us and I know that is part
of this grant approval. I was impressed with the fact that you have an evaluation
sheet and you go through the process and it gave me some level of confidence that the
program is achieving its goals. Thank you very much.
Ms. Takahashi: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else wishing to testify? If
not, I will call the meeting back to order.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded
as follows:
C 2017-182 Communication (08/01/2017) from Council Chair Rapozo,
transmitting for Council consideration, proposed amendments to Chapter 16, by
adding a new subsection to Section 16-2.1 "County Council to Exercise Functions by
Resolution," which negates the Council's authority to establish school bus stops,
leaving this function to the State of Hawaii: Councilmember Kagawa moved to
approve C 207-182, seconded by Councilmember Yukimura.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: We have one (1) registered speaker.
Council Chair Rapozo: Who is that?
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Anne Punohu.
Council Chair Rapozo: She just left.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: Okay, then there are no registered speakers.
Council Chair Rapozo: I asked the State representative to be here
and they are calling her over right now. We will have the discussion when we are at
COUNCIL MEETING 74 AUGUST 9, 2017
the bill, but if I could just explain what this is about. Councilmember Brun and I met
with the State, the Department of Education and the Transportation Director from
Honolulu, and apparently we are the only County that processes applications for
school bus stops. The sad reality is that the demographics of the schools change quite
frequently. You have a family that moves out of a school and it affects where these
bus stop are going to be and the State...the process now is that if there is a desire to
move a bus stop or put up a bus stop, they have to come to the County Council, fill
out an application, and then the application gets sent over to the Department of
Public Works and they have to have a whole team of people go out there and
determine, all because we have to put a sign up. That is the whole process. In the
other counties, the Department of Education determines where the bus stops go and
they do not put up signage because...I do not know what you call it...the changes...the
subject to change...it changes all of the time. If you have a homeowner resident that
is not happy or the kids are causing a problem, then they move the bus stop, but they
cannot do that here because they have to come through this process, do an
application, go across the street, engineers have to go out, and waste all of our
resources; whereas all the other counties, the Department of Education does the
assessment and the best part is that they take on the liabilities and the County is
completely out of it because they do not install signs. It is done through the
community process where the Department of Education has a school bus coordinator
here on Kaua`i, who is going to be here hopefully...she is right across the street, and
they do an assessment, they do the community outreach, and they determine where
the bus stops shall be, not the sign. They came to us and asked us if it was possible
to consider that. To me, it makes perfect sense. We really do not have a say. That
is something that the schools determine, where the bus stops should be, based on the
population of the students in that area. That is why we have this amendment.
Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: It sounds more efficient. I am just wondering
in terms of safety and ingress/egress that the Department of Education is capable of
doing that analysis, which I presume is what the Department of Public Works does
right now.
Council Chair Rapozo: We take on a liability when we install a sign.
When we put a school bus stop sign there, we obviously incur that liability.
Councilmember Yukimura: Right, but in terms of assessing safety of the
location in terms of ingress/egress and other traffic considerations, the Department
of Education has the capability of doing that?
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: So is the Department of Public Works okay
with us doing this?
COUNCIL MEETING 75 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: I am not sure if they are okay or not, but...
Councilmember Yukimura: We did not ask them?
Council Chair Rapozo: No, it is a Council function. Years ago,
according to my research, a long time ago, before our time...I am not sure if
Councilmember Yukimura was here at that time, but this was used as a tool by the
Councilmen and women to claim, "Okay, I will put a bus stop for your kids." It is a
Council function. That is what my research has shown me. The old Councilmembers
told me that is what this was for. We do not need that. It is not practical and it is
not feasible, like I said, when the population changes. More so, I felt that this was
necessary, when the State and the County has a very good inventory of where these
bus stops are. That is quite troubling. Although they put in the application, the State
does not have an inventory of where these bus stops are. It is almost a formality that
has to come through, an unnecessary bureaucracy, to have them come through us, for
us to send it across the street. As we are looking at doing more with less, today, I
think the Department of Public Works would be very happy to get rid of this and let
the State take over. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: As I recall the process, the State usually
applies to us, but it goes through the Department of Public Works for an analysis
before it comes to us for approval. I see that our Acting County Engineer is here.
Can we get their input?
Council Chair Rapozo: Is the woman from the State coming? We are
coming up on a lunch break. Why do we not just suspend the rules, then Lyle can
come up and address this.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
LYLE TABATA, Acting County Engineer: Good morning, Chair, Vice
Chair, and Members of the Council. Lyle Tabata, Acting County Engineer.
Councilmember Yukimura: Lyle, if I recall, the process usually for
establishing or removing a Department of Education bus stop comes through your
department...
Mr. Tabata: Yes, it does...
Councilmember Yukimura: ...with an analysis and a recommendation.
We were told you folks were not asked for an official comment, so we would like to get
your input now.
COUNCIL MEETING 76 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Tabata: Actually, we have been working with the
Department of Education over several years on this issue and the Chair is correct; it
will allow the Department of Education more flexibility to locate the bus stops as the
demographics change with the housing as far as where in-time a subdivision ages and
the youth, not really of that age anymore, that use the school bus for transportation,
versus other subdivisions that are newer where the demand has moved to. Having
to go through that process, at many times, was very cumbersome for them to be able
to adjust to the relative needs of the day. You are correct, we do assist them with
identifying possible safety concerns and make recommendations, and that can still
happen; they can still come and see us. But the official process of having to come
through and do a Council resolution, at times, in their opinion, it was very...I would
say that it delayed their process. We agree with them that it does not have to be a
requirement.
Councilmember Yukimura: Actually, it looks like, as needed, they are still
going to consult with you and you folks will be doing some analysis, etcetera, but the
portion of the process where it comes to the Council, we do not really need that?
Mr. Tabata: Right. As the Chair pointed out, we are the
only jurisdiction in the State left where...
Councilmember Yukimura: Where it still comes to the County Council.
Mr. Tabata: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you very much.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: So Lyle, overall, it is no secret that statewide
schools are experiencing problems with bus service and this would hopefully promote
a more efficient bus service for the State.
Mr. Tabata: Exactly. We were up for anything that can
help them improve in providing services.
Councilmember Kagawa: But we still can provide recommendations,
like they may ask for a location of a bus stop and we can say, "Perhaps, going one
hundred (100) feet this way would be a safer place."
Mr. Tabata: Yes.
COUNCIL MEETING 77 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Kagawa: So we can make recommendations as to where
there would be possible safer alternatives in close proximity to where they want
something to be.
Mr. Tabata: Yes.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anymore questions for Lyle?
Thank you, Lyle. Anyone wishing to testify? Seeing none, I will call the meeting back
to order.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded
as follows:
Council Chair Rapozo: I think it really just exempts the State
Department of Education from our County process, as far as establishing school bus
stops. When I spoke to the Director, and I am not sure because I did not speak to him
the same time as Councilmember Brun did, but it is like they have a process that is
in place and they have their people here to go out...just using the scenario that we
have today with the shortage of bus drivers for the State—imagine if they had to come
to this body to address that issue...can you imagine if we had to submit eight (8) or
ten (10) resolutions because they had to move bus stops? It actually makes no sense.
The timing could not be better and it will just help the County because it frees-up our
resources and the State seems to think that they can do it without the County, in my
discussion, but I would assume that in some of these scenarios, they will be looking
to the County for some help. But they are not required to, so I think it is a "win-win"
for everybody. Anyway, we will have more discussion and have the State person here.
Do you need the State representative here for the bill? Okay, we do not need them
here for the bill.
The motion to receive C 2017-182 for the record was then put, and unanimously
carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: With that, we will take a one-hour lunch
break and be back at 1:30 p.m.
There being no objections, the meeting recessed at 12:31 p.m.
The meeting reconvened at 1:35 p.m., and proceeded as follows:
(Councilmember Kagawa was noted as excused.)
(Councilmember Kawakami was noted as excused.)
COUNCIL MEETING 78 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: The meeting is back to order. Can we have
the next item, please?
LEGAL DOCUMENT:
C 2017-183 Communication (07/12/2017) from the Mayor, recommending
Council approval of a Dedication Deed from Edward S. Bittner, Trustee of the
Ko`ohio Realty Trust, conveying Roadway Lot 2, Pila`a, Hanalei, Kaua`i, Hawai`i,
Tax Map Key (TMK) No. (4) 5-1-004-034, to the County of Kaua`i for road widening
purposes.
• Dedication Deed
Councilmember Yukimura moved to approve C 2017-183, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve C 2017-183 was then put, and carried by a vote of 5:0:2
(Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
Council Chair Rapozo: Next item, please.
Ms. Fountain-Tanigawa: We are on page number 4.
CLAIM:
C 2017-184 Communication (07/26/2017) from the County Clerk, transmitting
a claim filed against the County of Kaua`i by Sun Fuye, for damages to his vehicle,
pursuant to Section 23.06, Charter of the County of Kaua`i: Councilmember Yukimura
moved to refer C 2017-184 to the Office of the County Attorney for disposition and/or
report back to the Council, seconded by Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Any discussion or public
testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
COUNCIL MEETING 79 AUGUST 9, 2017
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to refer C 2017-184 to the Office of the County Attorney for
disposition and/or report back to the Council was then put, and carried by a
vote of 5:0:2 (Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
Council Chair Rapozo: Next item, please.
