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HomeMy WebLinkAbout02/23/2011 Regular Council MeetingCOUNCIL MEETING February 23, 2011 The Council Meeting of the Council of the County of Kauai was called to order by Council Chair Jay Furfaro at the Council Chambers, 3371 -A Wilcox Road, Lihu`e, Kauai, on Wednesday, February 23, 2011 at 9:08 a.m. Council Chair Furfaro: Aloha, good morning, I'd like to call to order the council meeting of February 23, 2011. I would like to acknowledge that Mr. Rapozo is traveling on business and is out of state and is excused from today's meeting. So Mr. Clerk. PETER A. NAKAMURA, County Clerk: Roll call, Mr. Chair. The following members answered the call of the roll: Honorable Tim Bynum Honorable Dickie Chang Honorable Derek S. K. Kawakami Honorable Nadine K. Nakamura Honorable JoAnn A. Yukimura Honorable Jay Furfaro, Council Chair EXCUSED: Honorable Mel Rapozo APPROVAL OF AGENDA. Mr. Bynum moved to approve the agenda as circulated, seconded by Mr. Kawakami, and unanimously carried. MINUTES of the following meetings of the Council: Special Council Meeting of January 25, 2011 Council Meeting of January 26, 2011 Ms. Yukimura moved to approve the minutes as circulated, seconded by Mr. Chang, and unanimously carried. COMMUNICATIONS: Council Chair Furfaro: I believe we can go to the next communication or do we have a change of order. (Inaudible.) Mr. Dill, I'm going to make an exception for the two of you being here. We're going to go to the roads item first on today's agenda. I'm going to ask the clerk to first read the item, though. Mr. Nakamura: Mr. Chair, we're on page two of the council's agenda on Communication C 2011 -76: C 2011 -76 Communication (02/16/2011) from Council Chair Furfaro, requesting the Administration's presence to provide the Council with an update on the County's Islandwide Road Resurfacing Program. COUNCIL MEETING - 2 - February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. First of all members, I just asked to revisit this agenda item as we do have a new chief engineer. Welcome, Mr. Dill, I don't know if this is your first opportunity to be in front of us since you've been the chief engineer. LARRY DILL, County Engineer: It is. Council Chair Furfaro: But we're delighted to have you with us today. I also want to point out that as we move forward on this item, there are regular requirements for the engineering department to be in front of us to give us these types of updates. So on that note, I will suspend the rules and allow you to have the floor. There being no objection, the rules were suspended. Mr. Dill: Okay, thank you, and I'm delighted to be here also, thank you. We've just passed out to you some information. (Inaudible.) Mr. Dill: Oh, I'm sorry, for the record my name's Larry Dill, county engineer. We passed out to you our proposed road resurfacing list for the fiscal year 2009 -2010, so you have that in front of you. We've also passed out to you a few proposed additive items to that in a separate list including Maluhia Road, Papalina, Maka Road, Po`ipu Road, and Puu Road. So this is our list we will shortly be going to the administration to request their approval and concurrence with for our list of upcoming projects. And also just as a matter of information, we've also passed out an attachment regarding an application package called Micropaver. We've been reviewing in -house how we select the roads that would come up for resurfacing and repair in the county, and we want to formalize the procedure and add a little more information to it. So we have a large database of information with the status of all the roads in the county. By using Micropaver we could consolidate that information into an organized fashion and generate these lists with a lot more practicality to it, a lot more basis for it, and be able to present this list to you as opposed to in the past when perhaps it was done based on a bunch of information that was similar but not, perhaps, as thoroughly cataloged and organized. Council Chair Furfaro: So, Mr. Dill, I do want to say I really appreciate the fact that you're introducing new systems to have this process identified more on an as- needed schedule and also, I would hope, in some format that actually sets a timeline for the length of time a road goes through its resurfacing schedule based on information about wear, tear, amount of transport on the road. But I do want to point out, and this is something that I do and it's kind of hung with me since I was the finance chair, we are now in February, this is the road schedule for 2009 -2010, which we only have about four months to finish. I also want to point out that if I evaluate the highway funds, and we only have the financials for six months, the other members will see them later today when we get an update on the financials, we are actually about $1,671,000.00 under the budgeted amount. And I have to make an assumption it's because we haven't done any roadwork in six months. Would you say that I'm interpreting the numbers appropriately to what the schedule was? COUNCIL MEETING - 3 - February 23, 2011 Mr. Dill: I'm going to ask our roads chief to help me with this one. Council Chair Furfaro: Have him come up and join you. Mr. Dill: Yeah. ED RENAUD, Chief of Field Operations and Maintenance, Highway Division: Good morning, Council Chair and councilmembers, Ed Renaud, Roads. Could you repeat the question, please? Council Chair Furfaro: Sure, let me just give you what I read off the financials and I'm reading financials only for six months. We had budgeted for the highway division about $5.5 million through this period of time. Obviously that's all cumulative cost: payroll, in -house pothole repairs, and so forth, that's not just the paving. We are about $1.6 million in your operating budget below what we should be at this first six months. Is it because we have not addressed any road paving to date? I mean if you're not sure, I'd rather send the question and let you evaluate it. Mr. Renaud: Okay, I think you should send the question. This way we can have a clear understanding of what happened, please. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, okay. I just wanted to know financially... we obviously want to have a budget, which is our plan, but we also want to live within the budget. So I'm assuming some of this road resurfacing list has not hit your budget for the first six months. Is that a correct assumption? Mr. Renaud: I would say yes. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, okay, good. See, you can stay right there, Ed. So let me ask other members if they have some questions on your proposal first, so. Councilwoman Yukimura. Ms. Yukimura: Yes, thank you, good morning. Your submittal here shows IWR 2009 -2010. So IWR stands for what? Mr. Renaud: Islandwide resurfacing. Ms. Yukimura: Islandwide resurfacing, okay, and 2009 -2010 is actually two fiscal years ago, right? Mr. Renaud: Correct. Ms. Yukimura: So how does the schedule work or the timeframe? We appropriated moneys in 2009 during the budget process for that year that's coming, 2009 -2010, but we didn't spend any money during that year? Is that what happened. Mr. Renaud: I cannot really... Council Chair Furfaro: Excuse me, let me just clarify. We haven't spent any money, not in that year, but specifically on road resurfacing. Ms. Yukimura: That's correct. COUNCIL MEETING - 4 - February 23, 2011 Mr. Renaud: Yeah, the thing is I cannot really explain that because I'm brand new into here, and after researching and everything and sitting down with the county engineer and the deputy county engineer, what we are trying to do is move forward at a faster rate, okay. And I think whatever happened then, I cannot answer, but the thing is we want to go forward. Ms. Yukimura: Okay. So that's really good to have a goal to move faster because this indicates that it was pretty slow for whatever reason. And so what is your intention then because do you have moneys from 2010 -2011, like for this fiscal year that we're almost over 50% through, pau, you know? Mr. Renaud: Yeah, with this estimated amount and I'm not going to say it out loud, I believe it's going to come in lower if this was the exact number that was going to go out and plus an additive we put in there. The additive is for health and safety of roads that really need to be reconstructed and whatnot that we missed and of completes and everything and this is why there's an additive. I don't know if you have that info, but we did pass it out. Ms. Yukimura: Yes. Mr. Renaud: Okay, so the thing is if we put all this in and they are ... per that number there, we have about $1.4 plus million left. So with that number we can go back out and do the 2010 -2011. Okay, so it all depends on what's going to happen here. If it comes in low, which I believe it will because the two contractors that always come in (inaudible), they've been calling, they've been doing everything, you know, they need work, they need work. So I think when this goes out, it's going to be a good bid whereby we can do more roads for the 2010 -2011. Ms. Yukimura: So you're saying that there is some money from 2010 -2011 and that would be a second issue in terms of a bid request. Mr. Renaud: Yeah, I think when I looked at the budget we had something like $13 million something and after doing the minuses and the pluses, this is what we came up with. Ms. Yukimura: You have $13 million for road resurfacing? Mr. Renaud: Correct, total from the past years, yeah. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so for this round, you're planning to spend $5 million? Mr. Renaud: Correct. Ms. Yukimura: $5.4 million? Mr. Renaud: Yeah, it's going to cover 2008 -2009, which we didn't go out, so that's why it's larger. Ms. Yukimura: 2008 -2009? Mr. Renaud: Yeah, 08 -09. Ms. Yukimura: We didn't go out for '08-'09? COUNCIL MEETING - 5 - February 23, 2011 Mr. Renaud: the '09-'10. Ms. Yukimura: for about five years? No. I'm saying we did not get that, so '08209 is in Are you saying that we haven't been repaving roads Mr. Renaud: I'm not going to answer that. We've been paving, but I think we'were behind and like I said I'm going to have to research it. Council Chair Furfaro: Excuse me. The (inaudible) proviso in the budget, so that you know and I know you knew this, you require council approval. Mr. Renaud: Correct. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, so I want to make sure we're just being real honest with each other. Now, if you answered Councilwoman Yukimura's questions and said for some reason we went out to bid, we weren't satisfied with the numbers or something, I can understand that, but we did some paving work. But, you know, we're first trying to reconcile 2009 -2010 and then we are currently in 2010 -2011. Mr. Renaud: Correct. Council Chair Furfaro: So were there problems with the bid? Mr. Renaud: I cannot answer that. Like I said earlier I was not there, but the thing is when I look at all the past resurfacing we have completed and this is what I came up with. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, staff, could you advise someone from the Finance Department that I would like someone to come over and address that 2009 -2010 carryover and to identify the reserve that we currently have in the current year for 2010 -2011. We'll do it that way then. Councilwoman, thank you for yielding the floor to me to get that clarified, but we'll get finance over. Ms. Yukimura: Thank you for the clarification. I mean I think our goal is ... everyone agrees on our goal that we want to get our roads paved and we want to do it in a timely way so that it's not more expensive than it would be if we did it in a preventive maintenance mode. So I appreciate that you're looking at a new system to help us do that more objectively. And I do acknowledge that you are both new and I appreciate the new energy and the new perspective. So I have a few more questions then. So this list that you've submitted along with the addendums are for the first... it is for an issuance of five, actually with the addendums it's like about $5.7... $5.8 million and that there's another about $7 million that would go out to bid in a second round. No? Well, you said there are $13 million in the road fund, road repaving? Mr. Renaud: No, we have... Ms. Yukimura: Excuse me, then I misheard. Mr. Renaud: Excuse me, unless I'm missing something, we have that five point something and if you minus the additive I put in ... there's another sheet, we would have about $1.4 million left if the bids come in at this price. Ms. Yukimura: Okay. COUNCIL MEETING - 6 - February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: Just for everybody's clarification, Mr. Dill, I would like you to write down this number so that you know and you can research it. I placed a call over to finance. We'll carry this item over if individuals can't respond to the questions we pose, but we have identified our basic work for this year is $5.4 million. It is broken down in the year for the year in the schedule you gave us. This potential surplus hasn't been reconciled and so I'm not sure where Ed, and I understand he's new in that area, is identifying this $13 million. But the answers for today's agenda item reconciles that $5.4 million with additives and that's provided to us by your schedule, okay. So until we talk about what the carryover number was from the previous year, I would hope that you would wait to get correct information for us from finance. I'm sorry, Councilwoman Yukimura, go ahead. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so I have some questions about the overall planning for the repaving of our roads. Do we have a list of all the roads that we have that's under county jurisdiction and responsibility that we have to repave, and do we have a description of their condition in a way that we can propose repaving and budget repaving in a timely way. Mr. Dill: Currently, as I touched on, we have that in a not coherent manner right now. So our road supervisors do inspections of the roads. There are handwritten hard copy reports of that filed in various places and so our effort... and so we do have a lot of good information, but it's not in as coordinated a manner that would help us to generate a priority list for maintenance of the roads. So that's what this, the Micropaver impetus is to move forward with that to create a better way to prioritize the maintenance of our roads. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, this is deja vu for me because I think for years we've been told that we're working on a system like that, but I have confidence that you guys are actually going to achieve that. Now, so this maintenance management program that you call the Micropaver program, I guess you would call it, that would allow you to have a consistent database, it would give our road crews a standard way of describing the road conditions. Mr. Dill: That's correct. Ms. Yukimura: Okay and with that you would be able to more objectively determine which are the worst roads and what kind of repairs they need? Mr. Dill: That's correct. Ms. Yukimura: So without this, am I to assume that we really don't know what the total budget is that would be required to keep our roads in timely maintenance? Mr. Dill: Well, we don't know in as great a level of confidence as if we had this program in effect. I'll put it that way.` Ms. Yukimura: Okay. Can you give me rough numbers? How many miles of roads we have as a county to repave and how many miles we repave each year? And is that... Mr. Dill: I don't have the information readily available. If you send that information request, we can determine that for you. COUNCIL MEETING - 7 - February 23, 2011 Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so... Mr. Renaud: I mean, excuse me, I know it's 300 I heard him say, but I don't know the exact number. I'm sorry, I know it's three hundred and something I heard Mr. Mickens say that, but what that three hundred is I don't know offhand. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, you can ask me that question if you'd like and I'll give you a more official (inaudible). Mr. Renaud: Okay, please. Council Chair Furfaro: We have 3,000 miles that need to be paved and it should be by standard every seven years. We reduced it to 10% of year for budgetary purposes and that may be where Mr. Mickens has gotten that number. But I think, Mr. Dill, as the new chief engineer for the county, and maybe I've got the decimals mixed up here, the goal is to get to all of our roads in a cycle of every seven years, which is recommended. It is 300 miles of roads at 10 %. That means we should be paving 30 miles of road at 1.25 inches depth in a seven -year cycle. From financials in the past, we were not able to do that. So, the council, a few years ago, gave an extra $1 million in budgetary numbers to see what we could get caught up on. But what the standard recommendation is is a seven -year cycle. What we're currently doing is a 10 -year cycle. And I know, Councilwoman Yukimura, you were absent over the last two years, but I think that was the goal. And I appreciate you having Mr. Mickens behind you, but the reality is we should know that. Ms. Yukimura: So, it's 300 miles, right? Council Chair Furfaro: Yeah, I might have over exaggerated, at 10 %. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, yeah, so the total count... the inventory of county roads is approximately 300 miles. Council Chair Furfaro: decimal on it. Ms. Yukimura: Mr. Renaud: additional roads. Ms. Yukimura Mr. Renaud: No, no, I was wrong, Nadine. I put an extra Okay. We'll do those roads if you want us to put Let's maintain our first 300 first. Yes. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so we have 300 roads approximately and in order to repave them approximately on a timely basis, it's about ... you said 30... Council Chair Furfaro: 30 miles a year. Ms. Yukimura: 30 miles a year. And how many miles are these roads that are in this bid proposal? Mr. Dill: Yeah, we don't have a summary total. We do list the length of each project there, but we don't have a summary total of that. COUNCIL MEETING - 8 - February 23, 2011 Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so you can get that and we can get perhaps... do we have a record of how many miles of roads we've been repaving every year? I mean apparently we haven't been repaving for the last three years, but... Mr. Renaud: This is why we are proposing this program because I have gone all the way back to 2000 because I'm trying to put everything together. What roads we have paved so that we don't do a duplication. Is it within the seven - year, 10 -year? So this is why, with this program it gives us an inventory of every road that we have paved and the condition, and then we can move on. And this way if council or the community comes forward, boom, we press that button, and it gives us the info. Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so ... okay, so I guess we'll follow up with some questions and get your answers then, and then I guess at budget time we'll be able to project somewhat of a plan? Mr. Dill: Yes, we'll come forward with a plan. Right now this is the plan for the 2009 -2010. I don't know the... Ms. Yukimura: This is a plan that is implementing several past budgets, right? Mr. Dill: Correct. Ms. Yukimura: Okay and in your next budget coming up soon, you're going to be projecting some more... another budget for the future. Is that right? Mr. Dill: Yeah, we have to, that's right. Mr. Renaud: (Inaudible.) Excuse me. During a fast inspection out in the field, I see roads that we have missed that are collector roads, major collector roads that we need to improve on. So I'm trying to check back with the hard copies and go forward and then also do a visual. With the, excuse me, with the program, it will make that easy for us. Ms. Yukimura: Yes, so I know that it's not a simple issue, the repaving of roads, because some of the roads were constructed poorly long, long ago, and I'm talking about even my road on Kapena Street. It was recently repaved. Now there's some little bumps showing up. I don't know that that means. I'm going to send some questions about that. But one of the issues is that it was repaved so high and it's not wide enough for two cars so that cars can actually get damaged when they fall off the very high edge. So there are issues of how you graduate that if you don't have any road (inaudible). I don't know all the issues, but how we repave our roads, and the inspection, and the follow -up is... Mr. Renaud: I think;, if everything was done right; because they're professionals, the road was resurfaced correctly. What roads needs to do now (county) is go back and fill the edges up and make everything uniform. That's what we have to do next. Ms. Yukimura: Isn't it easier and more economical to have it done at the time of repaving? COUNCIL MEETING - 9 - February 23, 2011 Mr. Renaud: I think you need to repave and then do that portion. Now, the thing is ... well, I'm not going to go there. Ms. Yukimura: Yeah, okay, it is complex, but I mean the questions in my mind are, is there a way to create repaving specs that we can actually address that during repaving, but then it might mean more money, and there's all these issues, you know more miles, cost per mile will cost more, etc. But those are the things we would expect you to look at. Mr. Renaud: Yeah, what we are looking at, so that you know, you understand everything, because Mr. Mickens has been in our office and questioning us and everything, having side meetings and all this stuff, and the thing is what we are looking at is the collector roads. I'm trying to figure out how I can have the contractor do the collector road with the striping and the edge of pavement, and then we, county, can do the off - roads. Because for us to go back to the major collector roads