COMMITTEE REPORTS:
ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT & INTERGOVERNMENTAL RELATIONS
COMMITTEE:
A report (No. CR-EDIR 2017-06) submitted by the Economic Development &
Intergovernmental Relations Committee, recommending that the following be
Received for the Record:
"C 2017-168 Communication (07/12/2017) from the Director of
Economic Development, requesting Council approval to apply for, receive, and
expend funds from the Hawai`i Community Foundation, in the amount of
$50,000.00, and from Partners for Places, in the amount of $50,000.00, for a
total amount of $100,000.00, for the development of a Climate Action Plan
(CAP) for the County of Kaua`i,"
Councilmember Yukimura moved for approval of the report, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or pubic testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve the report was then put, and carried by a vote of 5:0:2
(Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
BUDGET & FINANCE COMMITTEE:
A report (No. CR-BF 2017-15) submitted by the Budget & Finance Committee,
recommending that the following be Approved as Amended on second and final
reading:
COUNCIL MEETING 80 AUGUST 9, 2017
"Bill No. 2659 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
CHAPTER 5A, SECTION 5A-11A.1, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS
AMENDED, RELATING TO THE BENEFICIAL TAX RATE FOR PROPERTY
USED FOR LONG-TERM AFFORDABLE RENTAL,"
Councilmember Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or pubic testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve the report was then put, and carried by a vote of 5:0:2
(Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
A report (No. CR-BF 2017-16) submitted by the Budget & Finance Committee,
recommending that the following be Received for the Record:
"BF 2017-02 Communication (07/27/2017) from Council Chair Rapozo,
requesting the presence of the Mayor, the Managing Director, and the Director
of Finance, to discuss the Administration's decision to lift the six (6) month
moratorium on the filling of vacant positions which was highlighted in Mayor
Carvalho's Fiscal Year 2017-2018 budget plan,"
Councilmember Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or pubic testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve the report was then put, and carried by a vote of 5:0:2
(Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
A report (No. CR-BF 2017-17) submitted by the Budget & Finance Committee,
recommending that the following be Approved as Amended on second and final
reading:
COUNCIL MEETING 81 AUGUST 9, 2017
"Bill No. 2658 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
CHAPTER 5A, ARTICLE 11 AND 11A, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS
AMENDED, RELATING TO REAL PROPERTY TAX,"
Councilmember Chock moved for approval of the report, seconded by
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or pubic testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion to approve the report was then put, and carried by a vote of 5:0:2
(Councilmembers Kagawa and Kawakami were excused).
RESOLUTIONS:
Resolution No. 2016-60 — RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING THE
ACQUISITION OF A PUBLIC PEDESTRIAN BEACH ACCESS EASEMENT IN
LAND REQUIRED FOR PUBLIC USE, TO WIT: A PUBLIC PEDESTRIAN BEACH
ACCESS EASEMENT TO KUKUIULA BAY, KUKUIULA, COUNTY OF KAUAI,
HAWAII, AND DETERMINING AND DECLARING THE NECESSITY OF THE
ACQUISITION THEREOF BY EMINENT DOMAIN
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Are we going to talk about it first?
Council Chair Rapozo: You can go ahead and make the motion. Right
now, this is for a deferral, so let us just have the discussion.
Councilmember Yukimura: Actually, we should make a motion.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay, you can move to schedule a public
hearing, but you cannot make the motion to defer.
Councilmember Kaneshiro moved for adoption of Resolution No. 2016-60,
seconded by Councilmember Yukimura.
Council Chair Rapozo: This is where it is at today. There are five (5)
of us here, I do not know where the other two (2) are...I think Councilmember Kagawa
is in a meeting downstairs. I think the Administration has made it very clear that they
do not support this acquisition, and that in fact, if it passes, he will veto it. It takes
five (5) votes to override a veto. The only reason I bring this up is because we have been
COUNCIL MEETING 82 AUGUST 9, 2017
through this discussion and everyone was waiting for the appraisal, which was done,
and you should have a copy of that appraisal. I guess what I am saying is that I do not
want to go through the motions to have it vetoed, and then have to go through the whole
process to override the veto. I do not know where everybody is at on this, I really do
not. I will just say that if I am the fourth vote, I will not support it, only because I am
not going to get us in a position for a veto and a battle to override the veto. If we have
the five (5) votes, then we can move forward. Basically, if we have five (5) votes, then
the Mayor would probably not veto. Anyway, with that, does anyone have discussion
on the process? Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: The big issue has been the cost in these
decisions; we have an appraisal and there are potential attorney fees, of which I just
wanted to confirm, that our County Attorney will take on this case and what that
perspective would be.
Council Chair Rapozo: I will suspend the rules if there are no
objections.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Council Chair Rapozo: We also have to take into account, the
landowner's attorney fees as well.
Councilmember Chock: Okay.
MAUNA KEA TRASK, County Attorney: Mauna Kea Trask, County
Attorney.
Councilmember Chock: I am looking for the total cost on the record. I
was wondering if you might be able to give us a range. I understand that you do not
know what that total cost is in its entirety or real cost.
Mr. Trask: Correct.
(Councilmember Kawakami was noted as present.)
Council Chair Rapozo: Also, real quick, the appraisal is stamped
"confidential" so I am assuming that we cannot disclose the costs.
Mr. Trask: Given where we are at right now...we
discussed that it can be kept confidential, but it will eventually, if you proceed with
this, you can talk about it if you want to. So it did not come over confidential from
the Office of the County Attorney; it came over from the Planning Department.
COUNCIL MEETING 83 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Trask: So the discussion as to whether or not you
want to discuss it is yours, but we thought initially to transmit it to you confidentially.
But of course, if we were to go to trial and all of these things were to get discussed, it
is intended to be shared with at least twelve (12) people on the jury box, and therefore
everyone.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Trask: As far as estimating costs, there is not...this
will not be able to get a negotiated purchase, it has go eminent domain. In order to
do that, you have to go to court. There are two types of costs: monetary and resource
costs, time and effort within the office. I will tell you at this point that your Office of
the County Attorney has done everything it has been able to for the past couple of
years to minimize its costs and to make budget cuts and really to chip in where this
Council and the Administration wants to go, as far as controlling resources. Given
everything that we are doing in-house right now, a lot of the increase in
administrative litigation related to Transient Vacation Rental (TVR) enforcement
and various other enforcement actions and contested cases—we are too thin as it is.
This will be although not a complicated matter, two (2) issues, it will be intensive and
these things involved, because there is a lot of money involved, it will be in-depth. It
goes to trial...it has to go to jury trial. You cannot motion these cases out because
value is a matter for the jury to consider. Given everything that we are dealing with
and civil cases that we currently have, and that we know are coming, for your Office
of the County Attorney's resources, there is just not enough time in the day. We are
not asking for any more bodies, but the ability to take on new litigation...when you
have the discretion not to engage in it, we would avoid at this time. If you really want
to go forward with this, we would come and ask for special counsel to take it. Again,
given the current litigation with some cases going on, we anticipate to return to you
shortly within the next couple of months to encumber special counsel funds in some
unrelated cases that we expect, and we do expect to run through this special counsel
budget before the end of this fiscal year. That is just a matter of fact. Therefore, if
you want to proceed with this, you are going to have to seriously consider getting a
money bill to get more special counsel funds for this and possibly for other cases.
Although, we do not anticipate that there will be some similar issues with other
recent condemnations, you cannot anticipate certain things. We do not know the
complexity of the estate planning, so far as regard to this property, if any, and those
things add on levels of expertise. On the last one we did, there were off-seas
corporations that were involved and that was difficult. Litigation costs in that case
went up, I think, three hundred eighty thousand dollars ($380,000) to four hundred
thousand dollars ($400,000), if I am not mistaken. It could be that high. We also
went to the Supreme Court in the State of Hawai`i in the last case, so it could take a
long time. Also, too, ultimately, there is a large discrepancy between what we
COUNCIL MEETING 84 AUGUST 9, 2017
understand is what the landowner is saying it is worth and our appraisal. That is a
discretion for the jury to decide. The best we can do is provide our estimate per an
expert report, which is the appraisal, but you cannot say what ultimately the jury
will find.
Council Chair Rapozo: Are you saying that in this case, what the
appraiser said the value is, you are not agreeing with that?
Mr. Trask: No, I do agree with it.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Trask: For the record, I believe it is very
well-reasoned and I think it is what it is.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay.
Mr. Trask: However, the jury may not agree. I can say it
will not go lower than that, but it very well could go higher.
Council Chair Rapozo: Okay. Thank you.
Councilmember Chock: So two hundred thousand dollars ($200,000)
to four hundred thousand dollars ($400,000) is what I heard you say, in addition to
the appraisal, potentially, the cost?
Mr. Trask: Yes.
Councilmember Chock: Is there any other additional costs?
Mr. Trask: I can say that for today, approximately that
much. So you are looking at...with the cost of...yes, somewhere around there.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: What was the cost for the Sheehan property?
Mr. Trask: With the Sheehan property, ultimately the
jury award was five million eight hundred thousand dollars ($5,800,000).
Councilmember Yukimura: Right. What was the cost of the attorneys?
COUNCIL MEETING 85 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Trask: Couple hundred thousand dollars...about
three hundred eighty thousand dollars ($380,000), I believe. A lot of that was
redeemed because we got...
Council Chair Rapozo: I do not know if we need to be discussing the
Sheehan property case on this agenda item.
Mr. Trask: That is fine.
Council Chair Rapozo: This is about...
Councilmember Yukimura: No, but this is about potential attorney's fees,
so I am just asking for a ballpark on the previous experience.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura, you can ask a
general question as it relates to condemnation, but you do not site a case that is not
on the agenda that we are actually in litigation right now.
Councilmember Yukimura: I disagree.
Council Chair Rapozo: Well, that is the rule.
Councilmember Yukimura: Whose rule is it?
Council Chair Rapozo: Mauna Kea, I am expecting you to...do you
think we can talk about another case on this agenda item?
Mr. Trask: I can estimate, based on my familiarity,
roughly a couple hundred thousands of dollars.
Council Chair Rapozo: For this case?
Mr. Trask: For this case.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, I but I am sure that he is basing it partly
on our experience in the past.
Mr. Trask: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you very much.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
COUNCIL MEETING 86 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Chock: In addition to the cost...the cost was the main
obstacle, previously spoken, but I would like to hear from the department. It sounds
like they are adamantly against it and we are going to get vetoed on it, so I would like
to hear the reasoning done by the Administration.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: I have some questions on the cost.
Council Chair Rapozo: On the cost?
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Yes. Mauna Kea, just on the costs, so two
hundred thousand dollars ($200,000) to four hundred thousand dollars ($400,000)
was for our own special counsel?
Mr. Trask: Yes.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Then we would have to pay whatever the
appraised value is?
Mr. Trask: Well, whatever the jury says it is. Say our
appraisal is a certain amount and say the property owner is saying high hundreds of
thousands, around one million dollars ($1,000,000)—the jury could find very well
with them; they could split the baby and whatever it is, because it is a matter of
experts. So it will be a battle of experts.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Would we need to pay for their attorney costs?
Mr. Trask: No, I do not think so.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Okay.
Mr. Trask: Not to my knowledge.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Okay. Thanks.
Mr. Trask: Also, too, just with that, there is going to be a
huge question with what is called under 101-23, "damages or assessed," when you
take part of a property. They describe severance damages, they are blight of
summons damages, and various types of statutory damages. Our appraisal discusses
that and there is significant difference between what our appraiser is saying accounts
for those damages versus what theirs is. That is another issue the jury could come
up with. Whatever they come up with is largely their discretion and it is difficult to
overturn that on appeal, until it is clear abuse of discretion or something like that.
COUNCIL MEETING 87 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: I have a follow-up question.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Yukimura: Do we have access to any appraisal on their
part to justify the figures that they are talking about?
Mr. Trask: Not at this point and that is not uncommon,
but we would in the case...
Councilmember Yukimura: Right, it would come up in court of course.
Mr. Trask: It would be part of discovery, correct.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Again, I want to hear the reasons, if not only
cost prohibitive. As the initial estimation was one million dollars ($1,000,000) or
more, it sounds like it is lower than that at this point. What additional reasons should
we not act on this for, or that the Administration is proposing not to act on it?
KAAINA HULL, Deputy Planning Director: Ka`aina Hull, Deputy Planning
Director. So the department and the Administration have been in opposition to this
acquisition, primarily because of the fact that it is an adversarial action and would
require condemnation. We have always held that we even when we get this appraisal
number, and now we have it before you folks, that that is an appraisal number that
as the County Attorney referred to. That is not in any means indicative of what it is
going to cost us. Well, it is somewhat indicative, but at the end of the day, a jury can
award higher than that, and much higher than that. Because of that process and the
unknowable dollar figure on it, as well as the work and the resources it would place
on the County Attorney's Office, the department is just against an adversarial
acquisition of this particular property.
Councilmember Chock: Okay, so anything moving forward that is
adversarial in nature will not be supported by the department. Is that correct?
Mr. Hull: I would not say that it is a carte blanche
statement that the department or the Administration would be against any
adversarial action. I think given the relative small amount of land that is being
looked at in this particular proposal, the potential cost for that land with the
adversarial acquisition and the natural resources that is affording the opportunity to
COUNCIL MEETING 88 AUGUST 9, 2017
access. Indeed, they are wonderful; they are splendid, the department would
definitely finding access in there, but the amount of effort, time, and ultimately
monetary resources that would have to be pumped into it in this particular scenario,
the department does not support acquisition. I have to be clear as staff for the Open
Space Commission, and we do have the Open Space Commission Chair here, that
while the department does not support this acquisition in this form, that it is an Open
Space Commission initiative to go through condemnation proceedings to acquire that.
So I just want to be clear that that is the Open Space Commission's position.
Mr. Trask: If I can add onto that, as far as if the question
were posed to the County Attorney's Office regarding any adversarial acquisition by
condemnation at this time, for this time, for this fiscal year, the Attorney's Office
would advise against it just because an adversarial condemnation action is avoidable
by you today. This County cannot avoid all of the other suits brought against it by
plaintiffs. We have to respond to all of those. We do not control the litigation calendar
and we do not have discretion to bring cases like the Prosecutor's Office does and we
have to enforce the law with our enforcement proceedings. All of your resources at
litigation right now are directed at those, defending and bringing contested cases to
bring people into compliance with the law. At this point, we do not support
condemnation actions for the fiscal year 2017-2018.
Councilmember Chock: So it is a timing issue is what I am hearing,
that perhaps in the future, if this was on the agenda with a different budget or
different resources available, you would be more likely to support moving on it. Is
that correct?
Mr. Trask: Correct, between five (5) litigation deputies,
currently approximately seventeen (17) TVR cases in contested cases, another
estimated at least ten (10) coming down—we do not support it at this time. We need
to focus on what is coming versus what we can avoid. Uncle Teddy and Aunty Tessie
is back there—this is not about the access. I live on the south side. So you can know
where your litigation resources are at, I need to let you know about that today.
Councilmember Chock: Is that an option? Maybe we need to hear
from the Open Space Commission, but is an option to defer this and wait until the
resources are there for us moving onto this particular project?
Mr. Trask: You can ask them. I just want to let you know
that.
Mr. Hull: I might also add to Mauna Kea's testimony
that this also leads into some discussions we had previously about condemnation
proceedings. I think the department has made a few statements in the past,
concerning accessing the Open Space Commission's funds for the hiring of special
COUNCIL MEETING 89 AUGUST 9, 2017
counsel. In recent discussions with the Office of the County Attorney, we may have
been misinformed when we made those statements. It appears now, and I will defer
to Mauna Kea if he has any further insight, that it looks like while the fund can be
used for acquisition and administration purposes, that we would not be able to tap
into the fund for the hiring of special counsel. So those funds would have to be found
essentially elsewhere.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: So how do you justify your advice and
recommendation in support of the Sheehan property? That was an adversarial
process and we had to go before a jury, but you are saying that because it is an
adversarial process that we are not going to go forward?
Mr. Trask: No. At that time, we had eight million nine
hundred thousand dollars ($8,900,000) in park acquisition...
Council Chair Rapozo: Again, I am not going to allow discussion on
that case. Councilmember Chock just asked the question: is that our policy that if it
contested that we are not going to move on? I think he answered the question. It is
basically a case-by-case basis.
Councilmember Yukimura: I am sorry, but this process you are saying are
several reasons. The Planning Department is saying that as long as it is adversarial,
if it is going to take us that we have to go to court and there is some disagreement, it
is not an owner that says, "Okay," then we are not going to do it. That is what I
heard.
Mr. Hull: No, Councilmember Yukimura, that is not
what was said.
Councilmember Yukimura: Good, please clarify. That is why I am asking
my question, so I can get clear about what the policy is.
Mr. Hull: What I stated was in accessing the
commiserate value and utility that the County and the public would enjoy from an
acquisition, in this particular scenario, given the size of the resource and the
resources that would make accessible, the condemnation proceedings is not
commiserate to that particular access in this particular scenario.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay, so it is not about adversarial or not; it
is about that particular access is not important enough as a public access.
COUNCIL MEETING 90 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Hull: No, Councilmember Yukimura, I will ask you
again, that is not what I said.
Councilmember Yukimura: Well, that is what I hear you saying.
Mr. Hull: What I said very clearly in the beginning on
my statement is that indeed this is a wonderful access, that the County would enjoy
if we could readily and easily access it. But given the amount of resources, time, and
financial resources that we would have to commit to acquiring it, that amount is not
commiserate to this particular access.
Councilmember Yukimura: Right.
Mr. Hull: But if it were not in an adversarial
acquisition, if it was just solely based off of the appraisal we got, we could do that
analysis and see if it is commiserate, but given the further resources and the funding
that is necessary for an adversarial acquisition, we are saying it is not commiserate
to the value.
Councilmember Yukimura: So what message are you sending to people
who might have some access that we want? "Just show that you are opposed to it,
then they will not take it." That is basically what you are telling them. "If you make
enough noise and resist enough, the County is going to back down."
Mr. Hull: The County is not going to get it from them
without an adversarial acquisition unless they say "yes." So if there is any property
owner that has private property that they in any inclination do not want to sell to the
County, we are not going to get it unless we condemn it, quite frankly.
Councilmember Yukimura: Right.
Mr. Hull: That is their own private individual property
right. So we are saying that in this scenario, this is not commiserate to the value of
the site.