and you can see what we're doing out there, it's hard to do it with six people. Ms. Yukimura: Right. Mr. Renaud: So the thing is we are looking at another plan to revamp roads and I'm not looking for anybody's one. It's about scheduling and that's the bottom line. Ms. Yukimura: Right. Well and it's about how you spec the road repaving, right? Mr. Renaud: Correct, correct. Ms. Yukimura: And to the extent that you're really thinking about the most cost effective way to use the contractor resources versus our in -house crews, that's very good. Mr. Renaud: But there is and I'm going to say it because I'm the roads guy so far now, there is things that we need to improve in roads and we are getting there. Ms. Yukimura: Well, I appreciate that spirit and we'll look forward to future progress as you get all the data together and then propose a system for doing it. Thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, I'm going to recognize Councilwoman Nakamura. But, Mr. Dill, I want you to write down some numbers for me if you can because this is what I expect this department to reconcile according to the budget. We had $6.2 million in appropriation balances for the roads department. We budgeted an additional $1.7 million in the year for the year and the county resurfacing program is at $7.9 million, round numbers. You may have other funds from federal grants and so forth, but this is the money that's, accountable to the council by proviso in the budget. Councilwoman Nakamura. Ms. Nakamura: Thank you. It's good to hear about this Micropaver software. It sounds like a good management tool for the department. And I was wondering, a lot of times with new software it takes resources to input, to gather the data that will make the software usable, especially with regard to the condition of the existing roads, and then to input the data. And I was just wondering whether you have the resources to do that? COUNCIL MEETING -10- February 23, 2011 Mr. Dill: Good question. We've been working with our IT department and we do have information, a database on hard copy, I think going back 10 years, so far back to 2000. So the data exists and we haven't resolved entirely yet the question of how we actually physically get the information into the program, but we are working with our IT department to solve that problem now. Ms. Nakamura: Okay. And do you have a timetable for when you expect this system up and running? Mr. Dill: We do not yet. It depends on getting answers to some of the questions we're just talking about right now. I don't know that it'll be fully implemented say for this upcoming fiscal year because we're coming up to that time where budgets are going to be in place, but certainly for the next fiscal year. . Ms. Nakamura: It seems like ... you know it would be a good ... if you need the resources to get it up and running that seems to be a priority so that we can have good information to then make decisions. Mr. Dill: Yeah thanks, I do agree. Ms. Nakamura: Okay and then just to clarify, because this is the 2009 -2010 list of projects, is there a 2010 -2011 list also that exists? Mr. Dill: We are still working on that list. We have not completed a list yet. Ms. Nakamura: And do you know what that budgeted amount would be for 2010 -2011? Council Chair Furfaro: We can get that money, gentlemen, that number. I'll research it right now for you, Councilwoman Nakamura. Mr. Dill: All right, thank you. Ms. Nakamura: Thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Gentlemen, I'll reconfirm that number as being budgeted at one million, seven hundred... Ms. Yukimura: Seven million, $7.9 million. Council Chair Furfaro: Yeah, $7.9 million. Okay, I'm going to recognize Kawakami, then Mr. Bynum. Mr. Kawakami: Okay, thank you, Mr. Chair, and this is for curiosity. You know the quotes that you guys are getting per ton as far as some of the projects in the different districts; what is the variance due to? Like I notice Hanalei is $280 and then as you go west it drops to like $220 a ton. Is that the formula or is that just transportation cost or what is that? Mr. Renaud: It's a formula we use, but it's also for transportation because from past history looking at the back resurfacing projects, the estimates that came out and whatnot, this is where we have noticed that of that Hanalei, because of the bridge and all this stuff or whatever it is, it's higher out there than going the other side of the island. COUNCIL MEETING - 11 - February 23, 2011 Mr. Kawakami: Because I notice even like Westside is cheaper than doing Lihu`e, so I'm assuming that everything is being generated and produced out west, yeah? Mr. Renaud: Yeah, correct. Mr. Kawakami: Okay. You guys negotiate that cost or... Mr. Renaud: No, we don't negotiate. There's two bidders that come in town and it's ... we know who they are and whoever is the low bid, we go from there. We try to negotiate, but that don't work. Mr. Kawakami: Yeah, I mean because you could realize a significant cost savings if they could give us that price that they're giving out in Waimea and Koloa and so forth. I mean for example, if you look at Hanalei, you could realize a 21% cost savings of about $261,000, Kawaihau you'd save about 12 %0 and about $247,000, Lihu`e you would save about 12% at $160... about $170,000. I mean all together you'd save about $670,000 or just about 12.5 %. So ... I mean if there is something that could be done to try to negotiate that would be significant savings. Mr. Renaud: Like this 2007 -2008 we just completed and now we're just finalizing billing and all that, it averaged like $240,000. Mr. Kawakami: Okay, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum. Mr. Bynum: Good morning, gentlemen. Congratulations to both of you on your new positions and periodically we talk about roads, so I'm just going to go through some questions and if you're not prepared right now, that's fine. But... and I want to echo what Councilmember Nakamura said, I really am pleased that you're working towards this Micropaver software to do an objective analysis of where the road needs are. Just going back a number of years, the concern we hear a lot from the public is how does the... how do these decisions get made, which roads get paved and how does it happen? And the belief that there's politics involved, that there's intervention from the political realm about, well, boy you needed to pave this road and I believe in the past that's true. I hope it's not true now. I know when I first came on the council, constituents approached me about you make sure my road gets paved. And I'm like, I'm not... that's not my choice, I don't intervene on that. We have a roads division that determines that. But whether it's true or not, the belief system is from a lot of people that there's political decision in this. And so, you know and then other people advocate we just want (inaudible). You know this road got paved six years ago and it's being repaved again, and this road got paved 20 years ago and it's in bad shape, and it hasn't been repaved. But this software will go beyond time and it'll go to actual road conditions. Because in your addendum you say the recommendation to add these is for health and safety, right. And that is the issue, health and safety. How do we address roads that need repaving based on an objective criteria that with our available resources are on a fair schedule and are addressing health and safety issues. So just reading just briefly this software, it's going to go beyond just time since the repave ... but actually look at the road conditions specifically. Mr. Dill: Oh absolutely. COUNCIL MEETING -12- February 23, 2011 Mr. Bynum: And so I really appreciate that effort a lot and I hope that we ... our road paving decisions are being made by you and that there isn't political interference in which roads get paved and which don't. But I suspect in the not too distant past there has been and I won't go into details. But just speaking for myself I want that decision to rest with you. And the other thing is you mentioned that you're anticipating good bids. And I've been watching this bid process for 8 or 10 years now, and we are in a place where we're getting good bids. Is that going to be true about road paving? You say we have two vendors. Is it a competitive process or... are they competing with one another, the two vendors that we have? Mr. Renaud: They do, yeah. Mr. Bynum: Okay and so this is really important. I'm talking to the trade unions this week about having 60% of their people on the bench right now. This is a really good time for us to be doing public works projects. Would you agree with that? Mr. Renaud: Mm -hm. Mr. Bynum: Because we get a big bang for the buck and we need to put our people to work. So, if we haven't been putting out roads and now we're going to more aggressively, that's what I'm hearing, right? Mr. Dill: That's correct. Mr. Bynum: That there's been a delay for whatever reasons, we're going to clarify that, but we're going to be moving more aggressively the next couple of years to spend the money we've already budgeted, right, and get people to work and get our roads safer, right? So that's good news and I appreciate those efforts. Couple of specific questions was a few years ago public works was here telling us about a system where when they repave they grind up the old aggregate and I may not be using the right words, but a process that uses some of the asphalt that's in place in the new batch and mix. Is that still happening? Was that ... I think it was on the bypass road that that was used and it involved some federal funding because there are collectors. Are we still using that process? Mr. Dill: We use it on a case -by -case basis where it's appropriate, where we can reuse existing materials, and then reprocess them and put them back into the road structure, yes. Mr. Bynum: So, I know ... I remember public works being at council and saying, we've never done this before, and so on a case -by -case basis when it's - appropriate, that's something we are doing and it helps > reduce cost somewhat. Is that correct? Mr. Dill: Yes. Mr. Bynum: And it's environmentally more appropriate, right? We don't have as much throw -away material, right? So, that's nice to hear that we're doing that. COUNCIL MEETING - 13 - February 23, 2011 The other thing that ... what I recall from previous meetings was Mr. Mickens kind of doing the math and saying, hey, for this amount of money at the recommended length, we should have been able to repave X amount of miles and we did less than that. But the answer I heard from roads repeatedly was you can't just do the math because when you're in the field, the widths vary somewhat based on road conditions. There's asphalt used to do the approaches into driveways and on other roads, and so. But do we calculate that tonnage and widths and make sure that we're... the vendors we hire, is there an oversight of that? Mr. Dill: Ed, you want to