Councilmember Yukimura: Exactly, but I am interpreting, and I think not
unreasonably, what other landowners will say, "All we have to do is make a lot of
noise and resistance and they will back down."
Mr. Trask: Just to clarify my statement, because I do not
want it to be confused, but the Office of the County Attorney's position is just for the
fiscal year 2017-2018, given our budget, which has three hundred eighty thousand
dollars ($380,000) for special counsel. Given what we are dealing with in-house,
because our special counsel budget before used to be one million dollars ($1,000,000).
COUNCIL MEETING 91 AUGUST 9, 2017
It was like high six hundred thousand dollars ($600,000), depending on where you go,
since I have been here. We have done everything we could to bring that down because
that was a huge burden on the County. It took away from other projects, so we do
what we can in-house. Anyone can look at our budget and see what our resources
are. I am just saying that for this fiscal year, there are other things happening that
we need to focus on, and we can come next year. I have no problem with going to
court and litigating eminent domain cases. I am just saying if you want to do that,
we are going to need more money.
Councilmember Yukimura: That is fair enough.
Mr. Trask: Ultimately, that is what it comes down to.
Councilmember Yukimura: Okay, but the decision about whether we get
more money, whether we appropriate more money, and whether we get special
counsel is this body's decision.
Mr. Trask: Exactly.
Councilmember Yukimura: So you are telling us that we will need more
money in terms of special counsel, and right now, the budget does not have it so we
would have to find it from somewhere else.
Mr. Trask: Correct.
Councilmember Yukimura: Of course, we just passed one million dollars
($1,000,000) in firefighter raises, which that is gone from next year's budget.
Anyway, you are saying that we do not have enough this year existing and earmarked
in the budget for either special counsel work or for in-house work.
Mr. Trask: I do not mean to be paternalistic, but in order
to get the analogy across, all I am saying is, like we are at the store and you only can
buy certain things—my kids want ice cream, and we cannot get ice cream, but maybe
we can afford ice cream when daddy gets paid again on the 15th—that is all I am
saying, maybe in the next fiscal. I need the next paycheck to go look at this.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you. So your answer to my question is
yes, that in this fiscal year, we do not have money in-house, in the budget right now
for the special counsel that would be required or really for in-house capability.
Mr. Trask: Yes.
COUNCIL MEETING 92 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you. My references to other expenses
is exactly what I was trying to get across that you are trying to get across by your
household budget example.
Mr. Trask: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? So it really boils down
to the money. I can hear you loud and clear, Mauna Kea, that based on your budget
it would be very difficult for you. So this body, as Councilmember Yukimura said,
the opportunity to put more money in there is this body's decision. It really comes
down to what she said earlier: is this access important enough for this body to decide
if we are going to put more money into the special counsel fund? That is really what
it boils down to. Does this body here believe that that access is important to invest,
let us say, six hundred thousand dollars ($600,000)? That is what it boils down to. I
have not heard any kind of opposition to the acquisition because of access or condition
of the...I have not heard none of that...it is really just money. I have been in here
long enough to know that next year's budget is not going to be any different than this
year's budget. So to say that we are going to wait for next year, there is no sense.
You either are going to do it or you not. If it is important, then you do it; if it is not,
then you do not. I think to expect us to defer this for another year hoping that we get
money next year, I think that is just giving the public false hope and I think the public
has waited a long time. One way or the other, I think we need to dispose of this
matter. I hate for us to wait one more year, because next year, another access is going
to pop up, or two (2) more. Anyway, no other concerns as far as acquisition, except
the funds. Okay. Thank you.
Councilmember Chock: Chair, I was just wondering, since Open
Space...since this is their purview and the Chair is here, that we might hear from
them as well.
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes, I definitely want to hear from the Open
Space Commission.
THEODORE BLAKE, Chair of the Public Access, Open Space & Natural
Resources Preservation Fund Commission: Good afternoon, Theodore Blake, Chair
for the Open Space Commission.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you for being here. I know the
recommendation for the Open Space Commission is to move on this acquisition. We
have heard the opposing viewpoints, so I was wondering if you might be able to help
respond or shed light on this decision process for the Council.
COUNCIL MEETING 93 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Blake: The Commission was in favor of proceeding
with this and I carried out their wishes.
Councilmember Chock: So you and the Commission believes that this
is worth the amount that is being projected. Is that correct?
Mr. Blake: We never got to that question.
Councilmember Chock: Really?
Mr. Blake: This has a long history. It came out around
forty thousand dollars ($40,000) or something like that, and it went on and on, and
then the guy comes back with the really ridiculous amount of one million dollars
($1,000,000), which is saying, "If you want it, this is what you have to pay."
Personally, I take offense to that. As the Commission Chair, I just do what my
Commission wishes and I kept my opinion to myself.
Councilmember Chock: So I am understanding that the vote on this
was not unanimous from the Commission?
Mr. Blake: I do not believe so, but we supported it
because the past Commissioners have worked hard on this. To me, it is not fair to just
let it go by the wayside, because it was not addressed. There was money for it many
times and it was never moved on. Now when we want to move on it...I kind of wished
my bank account would appreciate that much. How do you justify this? The principle
of the matter is what I was getting with. At some point in time, we have to make our
decision and I guess we are at that point right now.
Council Chair Rapozo: As you sit here today as the Chair of the
Commission, it is the Commission's desire to move this forward?
Mr. Blake: Yes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions for Mr. Blake? If not,
thank you.
Mr. Blake: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Is there anyone else from Open Space that
wants to testify before I open it up to the public? I appreciate your patience.
JOSEPH FIGAROA, Member of the Public Access, Open Space & Natural
Resources Preservation Fund Commission: Thank you so much for putting this on
the agenda and for bringing this matter up to light.
COUNCIL MEETING 94 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: Can you just state your name for the record?
Mr. Figaroa: Sorry, for the record, for those who do not
know me, Joseph Figaroa. Yes, it is very strongly supported to acquire this property.
Yes, it has been on the Open Space agenda and I know it will require additional funds.
My concern is if it waits to another fiscal year, like a lot of the properties that have
waited two (2) fiscal years, they drop off into something called an "abyss" and never
to be seen again. The community has definitely supported this. They have very much
been strong advocates for it. At the same time, it also has a historical value, and at
one point, it was in our hands and due to some unforeseen circumstances, it slipped
away. So now it is the opportunity for this body to secure its position on it. That is
my statement.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: So Joseph, thank you. You say that it was on
the public's Open Space Commission agenda, but in fact, it was a priority of the
Commission?
Mr. Figaroa: Yes, according to my knowledge, it has been a
priority since the inception of the Commission, back I believe in 2008 when the
Commission first started. My dates might be wrong, but I do know that in the
inception of it, it was a high priority back then.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, I think it started earlier, but you had
some new powers clarified, I think, in around 2008.
Mr. Figaroa: Yes.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you very much.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? Councilmember
Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: I know this whole Hoban thing started a long,
long time ago, but I guess my question is do you think this access is as important now
as it was in the past when that whole Kukui`ula Beach is now open and accessible to
the public?
Mr. Figaroa: Not just my opinion, but my personal feeling
is that it is, and the reason for that is when I have been to Kukui`ula Boat Harbor
onto the beach, you can see a beautiful beach from the corner, and of course, the only
way to access it is either if you swim or if you kind of just kayak there. Of course, I
COUNCIL MEETING 95 AUGUST 9, 2017
am just throwing this out there and it is not official, but just randomly, I asked
individuals from the National Tropical Botanical Garden about their feelings, and to
my surprise, the management there said, "You know what, we would be more than
willing to open up some parking spaces if that was open," because they know the
significance of that as well. But me personally, I have seen people kind of traversing
over the empty property next to it to get to the beach or somewhat what they could.
So I see a large value to it. I know I have talked to a few fishermen who definitely
see a major value. I, myself, as a person who likes to go to beaches off the beaten
path, I definitely see that as a public wealth for everyone to enjoy.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: Mr. Figaroa, are you still on the Commission?
Mr. Figaroa: Yes.
Councilmember Chock: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? If not, thank you very
much.
Mr. Figaroa: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anybody in the public wishing to testify?
TESSIE KINNAMAN: Good afternoon. For the record, Tessie
Kinnaman. I am still in favor of this acquisition. It is sad that it is taking this long,
but this is an important acquisition for the community. I do not recall when you folks
took your oath of office to uphold the law of this County and State, and it did not say
"if we only had money." This is a natural resource that belongs to the people. Public
access—we have used that way longer than a lot of you. I do not think you know
anything about it, but it is important. It is sad to think that the Mayor and the
Planning Department does not feel like it is that important for the people. You are
depriving people of food. I do not care about Kukui`ula Harbor. Everybody goes to
the harbor. In fact, it is getting packed with people. Po`ipu Beach is shot. I go down
there and it is really sad. I do not even go down there anymore. Right now, I have a
little corner of the harbor. I do not go where everybody else is. Just looking at that
area that we are supposed to be accessing all of these years, it is like...I am sorry that
I am crying, but it is just sad. The people have vested rights in this area and you
cannot deny the people, because we are the County. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else wishing to testify?
COUNCIL MEETING 96 AUGUST 9, 2017
TINA SAKAMOTO: Tina Sakamoto. I have testified on this issue
previously and this property is advertised as a "private, exclusive beach" for vacation
rentals. My husband and I are seniors and we went down there and we have no
access to it. We are not going to kayak there, we are not going to swim, and the only
other way is to traverse property where there is a sign that says...I think there is a
fine. After you pass the fine, then you have to climb over a seawall that somebody
has built that extends towards the ocean, so we have no access. We cannot go; we
cannot take our kids and grandkids. So this is an important access for all of us, not
just vacationers, not just an exclusive few. I think it is valid and I think it is
important for all reasons: historical and culture. So it is something that has to be
moved on and it has been pending for years and years. We need to move on it and
open up this space for beach access. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else in the public wishing to testify?
Ms. Kinnaman: Sorry, Tessie Kinnaman again. I hope we do
go forward with this acquisition because I would expect a jury trial. It is only fair for
everybody. I do not think any of us could make a call whether...it is for the people,
period. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Before I call the meeting back to order, and I
guess it is you, Mauna Kea, I have a question about the use of those funds for special
counsel. I know it was discussed earlier, but I wanted some clarity. It is for
acquisition and administration, but it is not available for acquisition fees, including
special counsel or legal fees?
Mr. Trask: One second, I am sorry. For the record,
Mauna Kea Trask, County Attorney. Under the Section 19.1.5 of the Kaua`i County
Charter, this is "(c) Public Access Open Space & Natural Resources Preservation
Fund." It creates a special fund. "The moneys in the fund shall be utilized for
purchasing or otherwise inquiring lands and or property entitlements for land
conservation purposes in the County of Kaua`i for the following purposes," in relevant
part, "beach access." "The moneys for this fund may also be used for the payment of
interest, principle, premium, if any, with due respect to bonds issued. For the
payment and costs associated with the purchase, redemption, or refunding of such
bonds, at any given time"... this is (c)(3), "no more than five percent (5%) of this fund
shall be used for administrative expenses." That fund is within the Planning
Department and it is held within their budget.
Council Chair Rapozo: So where in that definition does it prohibit us
from using it for special counsel?
COUNCIL MEETING 97 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Trask: Well, you see, it does not define what
"administration" is, so I understand that there is a position that is funded with
administration, and I think "related costs for acquisition" meaning appraisals and
stuff like that would be appropriate under administration of the fund. It is an
accounting question and a legal question. Nothing says that it cannot be, but when
you look at budgeting and how the money goes within certain departments for certain
uses as approved by the Budget Ordinance, the Office of the County Attorney, which
is a different department, which does not have control or access to that fund
ordinarily, is the representative of the County Council. Under 8.5, I think, of the
Charter, we have to go to Council to get approval for special counsel. There is a
special fund within our budget that is a line item for special counsel.
Council Chair Rapozo: Right.
Mr. Trask: So the utilization of moneys within
departments can be moved around without Council approval, but between
departments, you have to come here for a money bill to move the money.
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes.
Mr. Trask: Because this is a special fund, it is my opinion
conservatively that that is not administration; that is special counsel fund. There is
another fund for special counsel for all cases and the only thing is, because like was
said earlier, this body is the policy-making body and controls the purse strings. When
questions of those kind of accounting come to me, I tend to be conservative.
Ultimately, accounting may differ, but I do not feel comfortable in looking at an audit
of that kind of use of those moneys. I would just rather come here and it seems more
clean to me...I am not an accounting guy, but I would ask you for a money bill for the
special counsel fund because that is what that fund is for, because it will be special
counsel under special counsel contract.
Council Chair Rapozo: Right, but if in fact, these acquisition of land
costs would include the hiring of special counsel, like your appraisal—it is from one
professional service to another.
Mr. Trask: Well, I would say that appraisal is necessary
to acquire the money. It is part of the administration...a position is necessary because
it is support for the Commission. Attorney hiring special counsel is not necessary for
acquisition. The Office of the County Attorney can do that...
Council Chair Rapozo: It is in a condemnation.
COUNCIL MEETING 98 AUGUST 9, 2017
Mr. Trask: I am saying special counsel, buying special
counsel services is not essential. What I am saying right now is that you do not have
enough muscle to do it in-house now, so you have to go special counsel.
Council Chair Rapozo: Right.
Mr. Trask: But that is not "normal administration" for
the Open Space Fund. You have to get special counsel every time you go to
condemnation. We could have otherwise done this if we did not have everything else
we need to do this year is what I am saying.
Council Chair Rapozo: Understood. Question?
Councilmember Yukimura: In the expenditure of the moneys for the
Sheehan property, we did not spend four hundred thousand dollars ($400,000) in
one (1) year...or three hundred thousand dollars ($300,000), which is what you said
was the amount. We would not need whatever we think it costs in totality necessarily
in the first year.
Mr. Trask: I cannot tell you how long this litigation
would take.
Councilmember Yukimura: Of course.
Mr. Trask: Condemnation litigation can take priority, so
it could be within one fiscal year, definitely.
Councilmember Yukimura: I would like to request the records, in terms of
time sequencing of the expenditure of the moneys for the Sheehan property.
Mr. Trask: It was over the course of many years. I can
tell you that right now.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, I would like to still get it anyway.
Mr. Trask: That is fine.
Councilmember Yukimura: Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any other questions? If not, thank you. I will
call the meeting back to order.
There being no objections, the meeting was called back to order, and proceeded
as follows:
COUNCIL MEETING 99 AUGUST 9, 2017
Councilmember Yukimura: Chair, I just have a process question. To move
ahead on this, we would schedule a public hearing on September 6, because that is a
requirement of the process? Is it not?
Council Chair Rapozo: It is not required.
Councilmember Yukimura: It is not required?
Council Chair Rapozo: We already had the public hearing.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, we had a public hearing already. So
today, we could move forward and approve the Resolution?
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes, we could. That is the motion that is on
the floor right now.
Councilmember Yukimura: Right. So we could do that, and then I
presume the County Attorney will then come to us to request special counsel and we
then need to fund an initial amount.
Council Chair Rapozo: I think before that it would get the veto.
Councilmember Yukimura: That is true.
Council Chair Rapozo: But that is something that...we talked about
it...it takes five (5) votes to override the veto. Councilmember Yukimura was
speaking and it struck me when she said that all the private owners have to do is put
up a fight, and then we are going to basically look away and say that we are not going
to push for that property because it is going to cost us money. That actually struck
me when she said it. That fund has a lot of money and I still question whether or not
we can use...this is no disrespect to the attorney, but I would ask that we definitely
do a thorough opinion on that one. I think that when the people voted for that fund
in the Charter that that fund was to include all expenses to acquire the property,
whatever the cost would be, whether it is an attorney or an appraiser or whatever.
The other thing that troubles me today from the hearings we have had in the past is
today it was all about the money and it was not about the difficulty of the path. It
was just about the money and that kind of frustrates me as well, because when we
look at the appraisal, and I do not know if it is confidential or what, but I will just say
that it is less than two hundred thousand dollars ($200,000), which I think is...when
you look at the fund balance in that account...I will not say...it is less than two
hundred thousand dollars ($200,000). For the legal fees, I guess that is up for debate
on how much it is going to cost. Is that landowner willing to go to war and spend a
lot of money on a part of his property that is already a drainage easement? I would
COUNCIL MEETING 100 AUGUST 9, 2017
like to hear more discussion from all of you, but I am beginning to feel like I want to
get this over with and move forward and deal with the veto if that comes up. I am
curious as to how the rest of you feel. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: Chair, I agree with you in terms of the
possibility of using the Open Space moneys for special counsel. I would like a real
thorough examination of that, because I think in this case, special counsel is
necessary in order to get to the acquisition and should come under the definition in
the Charter. I do not think that we will need the full amount in this fiscal year. So
as we have done, we always do an estimate and then we provide it in increments as
we get bills to pay. First of all, thank you to Tessie, Joseph, Tina, and Teddy for being
really clear what this is about, and it is moving ahead to acquire a public access that
has been used for generations. To put vacation renters over local fishermen just
makes no sense at all. I am hoping the Mayor will see the light and support this and
I am really quite disappointed in the Planning Department. But I think that the
decision is to be made by the Council and I think we need to stand with the people of
this island, and especially of the south shore. I, myself used to go to Po`ipu Beach
Park every Sunday; that was our family place to go and there were hardly any people
there. Times have changed and I recognize that, but it is also our job to provide for
the future. Everybody says in the campaign that public access is important, so it is
time to show the action that backs up those words.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Councilmember Chock.
Councilmember Chock: I think the thing that gets me is what Teddy
talks about in terms of principle. I have a hard time swallowing...I know money is
the issue that we are making a decision on, but I cannot get over that part of how we
cannot get access to the smallest things that make Kaua`i what it really truly is and
makes it special. Those are things that I think are worth fighting for. Based on
everything that I heard today, I will support moving on this, regardless of the cost.
Initially, I looked at this thing and one million dollars ($1,000,000) was just
unfathomable and I am feeling much better with the appraisal. It is still pretty up
there, but is worth fighting for and I think the precedent that it sets by us not moving
on it is something worth considering, as previously spoken about. This Council...well,
maybe not this Council...but our County Council has put money into people's pocket
through the litigation process and not have gotten anything in the past. At least for
this, the whole community will get something for it and I think that is something to
consider as well. If the decision needs to be made today, I am a "yes."