answer the (inaudible)? Mr. Renaud: Excuse me, what we are trying to do, because we work with tonnage, you need a person there physically to check the spread and that's what it is, the thickness and the spread. If we don't control that, the contractor will just pave and he gets paid by tonnage. So this is why the inspection or the quality control of being with them on everything they're resurfacing, that is controlled. And that's how, like for example one project we did I got involved in, we did it differently and that was Maluhia Road and that's where we did it like that. And the thing is the contractor came back, hey, you know, you're not going to pay me for this? No, we're not. You sent your truck off at this time, that's your money, that's not ours. So, it worked out really perfect and that's the bottom line is quality control and keeping everybody honest. Mr. Bynum: So we have county people that monitor the roadwork when it happens is what you... Mr. Renaud: Well, I'm going to say roads is going to take that initiative and be responsible for that. Mr. Bynum: Okay, so it's like contract management, right? Mr. Renaud: That's all it is. Mr. Bynum: And that's our responsibility. A couple questions about maintenance that you kind of alluded to and again, this is going back to previous road discussions we've had over the years and in personal observation. And I asked these questions a number of years ago. You know you repave a road, when you watch that process I think it's a contractor who comes in and prepares the edges of the road, right. So they scrape back, get it prepared for the repaving. And then when you pave, you're increasing the height of the road, right. And the questions in the past was, isn't it appropriate at some time, I don't think not right afterwards, right, because it has to cure or something, but eventually you redress the sides of the road, right? So if a car veers off of the pavement, they're not going down a lip and being thrown out of control. Have I got that right? Now, if I heard you correctly and it's kind of like the contractor prepares the ... that the county workers come back and redress the edges. Is that correct? Mr. Renaud: The county workers now prepare the edge prior to the resurfacing and then we come back. What I want to implement in the contract or specification that on the major collector roads that the contractor does all that because of the traffic and all this stuff. Mr. Bynum: Does the preparation or the redressing after? Mr. Renaud: The whole thing. COUNCIL MEETING -14- February, 23, 2011 Mr. Bynum: The whole thing. Mr. Renaud: Prepping the road, doing the repairs, resurfacing, striping and completing the edge of road. Mr. Bynum: And yeah, because I mean frankly years ago it just... sometimes it never happened, the roads never got redressed. Then I noticed a big improvement with changes in the roads division and attention from council and others. And then but even when that's done properly over time there are places where the roadway... there are dangerous situations. You have a paved road and a pothole develops not in the roadway but immediately adjacent so if a car veers off, it's going to lose control. Is that roads maintenance's responsibility to do that? Can citizens alert roads? Mr. Renaud: Yeah, I think what's happening right now with our new engineer and his deputy, we have created a complaint form where every complaint goes straight to public works and there are two ladies there doing an outstanding job whereby it comes back down to roads so this way we can address it, we track it, and everything to be sure that the complaints are done in a timely manner. Mr. Bynum: Well it seems if the contractor was doing the preparation and the redressing, if that's the right term, of the roadside, that would leave our people to do a better job with maintenance, free up some of their time, right? Mr. Renaud: I agree. Mr. Bynum: So citizens if they see a road situation they think is unsafe, even if it's on the median, they can call and get a response? Mr. Renaud: Oh yes, Mr. Dill: Absolutely, call the county engineer's office, public works. Mr. Bynum: Okay, so I'm really, really happy about this road Micropaver software and trying to really do an objective decision making about what gets paved next for primarily health and safety reasons. I totally applaud that and I know when in the past I had faith that there wasn't political influence happening to determine what roads got paved, but in the future when citizens make that complaint, I think we need to follow up on it and give them reassurances because it's still a common belief out there and if we have this system in place, it'll all be something that you can have accountable and say, no, we made this decision based on this data, based on this health and safety concern. So, thank you very much. Council Chair Furfaro: I'm going to go to Councilman Chang, then I'm going to go to Councilmember Kawakami, and then I believe Councilwoman Yukimura wanted to ask some more questions. Mr. Chang, the floor recognizes you. Mr. Chang: Thank you, Chair. Hi, Larry and Ed. Explain to us the process when we have a manhole, so we gotta pave. How does the paving work around the manhole? COUNCIL MEETING -15- February 23, 2011 Mr. Renaud: The contractor is responsible for that manhole and the way we have it in our specs, if it needs to be raised he has to raise it. It's in the specs, so that's the bottom line. Past contracts, I think, it wasn't in the specs whereby we had a disagreement going back and forth that we had to pay the extra, and I was against that because we didn't have it in the contract, so. Now we have it in the contract to protect the county. This is your project and then we mark it on the off -site so that we know where that manhole or whatever was at. Mr. Chang: Okay because as you remember, in the past, there could have been an inch or two or sometimes three inches and when it would flood on lower lying areas like specifically Waimea in front of First Hawaiian Bank and J's Restaurant on that stretch along that Big Save, you know for the residents when it flooded you couldn't even see where the pothole was and then they'd be going straight into these big holes. And another question, I would probably imagine is when you pave, you probably pave in the drier summer months? Is that a rule of thumb? Mr. Renaud: That's correct, yeah. Mr. Chang: So who then—whose responsibility then is to remove the manhole prior to paving or after paving because I think a lot of the problems with the flooding in the lower lying areas is that we ... I don't know how often we clean the drainage because during the rainy season you got leaves, you got debris, you got rubbish, you got everything else, so when you get these holes that's supposed to be going free flowing out toward maybe, I guess, the ocean, you know at the same time I think when we plan to pave the road, somebody needs to go down and we may as well do the same job all at the same time by clearing out debris. I mean, does that typically happen or would that be on the radar screen too... as far as maintenance preventive? Mr. Dill: Well, to touch on your first item, I haven't seen the details of the specs in our road pavement contracts yet. But typically a paving contractor has incidental to his work, he's required to adjust all manholes, gate valves, etc. to grade by using rings and repaving to a new elevation. Now as far as drainage maintenance is concerned, our roads maintenance crew takes care of the maintenance of all the drainage facilities. The prioritization of those are not necessarily going to occur at the same time as the paving, but nevertheless it's definitely... we agree with you that's a priority item that needs to be looked at, and we have been recently discussing in -house sharing the use of the vacuum truck from wastewater to help us clean the storm drains. So we're working out an understanding with them so we will... they will be able to share it with us and they've been very good about sharing that truck with us so we can clean the storm drains, so we've got the equipment we need to do that. Mr. Chang: And maybe we can get a list of the previous contract and, what -you• guys.; are: going. to :ba expecting now -in the present contracts - as far as what is different now. You know like now they're responsible for the manholes or now they're responsible for the sides of the road, so maybe we can take a look at that and if we got any other questions, then maybe we can bring something up before the contracts get executed. Council Chair Furfaro: Ed, before we go any further, I just want to note Mr. Chang has .a concern there. But in reality the agenda item today is dealing with the resurfacing, not flood control, which isn't even in your gentlemen's privy in COUNCIL MEETING -16- February 23, 2011 the roads division. It is under Mr. Dill's privy as the county engineer. But I would suggest if Mr. Chang would like to pursue a better understanding of the flood control that we actually put a new agenda item on. was... Mr. Chang: Thank you and I apologize, Chair, because when I Council Chair Furfaro: No apology necessary. We started... Mr. Chang: When I was going through that resurfacing, I just figured I'd push the button and go with the drainage at that same time, so thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, again, I just want to remind everybody, the agenda item is the resurfacing schedule. If we talk into the financial area of paying for it and so forth, that's fine. But when we get into flood control, I think we actually are straying the members from the agenda item. And we can put it on, Mr. Chang, as a separate item. Mr. Kawakami. Mr. Kawakami: Thank you, Chair. You know if my memory serves me correctly and I'm not sure if it's accurate, so you can correct me, but is Big Island utilizing recycled glass as part of their mix? I'm not sure if it was a requirement and if you cannot answer, I can look into it further. But are we utilizing that? Because if some... Mr. Dill: We don't have any firm information about that at this time. Mr. Kawakami: Okay, but there are some counties and cities that are using it and they call it glassphalt. So they're taking all this recycled glass and they're using it as a mix and it's saving them significant money in some areas as far as when they do their road resurfacing. Have we explored that option? Mr. Dill: Have we? Mr. Renaud: No, no, we haven't. Mr. Dill: I'm not aware that we have, but we can certainly look into that. Thank you. Mr. Kawakami: Okay and we'll look into it further too. Okay, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, Councilwoman Yukimura, you had another question? Ms. Yukimura: Yes, please, thank you. We ... I know that we've recycled asphalt, right? Haven't we recycled asphalt? I'm just following:up on Councilmember Kawakami's. Mr. Dill: I don't have any history here, so I'm not sure what the county has done in