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Councilmember Brun,
Councilmember Brun: For me, talking to Mauna Kea here, trying to
figure out what is going on—I think the first initial estimate we had of one million
dollars ($1,000,000)was kind of high. In listening to testimony, I know it is important
COUNCIL MEETING 101 AUGUST 9, 2017
for the residents down there in Koloa. I do not fish or hunt and I would probably
never use that access anyways, but for those of you who come from that side, I respect
your thoughts. I will be supporting this today. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: I have a process question. So if it is approved
today, there will be no public hearing? It is just approved?
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes, then it will go across for the Mayor's
signature. I do not know what he will do, I guess it is depending on the number of
votes.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Okay.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa is excused because
he does have a memorandum, I think excused until 2:30 p.m., but we are going to go
ahead and move forward.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: For me, I am torn on it. Especially being from
Koloa, I am even more torn on it. I think when this issue came up the first time, we
had a lot of testimony on both sides and there were a lot on both sides from Koloa.
This time, we have not really heard much on it. I think we have a closer cost, but I
am not that comfortable as far as hearing from the public on it. I would have loved
to have heard another crack at it from everyone because I know that when it was on
the agenda the first time we had a lot of testimony on it. With that said, I am very
torn on this. I guess for me, I think of it in a way that you can say, "Yes, Kukui`ula
Beach is there and there is great access, and it is overrun; Po`ipu Beach is there, has
public access, and is overrun." Then you have this little spot here where I am sure
some fishermen still go and walk out there and we have some people that still use it.
I guess I am fighting with if we allow this access, is that area going to get overrun,
too, and then these folks are going to lose that type of special place that they had? I
know right now people still do go there and they use it as their own private area and
fishermen can go there, but I am kind of torn. I guess I did not hear enough testimony
from fishermen that fish there or have fished there, as far as them not being able to
access it at all. What if there is people on that beach all of the time when they want
to go fishing there? I am kind of under the impression of not voting for it right now,
just because I have not heard...I know that there was a lot of people that testified
against it earlier based on the cost and we just have not heard much this time. I
understand that at one point, I think it was a very important access because
Kukui`ula Beach was not that great. Since then, things have changed. I see a lot of
people using Kukui`ula Beach and it is easy to access. That would have been another
place to go and I would love to hear more from the public on it. But of course, we are
not going to have that opportunity considering the costs involved. If we could use
COUNCIL MEETING 102 AUGUST 9, 2017
Open Space money for it, I would probably be more in favor of it. Again, at this time
right now, I do not know if I am comfortable voting on it.
Council Chair Rapozo: Anyone else? Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I think Councilmember Kaneshiro raises
some key questions with respect to public access, because it is a double-edged sword
and it can get overcrowded very quickly. I do not think that can be the reason to not
do it, especially if the main people who have access to it are going to be visitors, rather
than people who live on this island. I personally would prefer that we not publicize
it as a "public access," if possible, and maybe we need to explore because it is not an
issue just for this thing, but it is about public access management and how we could
do that. The other thing is that it is the question that is supposed to be addressed in
the General Plan, which is what is the sustainable-level of visitors to this island?
That has really not been thoroughly vetted, so because that is the real question—how
many visitors can this island handle? Actually, how much population growth can this
island handle as well? Those questions we hardly talk about, although we should be
talking about it, and maybe we will have a chance to talk about it in the General
Plan, as well as understanding those reservations and it would get even more complex
if there were major natural habitats in the area. I think the way is not to just back
down, but to actually face it as a management issue and try to figure out how to
handle it.
(Councilmember Kagawa was noted as present.)
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else? Councilmember
Kane shiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Again, to make my position clear, which I
know I am wavering on, but again, it is exactly a double-edged sword. I hunt, but I
do not fish that much. Everybody has picked maile and mokihana and I think when
you have that special place, you try not to go and make a big trail and show everybody
where it is and then everybody goes there. That is what I am fighting with right now.
If we open this place up, are the fishermen really going to get the access and what
they want? For me, as a hunter in my experience, I would say that I would rather
not have the access so that it is harder for people to get to and when I want to go
there, it is probably going to not have people there. So that is my position on it for
this particular access. This is not for all of the access, but for this particular access,
that is my stance on it.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Brun.
Councilmember Brun: Chair, I have a question. So the motion was
to just straight-out approve it or was it to be scheduled for a public hearing?
COUNCIL MEETING 103 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: No, to approve.
Councilmember Brun: Straight-out approve? Okay. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: We have had numerous opportunities to
testify. We have had public hearings and we have had petitions submitted. But the
bottom line is that this is one of those issues that are split down the middle and it is
one of those issues that you just have to make the call. If we have another public
hearing, I do not believe the results would be any different than we have had. It is
just that we have had a lot of discussion on this matter. Anyone else want to have
discussion before we call for the vote? I still cannot count, so I do not know where
this thing is going to go, but I will say that last night at our community meeting in
Hanalei, it dawned on me that we are losing this island and maybe it changed me a
little bit last night when I heard our federal leaders, our federal departments, just
"writing off our cultural assets" is what I called it last night, just "whatever." The
Hanalei lookout is a gem, a landmark for this island and for this State really, and for
them, it was just a lookout. The taro farmers in the valley were just farmers. They
were not halo farmers or were not here before the Fish and Wildlife Service came. To
them, it was just, "Sorry." What I got out of it was, "You are just an inconvenience
for us and you are in the way of our birds." That is what I got out of it last night.
What is even more troubling is that some of the audience agreed with that. Some of
the audience had no connection to these places; none, zero. It was just a tangible item
that sat there, that it was okay if we lost it. Then I look at this and listening to Tessie
and Tina and just thinking, "No, it is not okay," because if we are going to use cost as
the reason, and I think Councilmember Yukimura made this perfectly clear, we will
never get back the accesses that we have lost. That is what this is; this is an access
that we have lost. As long as we can conveniently find the excuse of money, forget it;
we are not going to get it back. I think Councilmember Chock talked about the
principle of this, that this is a drainage easement and that landowner has absolutely
no use for. They cannot do anything on a drainage easement. Maybe it will impact
his privacy. I read all of the testimonies and petitions and I was quite surprised at
how many people actually still use that beach and that area for fishing and diving. I
do not know...I have not fished for a long time...I probably will never use that access,
like Councilmember Brun. But I know that if we do not stand firm on our "cultural
assets," is what I will call them, then the cost of our inaction today is going to be much
greater than the cost of this acquisition. That is how I feel today. I think last night
played a big role because I was not prepared to support this today. I will be honest
with you. I was not going to support this today, but I am really getting the feeling...it
is not a fun feeling...it is a very frustrating feeling that we are just being run over
and I think it is time that enough is enough. Again, the appraisal came back a lot
less than I thought it would, so I do not think cost is the issue. I think this is one
access that aside from the cost is a "low-hanging fruit" that we need to go and get, so
I will be supporting this today. With that, roll call.
COUNCIL MEETING 104 AUGUST 9, 2017
The motion for adoption of Resolution No. 2016-60 was then put, and carried
by the following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kawakami,
Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL — 6,
AGAINST ADOPTION: Kaneshiro TOTAL — 1,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
SCOTT K. SATO, Deputy County Clerk: Six (6) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Next item, please.
Mr. Sato: The next item is on the middle of page 5,
Resolution No. 2017-40.
Resolution No. 2017-40 - RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL
APPOINTMENT TO THE CHARTER REVIEW COMMISSION(Virginia M. Kapali):
Councilmember Kagawa moved for adoption of Resolution No. 2017-40, seconded by
Councilmember Yukimura.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion for adoption of Resolution No. 2017-40 was then put, and carried
by the following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL — 7,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Next item, please.
COUNCIL MEETING 105 AUGUST 9, 2017
Resolution No. 2017-41 - RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL
APPOINTMENT TO THE CHARTER REVIEW COMMISSION
(Galen T. Nakamura): Councilmember Yukimura moved for adoption of
Resolution No. 2017-41, seconded by Councilmember Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
Councilmember Kagawa: Yes. I just want to say that I am very elated
with the two (2) Charter Review Commission appointments. I was kind of worried
that we just were filling it with willing and able bodies, but the Charter Review
Commission, with a new election coming up, is a new opportunity for charter
amendments to appear on the ballot. I am very happy with Gini and Galen being on
this commission at this time. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you, Councilmember Kagawa. I think
you speak for all of us. Any further discussion? Roll call?
The motion for adoption of Resolution No. 2017-41 was then put, and carried
by the following vote:
FOR ADOPTION: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL — 7,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Next item, please.
Resolution No. 2017-42 - RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL
APPOINTMENT TO THE FIRE COMMISSION (Alfred Levinthol): Councilmember
Yukimura moved for adoption of Resolution No. 2017-42, seconded by Councilmember
Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
The motion for adoption of Resolution No. 2017-42 was then put, and carried
by the following vote:
COUNCIL MEETING 106 AUGUST 9, 2017
FOR ADOPTION: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL — 7,
AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Next item.
BILL FOR FIRST READING:
Proposed Draft Bill (No. 2661) — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE TO AMEND
CHAPTER 16 OF THE KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED, RELATING
TO THE TRAFFIC CODE: Councilmember Kagawa moved for passage of Proposed
Draft Bill (No. 2661) on first reading, that it be ordered to print, that a public hearing
thereon be scheduled for September 6, 2017, and referred to the Public Works /Parks
& Recreation Committee, seconded by Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
Councilmember Kagawa: Yes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Go ahead.