the past, you know. COUNCIL MEETING -17- February 23, 2011 Mr. Renaud: We used the recycled asphalt for other things in the county: patching here, patching there, off roads or potholes and whatnot; but we haven't used it as a permanent mix yet. There is some science, I guess you call it, that we have to look into before we can really use that and get it... Ms. Yukimura: I thought we did use it for either the bypass road in Po`ipu or Maluhia Road? We didn't? Mr. Renaud: The by-pass we did the reclamation where we went through the whole the process with the base and existing AC and it mixes up everything. If you move forward, the AC is in the back and the oil and all this stuff, the oil is making this... Ms. Yukimura: Can you talk in the mike, please? Mr. Renaud: Oh, I'm sorry. At Ala Kino`iki, that's the first place we did that reclamation of using existing base and AC material on top and it scarifies everything up. And then the oil is added back in and then re- rolling from the back. Ms. Yukimura: Right, so that's what I was referring to in terms of recycled asphalt. So we have actually done that process. Mr. Renaud: Yeah, we did one. Mr. Dill: (Inaudible) the surface or as the base? (Inaudible.) Mr. Renaud: The whole thing. Mr. Dill: The whole thing. Mr. Renaud: Yeah. Ms. Yukimura: So and it did work well? Did it work satisfactorily? Mr. Renaud: It did work well. That's an old thing. It started off in the military way back on Oahu, and then it came out, but it works. Ms. Yukimura: Right. reconstructing the road, though, right? Mr. Renaud: Yeah. It worked on wherever you're actually Ms. Yukimura: It's not just a repaving? Mr. Renaud: Yeah. The thing is that is used mostly for major collector roads because you need a lot of area. If we do it on our small county roads, it's_ going_to = cost. us a _lot (inaudible). Ms. Yukimura: Okay, so, yeah, so we'll rely on you folks to use the right technology for the right situation, but I think we're encouraging you to look at these different alternatives. Mr. Renaud: Yeah. COUNCIL MEETING -18- February 23, 2011 Ms. Yukimura: And then on the question also following up to Councilmember Kawakami's question about the different per ton costs? Is that not a function of where their supply is or could it possibly be related to how wet and rainy a place is? Is that... Mr. Dill: My inclination is to think that it's mainly on the basis of the haul distance from the batch plant. Ms. Yukimura: Right, right, okay. All right, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, Councilmember Bynum. Oh, no? Ms. Yukimura: I'm done, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: You're done? Ms. Yukimura: Yes. Council Chair Furfaro: Councilwoman Nakamura, did you have anything? No? Okay, gentlemen, I'm going to ask later after we have public testimony to defer this and I would encourage you to stay for the public testimony and then I will summarize some questions as to first reconciling because we have three different sets of numbers here on the road R &M projects, and we'll probably have some questions to send over that I'll summarize when we call the meeting back to order and probably come back in two weeks. So on that note, I'm going to ask you if you can step down and I'll call for public speakers. Thank you, gentlemen. Mr. Mickens. Glenn, come right up. GLENN MICKENS: Thank you, Jay, for the record Glenn Mickens. I certainly appreciate the new breath of air with Larry and Ed. As you know, I've been sitting here for 15 years or more, many more years than some of you councilmembers, going over this thing, and very briefly, let me ... you have a copy of my testimony. It gives a little more history of what's gone on. So for you members that were here, for the viewing public, let's go over this and we'll see where we were and where we hopefully are going to be. First I want to thank Chair Furfaro for getting the roads resurfacing issue on the agenda. This is an issue I've been pursuing for over 15 years and since I have never gotten any concrete response to my questions, I'm still after it. Some of you members on this council, Jay, Mel, JoAnn, and lately Dickie know that I've been trying to find out why our county roads have not been paved according to code, 4 inches of compacted sub -base with 2 inches of compacted AC, that's asphalted concrete, as finish grade for new roads, and 1.5 inches —Jay, I think you said 1.25, but it is 1.5 inches of compact AC —for repaved roads. Glover and Grace Pacific are two pavers on Kauai. Both belong to HAPI, that's Hawaiian Asphalt Paving Industry, and HAPI standards are very specific in the way our roads are to be paved and repaved. Please look at the attached couple of pages from HAPI Recommendations for Paving. There -are many morel but I have only included- a few, they're in the back section of these. In fact, the new thing that Ed and Larry have brought up, this pavement maintenance management system, they assure me that this is even more stringent than HAPI. But if HAPI had been followed over these years, we would've saved millions and millions of dollars and our roads would have obviously lasted longer. Three members of this council I have mentioned above have heard me testify many times, even watched me do a PowerPoint showing samples taken from roads that COUNCIL MEETING _19- February 23, 2011 were not 1.5 inches thick and pictures showing potholes that were not repaired by code, about our illegally paved roads and yet this wrong practice continues. In all fairness, Ed and now Larry have said that changes are being made, but I'm still going to be waiting to see that these changes absolutely take place. When roads have the typical alligator cracks in them, HAPI repaving methods mandate that they be removed and the procedures outlined in the enclosed papers be followed. And JoAnn, your question about recycling the ripped up pavement, that's true if you look in the section here, you'll see it's called cold planing. And they take and go ahead and dig up any sections where they've got alligator cracks and stuff or badly cracked roads and they dig it up, they chop it all back up, and use this as recycling base. So it does work. I'm not sure that we have the machinery here to do it. But I guess as Ed pointed out, they did it in Po`ipu. Mr. Nakamura: Three minutes, Mr. Chair. Mr. Mickens: So, I guess they do have the machinery. Council Chair Furfaro: Excuse me, Glenn, that's three minutes, but continue. Mr. Mickens: Thank you, Jay. But even though Glover and Grace Pacific follow HAPI standards, when they get a contract from our county, HAPI rules are eliminated and they pave right over the cracked areas without any bad sections being removed. Remember, this is past history, not what's going to happen from now on. I hope it does change. Obviously, this county method is much cheaper initially than HAPI standards, but this cheap method turns into cracked and potholed roads in a far shorter time than if done properly. As an example, if a home were being built and the foundation was faulty, no matter how well -built the home was, it would not last due to poor foundation. Or even a weather analogy, if you were painting a house, you had dry rot or flaking paint on it, you paint over on top of that without removing it, I mean that's ... your paint job isn't going to last. HAPI has other stringent methods in their paving rules that our county doesn't follow, thus making the life of our roads far less than if properly done. I once asked an engineer from Glover why our county eliminates HAPI rules from their contracts, and he told me even though he recommended it to them, they said they don't have the funds to do it properly, penny wise and dollar foolish. And Jay, I'm sure you remember Jimmy Tokioka sitting here and said, "Glenn, if we did it the way you're saying or the way HAPI rules, we couldn't do one -half the roads we're doing now." So, they were just going to do with whatever budget they had. I have copies of the islandwide resurfacing list back to 2001. All of them the councils have ... you guys have to approve. But they stopped after the '07208 year, and there have been none since that time. So, Jay, you gave me that copy of the latest one and that was '07-'08. So we have three years now that we haven't... either the roads haven't been getting repaved or something's happened with the funds that we're supposed to be doing repaving with. Now either they had a surplus from past years to cover the eliminated ,years or roads are just not getting repaved. If you councilmembers are as cautious as I am about driving over bad roads, potholes and all, then it appears that the latter is true. So the question arises, why? With the roads repaving budget of about $2 million a year and Jay, I see in this budget we got $5.5 million. Council Chair Furfaro: Stay with your testimony, Glenn, and I'll answer (inaudible) questions. COUNCIL MEETING -20- February 23, 2011 Mr. Mickens: Oh, okay, okay, got you. With the road repavement about $2 million a year and AC costing about $300 a ton, that's in today's prices, and Ed confirms this, it costs about $300,000.00 a mile to repave a road. Thus, we are only going to be capable of paving about 6 -7 miles of our 300 miles of roads each year. This means that it would take us between 43 and 50 years to repave all our roads, which is obviously unacceptable. Is it any wonder that our roads are in such terrible shape? Please look at the attached Reason Foundation. There's another attachment there talking about Hawaii, Hawai`i's roads, a study that says that Hawai`i's roads and highways have been ranked among the worst in the nation. And remember this fact is even worse since we don't have extreme temperature to ruin our roads the way colder states do. In the '06207 budget, I believe that Jay was responsible for getting about $2 million added to our total of $1.9 million, and we were able to do more paving... repaving. But now we have gone backwards and no budget has been submitted for the past three years. With our repaving far behind, some possible ... we had a surplus from previous years to properly resurface. So my suggestions to the administration are: (1) pave and repave all our roads by HAPI and now it's this new standard that you brought forward.. Mr. Nakamura: Six minutes, Mr. Chair. Mr. Mickens: ... stating that cracked and broken pavement will be torn up, recycled, and used for the sub -base as other municipalities do plus using other HAPI methods to extend the life of our roads. (2) Our roads repaving budget must be increased and by using HAPI standards all these roads will last longer, be better to drive on, be far more cost effective; and (3) pave our roads according to usage and condition of the road. Do not use politics as a guideline, Haleilio Road being the best example I can think of, and I'm sure you're familiar with that, who lived down in Haleilio Road. Or even worse in our '05-'06 budget, which I still have a copy of, we paved Kealia Road at a cost to the taxpayers of $250,800.00, a road with few homes on it, a little over 2 miles long, and it appeared to be done for a developer who was building a subdivision at the top of that road. I brought this scam up long ago, but nothing was ever done about it. I have stacks of material from my years of pursuing this issue and will be happy to share them with you. But, again, we seem to have a new regime here and my friend Ed here has assured me, Dickie arranged a meeting that we had with public works... Council Chair Furfaro: Excuse me, I let you go even beyond the six minutes. Let's see if there's any questions directed at you. Mr. Mickens: Okay, I'm sorry, okay. Council Chair Furfaro: And I would like to say... Mr. Mickens: Can I ask you one, just one question, Jay? Council Chair Furfaro: Sure -as soon as I summarize what I'm doing. May I continue to run the meeting? Mr. Mickens: Oh, okay, yes, go ahead. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you Mr. Mickens: I'm sorry. COUNCIL MEETING -21- February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: I think you folks saw from Mr. Mickens' testimony, we can incorporate a couple of these questions into our correspondence that goes over to the highways division of the county. But I want to clarify one piece in your point here. There was a budget produced. What you're really reflecting on here is there was a budget, but they never submitted the schedule for the work. Therefore, the amounts budgeted were not executed with only basically four months left in the year. Mr. Mickens: For which year was that? '08209? '09210? What? Council Chair Furfaro: Just clarifying your terminology "there was no budget." Every year there was a budget. We just never executed the schedule. Mr. Mickens: But this council never okayed that budget or that... we never saw it, right? Council Chair Furfaro: Glenn, I'm going to answer your question there and I'm going to summarize it real quick, and I'm not going to give you an opportunity for an additional series of questions until I can engage the other councilmembers, okay. Mr. Mickens: Okay, yes. Council Chair Furfaro: We square on that? Mr. Mickens: Yes. Council Chair, Furfaro: You see the budget every year. It's in the budget process. It's a public document. So when you said there was no budget that is an incorrect statement. There was no schedule that was executed that matched the budget, and we're going to put that in one of our questions. Mr. Mickens: That's what I wondered, right. Thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Now does anybody have any questions of Mr. Mickens at this point? Glenn, we're going to continue some dialogue here and I'm just going to get the rest of the public testimony first. Mr. Mickens: Okay. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, thank you very much. Mr. Mickens: Thank you. Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, Glenn. KEN TAYLOR: Chair and members of the council, my name is Ken Taylor. As you all know, we can't go back and correct the past, but the. future looking bright with the two new county employees in the positions that Larry and Ed are in, and for that I think we all have to be thankful. I think what I heard this morning was that most everybody is in agreement that this Micropaver program is long overdue and should be implemented as quickly as possible. And I hope that Larry and Ed understand as I think the message was is that if they don't have enough money in their current budget to get this thing implemented as quickly as possible that they should request to you for some additional fund to move forward on implementing the Micropaver program, and I think that that is going to go a long COUNCIL MEETING -22- February 23, 2011 ways to solving our road maintenance program in the future. And so I hope that you folks will again clarify to Larry and Ed that if they need additional funding that you're ready, willing and able to accommodate those needs. Thank you very much. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much, Ken. Any questions for Ken? No? Anyone else that wants to speak on this item? No? Okay, Mr. Dill, may I ask you just to come up for a minute before I call the meeting back to order? You know first of all, I think we're all very pleased with your moving on the Micropaver, especially as it relates... leads us to a better plan for pavement management systems. But may I ask, have we purchased that piece of equipment? Mr. Dill: No, we have not. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, so are we looking at that piece of equipment in the next capital plan or are you going to move money from the current capital plan to acquire that piece of equipment? Mr. Dill: I understand we have available funds within our existing budget that we can move moneys around to acquire it. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, so your plan is to move forward on that in an equipment purchase very soon. Mr. Dill: Absolutely yes. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay and I use the term equipment, but whether we're talking about the hard PC or the soft program, what components do you need? Mr. Dill: We need the software itself. I believe, we're still working with IT, that we are ... our PCs are capable of running the software as they are. Council Chair Furfaro: Do you need any field equipment that goes along with measuring depth and so forth? Mr. Dill: Good question. I don't know the answer to that question at this moment. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, so that will be one of the questions that I'll put on the correspondence. And I'll summarize at the end, but Councilwoman Yukimura has a question. Go ahead. Ms. Yukimura: Thank you. Ed alluded to this already, but I presume that you'll be looking at how we spec the repaving program and what we expect of a contractor in cases of repaving or reconstruction because we will be doing some of that too I imagine, given our repaving record? Mr. Dill: Yes, thanks for your input on all these items and we will look at our scope of work that we put in our contracts to make sure we address all those items. Ms. Yukimura: All right, great, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Mr. Bynum. COUNCIL MEETING -23- February 23, 2011 Mr. Bynum: One last thing, I realize budget's rolling around again and I brought this up the last couple budgets, and it's related to repaving because I think currently we re- st ... the county does the restriping. You're saying in the future, you'd maybe like to make that part of the contract, but I think we currently do it. Is that correct, Ed? Mr. Dill: We have that capability. I don't know what we've done in the past as far as how we coordinate with the restriping with the paving contracts, but I agree with Ed that we should incorporate, excuse me, the striping with the paving contract. Mr. Bynum: Yeah, I like that idea as well because the roads guys got plenty to do. Besides roads, they get used for other things, we all know that, and so if the contractor was doing the restriping, it just ... this is kind of a thing I've brought up before and I haven't talked to you about it, Larry, but I believe we're ... our crews are one of the last in the state that are repainting roadways rather than using this —I don't know the right term —but this plastic burned down stuff. Mr. Dill: Tape. Mr. Bynum: Which I've read about and it lasts longer, it has better reflectivity, it's safer, and I hope you'll look at the budget about us acquiring the equipment and the capability to do that. Mr. Dill: Okay, we are currently investigating that. So I don't know about... and we'll see if we can get it in this year's budget if it's something we want to pursue. Mr. Bynum: Yeah, it seems, as a lay person, a no brainer because of its durability, but more importantly it's the safety factors that the visibility especially on dark rainy nights and that kind of stuff. Mr. Dill: Sure. Mr. Bynum: And I think I'm correct that we're the only county still painting. So... Council Chair Furfaro: Councilwoman Yukimura. Ms. Yukimura: Thank you, as a follow -up to Councilmember Bynum, we encourage and support your drawing on the other public works departments in the state. I think you have annual conferences, but even beyond that if they're already doing it, they might be a good source of information as to what works and what doesn't work. Mr. Dill: Okay, thank you, good idea. , j point of clarification b Ms. Yukimura: And then just a ecause I think there was this question about a 2009 - 2010... Council Chair Furfaro: I'm going to summarize that when we call the meeting back to order. COUNCIL MEETING -24- February 23, 2011 Ms. Yukimura: Oh, okay, may I just say that I think it seems like we were expecting independent and individual budgets, but actually we incorporate the last year's budget in whatever year so that's the one that... Council Chair Furfaro: Yeah and so the schedule he would put, he actually rolled it up. Ms. Yukimura: Yes, so the figures you gave is actually the budget for all the years cumulated into whatever's in the CIP budget right now. Okay, thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kawakami. Mr. Kawakami: Thank you, Mr. Chair, and just to clarify, we had staff look at one of the inquiries I made about the Big Island having some requirement. At one point they did look into it, but that discussion stopped because of liability concerns. But City & County of Honolulu, they're currently, since 1992, using a 10% mix of recycled glass in some of their asphalt projects. And some of the rules that they have as far as the recycled asphalt, they have a cap of 30% and then for glass on limited road construction projects, which I don't know what limited road construction projects would mean, but they put a cap of 10% glass. And it also draws reference to one of the two asphalt companies that we do business with that has this product readily available. Mr. Dill: Oh, okay. Mr. Kawakami: Because if we look at the tonnage that we're talking about, hypothetically if we were to apply a 10% formula as far as recycled glass that would equate to about 2,153 tons of glass which we would be recycling which would amount to 4,306,000 pounds just on your 2009 -2010 road resurfacing list. So if we could just maybe inquire more about that option and then... Mr. Dill: Certainly, we can do that. Mr. Kawakami: ...we can see the cost benefit and then we'd measure the triple bottom line, yeah, economic, social, and environmental effects on our decision making, so. That might be one avenue that we might want to look at. Mr. Dill: Okay, thank you, we'll investigate that. Mr. Kawakami: Thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, does anyone have any more questions for Mr. Dill? If not, I'm going to call our meeting back to order. Mr. Dill, I'd appreciate it if you could sit and listen to some of the summaries from the councilmembers and I'll wrap it up at the end. But I am asking for us to consider a deferral and have you back in two weeks to be able to respond to some of the questions posed today. Mr. Dill: Okay. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Mr. Dill. And I'm very happy you're on- board, thank you. Mr. Dill: I'm happy to be here. COUNCIL MEETING -25- February 23, 2011 There being no one else wishing to testify on this matter, the meeting was called to order, and proceeded as follows: Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, our meeting is called back to order. Councilmembers, maybe I should go first and just kind of anticipate what I think we have an understanding of today. We have a proposed road schedule today which shows $5,400,000.00 worth of work. The challenge in this $5.4 million is we need to make very clear that this is work that we hope would happen in the drier months of April, May, and June, and Mr. Dill, the challenge is if it's not a schedule that we're moving forward in, you make sure that that money isn't rolled up in a reserve to be carried over but somehow at least the project releases allow us to encumber that money so we can get caught up on the roads. In my own summary, there is about for six months actual, you are about $1.6 million behind from your proposed budget. But as Councilwoman Yukimura pointed out earlier some of that is because we haven't done any of that particular work that was scheduled. And I would also like you to tie into the CIP fund here that shows the $6.2 appropriation balances for the roads, which is pretty close to what your schedule is. But you're on a very close clock for getting this work done and we would like to hear more about that in two weeks. I also want to say that part of the software issue, it's great to have this particular pavement management system, but I also want us to look at some type of depth reader that looks at... actually what are we accomplishing and I would hope your upcoming budget would be one that, along with the council, we can understand what a 7 -year plan on resurfacing equates to in money versus the 10 -year plan that we're doing now and having to carry over funds. You know the 7 -year plan means we're going to do 14.5% of'our roads in a 7 -year cycle and yes, it is needing to allocate more money to do. that. Typically now we allocate- in the budget $1.7 to $1.9 each year. That equates to about 10% of our roads and that currently reflects the old prices of oil. I want to make sure it's taken into consideration because there's talk now that with all of the conflicts in the Middle East, we could be ... I mean I think we're at a $100 a barrel today for oil. We need to have a contingency for that in our road plan because that is a major part of the component for our road resurfacing. So those are the types of questions that are going to go over along with any additional questions that might come with councilmembers as we do this roundtable. So in summary here I'm going to ask for a deferral, but before we get to the deferral, Mr. Chang, do you have any more to add? Mr. Chang: No Council Chair Furfaro: Mr. Kawakami? Mr. Bynum, go ahead. Mr. Bynum: Yeah, I just want to thank Larry and Ed for being here today and just note that since the reorganization after the last election, there's been a lot of changes in public works. I've been the chair of public works for the last -- couple of years. An- I'm really - pleased- about...yau know; some of us can remember when we didn't have an engineer in the county engineer's position. And now we're attracting really capable people. Ed has taken over the roads division. He's proven himself to be capable and responsive to this council, and so there's really a new life. We have a new county engineer, a new deputy engineer, who are both licensed engineers, and Mr. Fujimoto's in solid waste where we have real big challenges. So public works is looking pretty good these days from my perspective and just at this meeting we saw the initiative that's coming about maybe doing our paving contracts -,,I COUNCIL MEETING -26- February 23, 2011 different, about doing a subjective look at... an objective look at how we determine which roads get paved and these are really positive things. And so I just wanted to make those comments and thank them for those initiatives, so thank you. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Councilwoman Nakamura, you're okay at this point as a deferral? Councilwoman Yukimura? Ms. Yukimura: Yes, I think we're all really grateful to have you, Larry, and Ed and the new spirit and willingness to take on this very important part of our county services. I think we have some real challenges coming up because we've not kept up and because the price of oil could go up. And so I'm asking for all due speed and attention to this issue, and look forward to the answers that will come forth. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. On that note, I'm now looking for a motion to defer, defer for two weeks. Ms. Nakamura moved to defer C 2011 -76, seconded by Mr. Chang, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you Mr. Dill, thank you Ed. We'll see you in two weeks. Mr. Nakamura: Council Chair, we're back on page one of the council's agenda on communications for receipt: communications C 2011 -71, C 2011 -72, C 2011 -73, and C 2011 -74. C 2011 -71 Communication (01/26/2011) from the Director of 'Finance, transmitting for Council information, Fiscal Year 2011 Period 6 Financial Reports — Statement of Revenues as of December 31, 2010, pursuant to Section 21 of the Operating Budget Ordinance (B- 2010 -705): Mr. Chang moved to receive C 2011 -71 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura. C 2011 -72 Communication (02/09/2011) from Councilmember Kawakami, providing written disclosure for the record of a possible conflict of interest regarding Proposed Draft Bill (No. 2400) because of his employment position and family involvement in retail and food service establishments, and that for these reasons he will recuse himself from any discussion or deliberation on this item: Mr. Chang moved to receive C 2011 -72 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura. C 2011 -73 Communication (02/09/2011) from the Mayor, transmitting for Council consideration and confirmation, his appointment of Gaylord Mamoru Fukumoto to the Building Board of Appeals: Mr. Chang moved to receive C 2011 -73 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura. C 2011 -74 Communication (02/11/2011) from Council Chair Furfaro, transmitting for Council consideration and confirmation, appointee Linda Akana Sproat -'to -the Public Access, Open Space, and Natural Resources Preservation Fund Commission: Mr. Chang moved to receive C 2011 -74 for the record, seconded by Ms. Yukimura. Council Chair Furfaro: I do want to point out something to councilmembers as I did my six -month financial summary, we have indications from the state that our TAT for the next months will not be paid until June. So I just want to make us aware that that might indicate some unanticipated cash needs and so on the next quarterly treasurer's report, I would like to follow that very closely. COUNCIL MEETING - 27-' February 23, 2011 Just for your information you'll see a revenue shortfall building as we go the next six months because of the lagging in the payment of the TAT. So any further discussion? Ms. Yukimura: Just thank you for tracking that. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay, if not, all those in favor to receive? The motion to receive communications C 2011 -71, C 2011 -72, C 2011 -73, and C 2011 -74 for the record was then put, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Mr. Clerk, next item. Mr. Nakamura: We're on the top of page two of the council's agenda, Mr. Chair, on communication C 2011 -75: C 2011 -75 Communication (02/10/2011) from Council Chair Furfaro, requesting the Administration's presence to provide the Council with an update on the Kapaia Swinging Bridge Project. Mr. Nakamura: Mr. Chair, we're in receipt of a communication from Mr. Dill, the county engineer, requesting a deferral on this matter. Council Chair Furfaro: I would like to honor that request for a deferral for two weeks if it's acceptable for all of you folks. Mr. Nakamura: Mr. Chair, it's actually to ... the request was to the March 23, 2011 Council Meeting. Council Chair Furfaro: March 23? Okay, that's in four weeks. Ms. Nakamura: Move to defer to March 23. Ms. Yukimura: Second. Council Chair Furfaro: There's no discussion on a deferral. All those in favor? Ms. Nakamura moved to defer C 2011 -75 to March 23, 2011, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you, next item. Mr. Nakamura: We're on page two under Legal Documents, communication C 2011- 68(a): LEGAL DOCUMENTS: C 2011 -68(a) Communication (01/13/2011) from the Director of Parks & Recreation, requesting Council approval of the following to facilitate KIUC utility easements with the State of Hawaii, which is necessary to provide electricity to the comfort station at Kapa`a Park (section known as Lihi Park): • Utility Relocation Agreement (TMK No. (4) 4 -5 -06 -001) Mr. Bynum moved to approve the legal document attached to communication C 2011- 68(a), seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and unanimously carried. COUNCIL MEETING -28- February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Mr. Nakamura: Next legal document, Mr. Chair, is attached to communication C 2011 -77: C 2011 -77 Communication (01/14/2011) from the Mayor, requesting Council approval of the following from McBryde Sugar Company, Limited: • Dedication Deed conveying Lot B -5 (TMK (4) 2- 6- 003:001 (por.)) Koloa, Kauai, Hawaii, to the County of Kauai for roadway purposes (Western Bypass Road — Southern Leg). Mr. Chang moved to approve the legal document attached to communication C 2011 -77, seconded by Mr. Bynum. Council Chair Furfaro: Anyone in the public wishes to speak on this item? No? We'll call the meeting back to order. Is there any questions from members? If not? No, we have a question? Mr. Bynum, go right ahead. Mr. Bynum: I just have a comment. We're receiving this bypass road which is great. It deals with the circulation in Koloa. Currently, however, the bypass road and Po`ipu Road go mauka -makai and from K51oa Road to the roundabout there's no connector between those two roads in a very long distance. And I probably am going to have a future discussion about that on the floor: how did we arrive at a place where we had this long of a community... parallel roads with no connectors in- between? And so I just wanted to make that comment that this is a very positive thing that we're receiving this road as part of the Kukui`ula Development. Council Chair Furfaro: Is there any more discussion? Councilwoman Nakamura? Ms. Nakamura: Yes, this is just a request to staff that in ... for future legal documents where a physical location is cited, can