Councilmember Kagawa: I want to just thank you, Chair, for doing the
initiative of hearing a concern from the State. The buses are struggling right now
with our public school system statewide. What we need when we grapple with
difficult problems is efficiency, and if the head of the Department of Education bus
service has told you that this is a way to make it more efficient, I thank you for
proposing this change. We certainly do not need to have bus problems amongst other
problems that we have on the island. Thank you, Chair.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: I, too, want to thank you, Chair and
Councilmember Brun, who was involved apparently, because this does seem to be an
effort to increase efficiency without sacrificing safety or any of those considerations.
It is a good move and we still of course have to have a public hearing, but thank you
for the initiative in introducing this Bill.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. I would love to take all of the
credit, but I was the back-up, second string. Councilmember Brun went to meet with
COUNCIL MEETING 107 AUGUST 9, 2017
the person and he was unavailable, so I was trailing in the back and he called me to
see if I could meet with the person. The State person made it very clear and he said
that he has been trying to do this for a long time with the County. Of course, I called
our staff and asked if they could do some research and this was the solution.
Sometimes things work in government and this is one of them. Thank you for the
accolades, but Councilmember Brun was the one who made the connection. With
that, roll call.
The motion for passage of Proposed Draft Bill (No. 2661) on first reading, that
it be ordered to print, that a public hearing thereon be scheduled for
September 6, 2017, and referred to the Public Works / Parks & Recreation
Committee was then put, and carried by the following vote:
FOR PASSAGE: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL— 7,
AGAINST PASSAGE: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Next item, please.
BILLS FOR SECOND READING:
Bill No. 2658, Draft 1 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
CHAPTER 5A, ARTICLE 11 AND 11A, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS
AMENDED, RELATING TO REAL PROPERTY TAX: Councilmember Yukimura
moved to approve Bill No. 2658, Draft 1, on second and final reading, and that it be
transmitted to the Mayor for his approval, seconded by Councilmember Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any discussion or public testimony?
There being no objections, the rules were suspended to take public testimony.
There being no one present to provide testimony, the meeting was called back
to order, and proceeded as follows:
Council Chair Rapozo: Seeing none, roll call.
The motion to approve Bill No. 2658, Draft 1, on second and final reading, and
that it be transmitted to the Mayor for his approval was then put, and carried by
the following vote:
COUNCIL MEETING 108 AUGUST 9, 2017
FOR APPROVAL: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL — 7,
AGAINST APPROVAL: None TOTAL — 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
Council Chair Rapozo: Last item.
Bill No. 2659, Draft 1 — A BILL FOR AN ORDINANCE AMENDING
CHAPTER 5A, SECTION 5A-11A.1, KAUAI COUNTY CODE 1987, AS AMENDED,
RELATING TO THE BENEFICIAL TAX RATE FOR PROPERTY USED FOR
LONG-TERM AFFORDABLE RENTAL: Councilmember Yukimura moved to
approve Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, on second and final reading, and that it be transmitted
to the Mayor for his approval, seconded by Councilmember Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Discussion? Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: Between the Committee Meeting last week,
and this meeting, I got a call from Marsha Ota, who is a landlord, inquiring about
what the rates were going to be for this coming 2018. That caused Legislative Analyst
Yvette Sahut and I to take a look at the language and we realized that what we passed
out of committee was not really what I think all intended that for this coming year it
be set by the midpoint and all the things we did. Instead, it tied it to the established
2015 rental limit and we wanted the 2015 to be a floor, but we wanted the rents to be
able to go up based on the ninety percent (90%). Thank you to Yvette who found that.
We developed an amendment to reflect what I think we all wanted and intended for
the 2018 to be set at the ninety percent (90%), which we define as the midpoint. We
went over that during the last meeting. It does not change anything or the consensus
from the Committee Meeting; it just makes the words align with our intention.
Councilmember Yukimura moved to amend Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, as
circulated, and as shown in the Floor Amendment, which is attached hereto
as Attachment 1, seconded by Councilmember Brun.
Council Chair Rapozo: Any further discussion on the amendment?
Councilmember Kaneshiro.
Councilmember Kaneshiro: Did you say that the Administration was okay
with it?
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes. Thank you for asking. We even passed
it by Steve and he assisted us, as he always does. Do you need to say anything?
COUNCIL MEETING 109 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: This is really a housekeeping measure. I
appreciate staff and Councilmember Yukimura for catching it and fixing it.
Councilmember Yukimura: Yes, because it would have been a problem if
it had passed.
Council Chair Rapozo: Yes. With that, any other discussion?
The motion to amend Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, as circulated, and as shown in the
Floor Amendment, which is attached hereto as Attachment 1 was then put,
and unanimously carried.
Council Chair Rapozo: We are back to the main motion. Any public
testimony? I will suspend the rules.
There being no objections, the rules were suspended.
Ms. Sakamoto: Good afternoon Chair Rapozo, Vice Chair
Kagawa, and Councilmembers. My name is Tina Sakamoto. I have good news and
not so good news. First, the good news. It finally appears that after much discussion,
this Bill, Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, is finally moving towards a plan to promote the
County's affordable housing program in partnership with participating landowners.
The Bill will be reviewed, monitored, and evaluated next year, especially in the light
of HUD's change in methodology, and timing and release of the fair market rents.
Now, the not so good news. I would like to share an incident with you. During a
caption break at last week's public hearing regarding this Bill, I was uninvitingly
approached by an upper-level County administrator, just outside the door here. This
person showed me a list of properties, made statements about my taxes, and asked
some personal information. It was completely uncalled for, totally inappropriate
actions. Why was I singled out? Was this an attempt to intimidate me? Was it an
attempt to interfere with my testimony? A public hearing is an official way for an
individual to participate in this legislative process and to be heard in a non-
confrontational, non-threatening environment. While our opinions may differ, our
common goal should be to reach a solution for the betterment of Kaua`i. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Anyone else? If not, I will call the
meeting back to order. Go ahead.
There being no further testimony, the meeting was called back to order, and
proceeded as follows:
Councilmember Yukimura: I planned this before today, but I want to
really acknowledge Tina Sakamoto for her fearless and unceasing effort to get a
COUNCIL MEETING 110 AUGUST 9, 2017
solution to this problem of inversion and rates that was being problematic for our
goals. It has been a very delicate balancing act, but it is through the dialogue that
Tina just described, the kind of dialogue at a public hearing where citizens are able
to come forward, express their concerns, propose their ideas, and have the
Administration and the Council review it, and go through the dialogue here with
other public comments, etcetera. Tina really deserves credit for the Bill that is before
us today, and I know that it is not perfect in her eyes, but it is better, and we are
going to monitor it and see how things work. I think we owe Tina a lot and I apologize
for...I am not exactly familiar with what happened, but if she was in any way
intimidated or was the subject of some negative response then that does not sound
really appreciative of what she has done for us. I am hoping that we can have the
kind of dialogue that she described in terms of our citizens, Council, and
Administration all working together to come to solutions that work for this
community.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kagawa.
Councilmember Kagawa: I just want to thank Tina, and there was Kako
before. When this first came up four (4) years ago, it came up because the
qualifications for getting the affordable housing tax break was that your rent would
have to decrease in comparison to the prior year, and four (4) years ago, we just heard
that and said, "Wow, that does not make sense." That is why the work had begun
because we had the potential of people dropping out. It is a program meant to
basically provide for renters an opportunity to save some real property taxes and not
burden the renters with the higher tax rates and keep it basically as a rental home
for a long-term rental, basically our local people of Kaua`i that work here that do not
own a home and would like their own privacy and cannot afford to buy at the present
time. I think just balancing that is basically a Council act, and thanks to people like
her, who are willing to try and improve things on Kaua`i—I think we should be
appreciative of that. Many times, we have legislation that is not done or is done and
then in hindsight, a lot of the local people, because of their nature, will say, "Wow,
that was not a good move, we should have done this." But a lot of times, they tend to
just stay in the background and rely on us just making the decisions when we do not
have all of the general feeling of the local community. It is difficult at times to not
have that participation that we really need in order to get the best decisions. Thank
you, Tina, for all you have done, also Kako, and all of the good work that came about
four (4) years ago that we have continued to go about. This year, while I had hoped
for a little more aggressive approach the first time, I do agree that it could, on the
backend, hurt our main intent to help the eighty (80) year olds and below. Therefore,
I am willing to support this measure, and hopefully, with the feedback that we get
based on participation numbers, see if that needs adjustment or not. Hopefully, we
can get information like, "What are the average rents under the program now that
we change it to ninety percent (90%)?" That kind of information would be helpful. I
do not know if, by privacy, we are allowed to receive all of that actual information.
COUNCIL MEETING 111 AUGUST 9, 2017
But certainly at some point, it is always good to see the results of our amendments of
our changes and see whether it needs tweaking in order to make things even better.
We are just trying to attack the affordable housing problem. We all feel here that
that is one of the main objectives of our role here on the Council table. But by not
doing anything, we are not helping the problem, and by doing something like this, I
believe we are taking a proactive step. Thank you, Chair.
Council Chair Rapozo: Councilmember Kawakami.