we have an attached map to these documents so we can physically see without having to go through TMKs to find the property? Council Chair Furfaro: Certainly and I'll make that request to the county attorney's office to make sure, Amy, if I can, to make sure that a reference map is attached. There are some of us that are very kama`aina to certain parts of the island and then there's others that are not so kama`aina to certain parts of the island, so we will make that request. Any further discussion? So on that note, the request will go to the county attorney's office. All those in favor, signify by saying aye. The motion to approve the legal document attached to communication C 2011 -77 was then put, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Mr. Nakamura: communication C 2011 -78: Thank you very much, next item. Next matter on page two is a Claim, COUNCIL MEETING -29- February 23, 2011 CLAIM: C 2011 -78 Communication (02/03/2011) from the County Clerk, transmitting a claim filed against the County of Kauai by Gary Higgins for damage to his personal property, physical injury, medical bills, and emotional trauma, pursuant to Section 23.06, Charter of the County of Kauai: Ms. Yukimura moved to refer communication C 2011 -78 to the County Attorney's Office for disposition and/or report back to the Council, seconded by Mr. Kawakami, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: I think we're going to go into Committee Reports and are we due for a ... we're not due for a break. Mr. Nakamura: About half an hour, I think. Council Chair Furfaro: We got half an hour here, I'm sorry. That's the good news. Let's go into the committee reports. Mr. Nakamura: Next matter for approval is a committee report from your Committee on Public Safety & Environmental Services, Committee Report CR -PSE 2011 -02: COMMITTEE REPORT: PUBLIC SAFETY & ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICES COMMITTEE A report (No. CR -PSE 2011 -02) submitted by the Public Safety & Environmental Services Committee, recommending that the following be received for the record: "PSE 2011 -01 Communication (02/08/2011) from Committee Chair Rapozo, requesting agenda time for a briefing on the various drug - related bills pending before the Hawaii State Legislature to be given by Shaylene Iseri - Carvalho, Prosecuting Attorney, and Keith Kamita, Deputy Director of Law Enforcement, State of Hawaii Department of Public Safety," Mr. Chang moved for approval of the report, seconded by Mr. Kawakami, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Now we're going to go into Resolutions. Mr. Nakamura: First resolution at the bottom of page two for approval is Resolution No. 2011 -32. RESOLUTIONS: Resolution No. 2011 -32, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE FIREt COMMISSION (Darnney L Proudfoot): Ms. Yukimura moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -32, seconded by Mr. Chang, and carried by the following vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura, Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL — 1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. COUNCIL MEETING -30- February 23, 2011 Mr. Nakamura: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. Mr. Nakamura: Next resolution for approval on the top of page three of the council's agenda is Resolution No. 2011 -33: Resolution No. 2011 -33, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE SALARY COMMISSION (Randy Finlay): Ms. Yukimura moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -33, seconded by Mr. Kawakami, and carried by the following vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL — 1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. Mr. Nakamura: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you, next item. Mr. Nakamura: Next resolution for approval is Resolution No. 2011 -36: Resolution No. 2011 -36, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE CIVIL SERVICE COMMISSION (John Harold Low): Ms. Yukimura moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -36, seconded by Mr. Bynum, and carried by the following vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura, Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL — 1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. Mr. Nakamura Council Chair Furfaro: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Thank you, next item. Mr. Nakamura: Next matter for approval is Resolution No. 2011 -37: Resolution No. 2011 -37, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION (Wayne Kazuo Katayama): Ms. Yukimura moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -37, seconded by Mr. Kawakami. Council Chair Furfaro: Okay and I believe we do have an amendment on this resolution and it is by Councilwoman Nakamura. Ms. Nakamura: Yes, I'd like introduce an amendment just to clarify that Wayne Katayama represents the business community and I think that was left off the original resolution. Mr. Kawakami: Second. COUNCIL MEETING -31- February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. There's a motion to approve the amendment adding the business classification to this commissioner's nomination. Is there anyone from the public that wishes to speak? Seeing none, this will be a voice vote on the amendment. All those in favor say aye. Ms. Nakamura moved to amend Resolution No. 2011 -37, as shown in the Floor Amendment (Attachment No. 1) attached hereto, seconded by Mr. Kawakami, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: We're to the main resolution and we have an approval and a second, I believe, on this one. Mr. Nakamura: Yes. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you very much and this will be by voice vote. Anyone from the public wishes to speak on this? Seeing no one, let's do roll call. The motion to approve Resolution No. 2011 -37 as amended was then put, and carried by the following vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura, Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL — 1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. Mr. Nakamura: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you, Mr. Clerk, next item. Mr. Nakamura: Mr. Chair, on Resolution No. 2011 -38, which is a resolution confirming mayoral appointment Herman Texeira to the planning commission, since we're in the process of scheduling Mr. Texeira's interview, if we could ask for a deferral on this matter. Resolution No. 2011 -38, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION (Herman John Texeira) Mr. Bynum moved to defer Resolution No. 2011 -38, seconded by Ms. Yukimura. Council Chair Furfaro: Thank you. There was a conflict yesterday as the planning commission had a workshop and Mr. Texeira could not make the interviews. All those in favor... for the deferral. I shouldn't have made that comment before the motion. I wanted to make sure people understood why, okay, there was a conflict. The motion to defer Resolution No. 2011 -38 was then put, and unanimously carried. Council Chair Furfaro: Next item please. Mr. Nakamura: Next resolution for approval is Resolution No. 2011 -39: COUNCIL MEETING -32- February 23, 2011 Resolution No. 2011 -39, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE BUILDING BOARD OF APPEALS (Gaylord Mamoru Fukumoto): Mr. Kawakami moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -39, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried by the following'vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura, Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL — 1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. Mr. Nakamura: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Council Chair Furfaro: Next resolution. Mr. Nakamura: Next resolution for approval is Resolution No. 2011 -40: Resolution No. 2011 -40, RESOLUTION CONFIRMING COUNCIL APPOINTMENT TO THE PUBLIC ACCESS, OPEN SPACE, AND NATURAL RESOURCES PRESERVATION FUND COMMISSION (Linda Akana Sproat): Mr. Bynum moved to approve Resolution No. 2011 -40, seconded by Ms. Yukimura, and carried by the following vote: FOR ADOPTION: Bynum, Chang, Kawakami, Nakamura, TOTAL — 6, Yukimura, Furfaro AGAINST ADOPTION: None TOTAL — 0, EXCUSED & NOT VOTING: Rapozo TOTAL -1, RECUSED & NOT VOTING: None TOTAL — 0. Mr. Nakamura: Six ayes, Mr. Chair. Council Chair Furfaro: I believe the next item on our agenda as posted we actually have three public hearings. The public hearing notices went out indicating that the public hearing would be convened at approximately 1:30 p.m., so that is our intent at this time to stay with the posting. Mr. Bynum: May I have a moment of personal privilege? Council Chair Furfaro: Certainly, certainly. Mr. Bynum: We're going to close the meeting? Before we close the meeting, I just wanted to say to people who watch these meetings, there's a lot of complex work to put together an agenda, you hear us asking staff to make reports and make questions. The business of the council is a complex matter and we're really well served by a wonderful staff, some of which are sitting over there. And I wanted to take a minute to recognize Stephanie Iwasaki, who has been with our staff for ... I don't know, before I was here, and I had the privilege of working with at in the administration in economic development because I believe this is her last meeting with us as she's taken a position with our county auditor, much to his joy, I'm sure. And I just wanted to recognize all of the staff, but Stephanie for all of the work that she's done here on behalf of the people of Kauai and we're very proud of her, and wish you good luck in your new endeavor. And you won't be that far away, so we'll still see you around. Thank you very much. COUNCIL MEETING -33- February 23, 2011 Council Chair Furfaro: On that note, I am going ahead and end the formal meeting for today. We'll be back at 1:30 p.m. for public hearing and we do have a certificate after that, so. Thank you, everyone. ADJOURNMENT. There being no further business, the meeting was adjourned at 10:39 a.m. /wa Respectfully submitted, '�K PETER A. NAKAMURA County Clerk ATTACHMENT N0. 1 February 23, 2011 FLOOR AMENDMENT INTRODUCED BY: NADINE NAKAMURA, COUNCILMEMBER RE: RESOLUTION NO 2011 -37, CONFIRMING MAYORAL APPOINTMENT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION AMEND RESOLUTION 2011 -37 IN ITS ENTIRETY TO READ AS FOLLOWS: SECTION 1. Resolution No. 2011 -37, Section 1, is hereby amended as follows: "SECTION 1. Pursuant to Section 23.02 of the Kauai County Charter, the Kauai County Council hereby approves the following mayoral appointment as follows: PLANNING COMMISSION (3 -Year Term) Term Expires: Wayne Kazuo Katayama 12/31/2013 (Business) SECTION 2. This resolution shall take effect upon its approval. SECTION 3. The County Clerk shall transmit a copy of this resolution to the Office of Boards and Commissions and to the Planning Department for appropriate distribution." (Material to be deleted is bracketed. Material to be added is underscored)