Councilmember Kagawa: Thank you, Mr. Chair. To the amendment, I
fully support the amendment and thank you for catching this housekeeping item so
that we can bring some clarity, which is what we asked for at the beginning of this
measure. To the advocates, the Sakamoto's and everybody else that came before us,
we really look to the public, especially these folks that specialize on these particular
items as resources and we depend on those resources to give us information. A lot of
the information that we get is through the public process, like these Council meetings
and these public hearings, and we try to be as welcoming as possible. I would just
like to remind all of us that these seats that we occupy are the people's seats. We do
not own these seats. The people put us here; they own these seats. We are just the
voice that carries their wishes. From the Administration's standpoint, we are all
public servants. We are paid by taxpayers. So I am not going to make any
assumptions on the intent of what was said, but I would just like to remind ourselves
that in this day and age, civility goes a long way and that we should constantly
remind ourselves that this is the people's Council and this is the people's government
and we are here to be public servants. So with that being said, I would like to
reiterate that we welcome all people to provide testimony and we would like to create
an environment which is safe and where people feel that they can express their
opinions, whether it is positive or negative. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. Any other discussion before we
move to take the vote? If not, I would like to thank you, Tina. I think much has been
said already, but I will also echo the appreciation we have had. Councilmember
Kagawa and I started this process a while back with Tina and she has done...I do not
know how many hours you have put in this, but I know it is a lot more than I have
and I a lot more than I believe some of the people in the Administration have as far
as this specific issue. I thank you for doing that work for us. It is so much easier for
us on the Council—and I will speak for myself, but I think I speak for everyone—but
when we look at the charts and we look at the background data, when we look at
everything when it is so nicely placed, it is so much easier for us and our staff to put
legislation together with facts that back-up the measures. Thank you for doing that.
I am troubled and we are sorry that you had to go through what you went through
last week. It troubles me because we try to encourage people to come and testify and
Councilmember Kawakami hit it on the spot that we all are public servants. I do not
know what is being done about what happened to you, but I am going to ask that one
COUNCIL MEETING 112 AUGUST 9, 2017
of our staff members see you before you leave today, because I will follow-up to make
sure that something at least gets investigated. If anything inappropriate occurred
that something happened...that is completely unacceptable for anyone that comes on
that side of the aisle. We get it and we choose this career, this job, and with that
comes the criticism from the public, but you do not. You are a member of the public,
like everyone else that comes and testifies and there should be some sort of protection
that surrounds you in and out of this building. For an administrator, a
Councilmember, or anyone to go up and treat a member of the public that way is just
not acceptable in my book. I will ask that we follow through. Steve is here today, so
I am sure that he is hearing all of this as well. I am not sure if he is aware, he was
not here last week, so we know it is not Steve. It is just unacceptable. There is so
much going on in my head right now, but I will just leave it at that. It is unacceptable
and it needs to be addressed. I will say that if you get bothered by this person again,
you call the police, because that is harassment. This is a public place. You come here,
you testify, and you say what you want to. No one deserves to be harassed. If it
happens again, my advice to you is to just call the police. Again, that is just
unacceptable. Councilmember Yukimura.
Councilmember Yukimura: In addition to thanking Tina, I do want to
thank you, who introduced the Bill, and Vice Chair, who has also been working on
this, but you put it forward and it really forced us to look for the solution. I appreciate
that and I also want to thank Steve Hunt, who has been very cooperative and helpful
in the technicalities of this and also helping us assess the impacts. It has been a
collective effort and hopefully the beneficiary is the public, the landlords, and the
renters, and hopefully we are charting the middle course that is going to be positive
for both. Thank you.
Council Chair Rapozo: Thank you. My first draft was a disaster
waiting to happen, so it was really Steve, the Department of Finance, Tina folks, and
everybody. I think this will work and we will see what happens. With that, roll call.
The motion to approve Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, as amended, to Bill No. 2659,
Draft 2, on second and final reading, and that it be transmitted to the Mayor for
his approval was then put, and carried by the following vote:
FOR APPROVAL: Brun, Chock, Kagawa, Kaneshiro,
Kawakami, Yukimura, Rapozo TOTAL— 7,
AGAINST APPROVAL: None TOTAL— 0,
EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0,
RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL— 0.
Mr. Sato: Seven (7) ayes.
COUNCIL MEETING 113 AUGUST 9, 2017
Council Chair Rapozo: With that being the last item, this meeting is
adjourned.
ADJOURNMENT.
There being no further business, the Council Meeting adjourned at 3:01 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
SCOTT K. SATO
Deputy County Clerk
:ct
ATTACHMENT 1
(August 9, 2017)
FLOOR AMENDMENT
Bill No. 2659, Draft 1 Relating To A Bill For An Ordinance Amending Chapter 5A,
Section 5A-11A.1, Kaua`i County Code 1987, As Amended, Relating To The
Beneficial Tax Rate For Property Used For Long-Term Affordable Rental
Introduced By: JOANN A. YUKIMURA
Amend Bill No. 2659, Draft 1, in its entirety to read as follows:
"BE IT ORDAINED BY THE COUNCIL OF THE COUNTY OF KAUAI, STATE
OF HAWAII:
SECTION 1. Chapter 5A, Kaua`i County Code 1987, as amended, is
hereby amended by amending Section 5A-11A.1 to read as follows:
"Sec. 5A-11A.1 Beneficial Tax Rate for Property Used for Long-Term
Affordable Rental.
(a) Definitions. As used in this Section:
"Dwelling" means a building or portion thereof designed or used
exclusively for residential occupancy and having all necessary facilities for
permanent residency such as living, sleeping, cooking, eating and sanitation.
"Long-term affordable rental" means a dwelling subject to a written
lease agreement with a term of one (1) year or more and at a monthly rent
not to exceed the maximum housing cost based on [eighty percent (80%) of
the Kaua`i median household income as set forth in the Kaua`i County
Housing Agency Affordable Rental Housing Guideline] the long-term
affordable rental limit for the year in which the owner files his or her
application.
"Long-term affordable rental limit" means the midpoint of the
maximum rental limits for each unit type using between eighty percent (80%)
and one hundred percent (100%) of the Kaua`i median household income as
defined by the Kaua`i County Housing Agency Rental Housing Guidelines.
(b) Any owner who owns real property that is rented or leased as a
long-term affordable rental shall receive the homestead tax rate as provided
in Sec. 5A-6.4 provided that all dwellings on the property are long-term
affordable rentals or owner-occupied.
(c) The owner may apply for the beneficial tax rate on a single year
or multi-year basis. An owner with a multi-year written lease agreement
may apply to receive the beneficial tax rate for each year that the lease
agreement is in effect up to a maximum of three (3) years, provided that rent
in each year of the lease does not exceed the long term affordable rental
limits at the time of application. For each subsequent year of the multi-year
lease, the owner shall file by September 30th, an annual affidavit confirming
the unit(s) is still being rented at the specified rent level in accordance with
the multi-year lease agreement. At the expiration of the multi-year
beneficial tax period, the owner may file a new application to receive the
ATTACHMENT 1
beneficial tax rate as long as the property adheres to the long term affordable
rental requirements at the time of the new application.
(d) The owner shall file his or her application annually in a form
prescribed by the Director of Finance by September 30th prior to the fiscal
year beginning July 1st for the beneficial tax rate. The owner shall notify the
Director of Finance within thirty (30) calendar days if the property is no
longer being rented or leased as a long-term affordable rental due to the sale
of the property or conversion to short-term rental. Should there be a change
in the use as a long-term affordable rental, the beneficial tax rate shall be
automatically revoked and all differences in the amount of taxes that should
be due for the remainder of the tax year without the beneficial tax rate shall
become due and payable.
(e) For the [2017] 2018 tax year, any owner who owns real property
that is rented or leased as a long-term affordable rental may apply for the
beneficial tax rate for Long Term Affordable Rental provided that the
monthly rent amount stated in their written lease agreement [is at or below
the rates established by the Kaua`i County Housing Agency Affordable
Rental Housing Guideline for the 2015 tax year. The owner shall file an
application with the Department of Finance, Real Property Tax Assessment
Division by September 30, 2016.] does not exceed the most current long-term
affordable rental limit established by the Department of Finance, Real
Property Tax Assessment Division or the previously established 2015 rental
limit, whichever is higher. The owner shall file an application with the
Department of Finance, Real Property Tax Assessment Division by
September 30, 2017. Hereafter, the long-term affordable rental limit shall be
determined by the Department of Finance, Real Property Tax Assessment
Division by October 1st using the most current Kaua`i County Housing
Agency Affordable Rental Housing Guidelines, provided that the 2015 tax
year rates shall be set as the minimum floor for the County's Long-Term
Affordable Rental Program.
(f) The Director may adopt rules and prescribe forms."
SECTION 2. If any provision of this Ordinance or the application
thereof to any person, persons, or circumstances is held invalid, the invalidity does
not affect the other provisions or applications of this Ordinance which can be given
effect without the invalid provision or application, and to this end, the provisions of
this Ordinance are severable.
SECTION 3. Ordinance material to be repeal is bracketed. New
Ordinance material is underscored. When revising, compiling, or printing this
Ordinance for inclusion in the Kaua`i County Code 1987, as amended, the brackets,
bracketed material, and underscoring shall not be included.
SECTION 4. This Ordinance shall take effect upon approval."
(Material to be deleted is bracketed. New material is underscored.)
V:\AMENDMENTS\2017\08-9-2017 Bill No. 2659 Long Term Affordable YS_ct.doc